libera/##covid-19/ Wednesday, 2020-03-11

ubLIXis it progressing or has it been stable?00:00
romarehttps://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/coronavirus-infected-minster-nadine-dorries-had-been-in-no-10-c3sjs5kmp00:01
wormfarmi had a lung scare last november tinwhiskers 00:01
wormfarmantibiotics wouldn't make it go away but eventually it went away when i started taking some asthma meds00:01
tinwhiskersIt's pretty stable, ubLIX.00:04
tinwhiskerswormfarm: yeah, I was hoping I might get something like that the last time I visited the doctor but he wasn't really one to discuss the matter with.00:05
wormfarmoh ok00:05
LjLtinwhiskers, was he basically just like "you have nothing, get over it"?00:06
tinwhiskersyeah00:06
LjLmm00:06
ubLIXoh you haven't had an opportunity to try a salbutamol inhaler?00:06
tinwhiskersno, nothing. They gave me an ECG because I said chest pains and then some antibiotics when that was fine.00:07
skyofdustI've seen people get their lungs damaged by stomach acid while they sleep00:08
tinwhiskerslast time they gave me some paracetamol00:08
skyofdustBecause of reflux00:08
tinwhiskersI see. I don't get reflux these days00:08
LjLi have reflux, i wonder if what i cough up (and the fact i cough in the first place) is caused by it, but now i've been on a PPI for quite a while and it's not changing00:08
skyofdustOh these people I'm talking about didn't realize they were having reflux because it was when they were sleeping.00:09
tinwhiskersLjL: you know I'm not one for folk medicine but I swear ginger made a huge difference to me when I was getting reflux00:09
ubLIXhope you respond to exercise well. getting your lungs moving as much as possible without over-taxing yourself will probably help (keeping mindful of chest pains ofc)00:10
ubLIXdrink your own weight in water every 45 seconds etc :p00:10
LjLtinwhiskers, i'm taking ginger-containing pills nominally for digestion (before dinner), there's some decent evidence about it i think, not so much directly for reflux maybe, but if you take six hours to digest, that's also more time for acid to come back up00:10
tinwhiskersubLIX: ok. I'm really rather sedate here. It's so damn hot that any cardio is miserable. I'll try some cardio though and see if that helps over the next week.00:11
LjLalso ginger infusion before breakfast, actually00:11
tinwhiskersnice00:11
LjLat least it tastes good even if it doesn't help00:12
LjL"what does a monkey know of the taste of ginger" is apparently an indian saying00:12
tinwhiskersI would chew on crystallised ginger and drink proper ginger beer mostly. When I stopped doing it a couple of times my reflux came back within a few days00:12
tinwhiskersit appeared like a cut-and-dry effect but I can't rule out coincidence00:13
ryouman=1 ginger can be useful for mild gastroparesis.  reflux can be a symptom of gastroparesis.00:13
tinwhiskersStill, ginger is delicious, so no harm.00:13
skyofdustI just munch on a pair of chewable anti acid tablets or even pepto when nothing else works.00:13
tinwhiskersantacid tablets may relieve symptoms but can make the problem worse00:14
LjLryouma, no idea if i have gastroparesis, but i always did take a very long time to digest (had a gastroscopy when i was young, and the doctors asked my parents like "have you not followed the fasting directions?!" because i still had tons of stuff in my stomach)... but the reflux itself is also explained by the fact that the gastroscopy also clearly shows a faulty valve00:15
ubLIXtinwhiskers: i have a 5-year history of asthma at this point. i'm only early 40's so i can expect to tolerate reasonably rigorous exercise with some impunity. my experience has often been that a good bout of cardio is like an equivalent to a shot of the salbutamol inhaler for clearing lungs. anecdatum for you00:15
tinwhiskersI used to take them a lot too before I "discovered ginger" :-)00:15
tinwhiskersubLIX: ok. noted. thanks00:15
LjLtinwhiskers, i mostly take antacids when i actually have an obvious episode, which is not so often, because i probably have the "silent reflux" sort of thing mostly... had sore throat and ear issues for ages, before an ENT gave me something that's legally a supplement, but really it's just something that mechanically coats your throat to make any reflux have lesser effects... after that, the throat problems mostly subsided00:16
ubLIXobv listen to your body, don't push through undue fatigue00:16
tinwhiskersI need to do some track cutting that I've been putting off due to fatigue. That gets me panting pretty quickly. I'll do a short session on that.00:17
ubLIXi'm going to guess that half an hour of moderate pace (say, no more effort than 5% over comfort) is going to be better than 5 minutes of over-intensity. anyway this caution is the sort of thing i do when i'm ill but think respiratory/cardio effort might help get everything moving again00:24
python476o/00:25
LjLi can't read this without registering but fwiw https://www.nytimes.com/2020/03/10/world/europe/italy-coronavirus-movement-restrictions.html i just heard similar from an infectivologist on tv00:25
LjLattempt #1: "we're all gonna die, at least in lombardy" italians: "who gives a damn, we're going to ski" attempt #2: "no really, we're ALL gonna die" italians: "oh shit i'm hoarding groceries and then locking me inside"00:26
LjLi can't read the article but i sure do know which church that is ;(00:26
BrainstormNew from CNBC Health at 23:21 UTC: Coronavirus response hurt by lack of funding for public health labs, CDC director tells Congress: Lack of funding has hampered the federal government's response to the coronavirus outbreak, the head of the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention told lawmakers Tuesday. → https://is.gd/2sZE4a00:27
tinwhiskersLjL: Weird you can't read it. I don't need to register. If it doesn't work in a private window you can read it all in the html source code00:29
yuttle[m]Chloroquine is proving to be very helpful for affected ppl00:29
LjLtinwhiskers, i won't bother, when it's something REALLY important i can just get ubLIX to pastebin it, this one is just going to say things i know00:29
skyofdustLjL what is the italian media saying about that?00:29
tinwhiskershttps://pastebin.com/PWRSFB7600:30
LjLskyofdust, well as i said an infectivologist on tv was just saying pretty much the same thing. currently italian media and authorities are debating whether to take even stricter measures (the governor of Lombardy at least wants to), but this infectivologist pointed out that he has been sitting there for quite a while and not seen a single car go by, so perhaps we can consider the current measures effective00:30
LjLtinwhiskers, lol okay, thanks00:31
LjL"People lined up outside supermarkets, where only a few shoppers were allowed in at a time so that the decree’s social distance rules could be observed." ← this is a bit of an issue00:32
LjLpeople are still not respecting useful distances *outside* of the supermarkets...00:32
wormfarminfectivologist00:32
tinwhiskersIs the public transport crammed as full of people as usual?00:32
python476I just came back from delivery00:33
python476I should bring a sanitizer with me00:33
skyofdustAnyone knows if spit can work to sanitize in an emergency?00:34
skyofdustIt sure works with other pathogens.00:34
LjLtinwhiskers, most likely not, but i'm not going to check. last time i did use it, well before any restrictive measures were taken, it was already much emptier than usual00:34
tinwhiskersah. ok00:34
LjLtinwhiskers, but still, as long as people still have to go to work, people will still be using public transport, and i don't think it takes many of them to continue spreading the infection00:34
tinwhiskersyeah00:34
LjLalso00:35
LjL%cases italy00:35
BrainstormLjL: In all areas, Italy, there are 10149 cases, 631 deaths (6.2% of cases), 1004 recoveries as of Wed Mar 11 00:24:00 2020. See https://offloop.net/covid19/?default=Italy for time series data.00:35
LjLdidn't realize we had passed 10k00:35
tinwhiskersskyofdust: I'm pretty sure your spit will be full of the virus, so no. After all throat swabs are one way of testing for the virus.00:36
LjLwait, what00:37
LjLwho even00:37
skyofdustMaybe salt water then?00:38
tinwhiskersno00:38
RougeRLjL, 00:39
RougeRgoddamnit00:40
RougeRyou italians fucked us hahaha00:40
LjLi'd say salt water is preferrable to spit, but i don't know how much preferable00:40
RougeRjersey has its first confirmed case00:40
RougeRtravelled from italty00:40
RougeRtravelled from italty00:40
RougeRtravelled from ital00:41
RougeRffs00:41
LjLyou can do it00:41
RougeRI T A L Y00:41
RougeRim a bit drunl00:41
RougeR-______-00:41
skyofdustThere was some paper around these channels a few days ago, about mask alternatives, one of the alternatives included a salt-infused filter.00:41
LjLyes let the alcohol disinfect your throat00:41
RougeRhehe00:41
skyofdustThat's why I ask.00:41
LjLskyofdust, there was a paper around salt as a filter but it was WAY over my head to understand00:42
LjLbut i assume it's probably going to work very differently from salty water00:42
saidi[m]https://www.asbmb.org/asbmb-today/science/020620/could-an-old-malaria-drug-help-fight-the-new-coron00:42
LjLyes, chlorequine holds some promise00:43
LjLlet's not jump the guns and take it please, it's kinda dangerous00:43
LjLjust saying :P00:43
RougeRLjL, are you following: https://www.youtube.com/user/Campbellteaching/videos00:44
LjLRougeR, hm no can't say i have apart from a couple00:44
saidi[m]https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S221138352030299900:44
RougeRLjL, he da best00:44
RougeRmvp source00:44
LjLit's pretty disappointing so many italians ended up infected/infecting abroad... many europeans will blame us for it now, even though in the big european countries it was already evolving without our help00:45
tinwhiskersskyofdust: yes, that works because it's using dry salt crystals. When droplets hit the salt it turns to a liquid then as it recrystallises the crystal formation physically destroys the virus. That doesn't occur in liquid salt.00:45
tinwhiskersIt also probably doesn't work in humid locations and if it gets wet it's useless.00:46
LjLtinwhiskers, so... best not to breathe on it?00:47
LjLbreath is kinda wet ;(00:47
tinwhiskerslol. yeah, that's a good plan.00:47
tinwhiskersThe salt crystal mask thing looks like a really good idea actually. It allows you to use the same mask again00:47
tinwhiskersOh, I see. Hrm. perhaps00:47
tinwhiskersI don't think it got beyond the lab00:48
LjLtinwhiskers, i'm starting to think i'll use the same mask multiple times anyway ;( that's what happens when they lie to us, now i don't believe the rest of their advice either00:48
tinwhiskerswell, they say you're better using no mask than reusing one00:48
LjLthey also said it's better to use no mask than to use one, unless you're sick or caring for a sick person00:49
RougeRLjL, you got vit d?00:49
LjLand i think i have learned enough at this point to opine that they're either wrong, or lying00:49
tinwhiskersyeah. fair. that's puzzling00:49
LjLRougeR, yeah00:49
RougeRsmash it00:50
RougeRimma get some tommorow00:50
LjLi take the normal daily dose, apparently that's what's kind of effective anyway00:50
RougeRi mean in uk we dont see sun for weeks00:50
RougeRim ginger too lol00:50
RougeRi gotta avoid sun 00:50
LjLyeah the NHS actually advise for *everyone* to take it in the winter months00:50
RougeRnoic00:50
LjLthe CDC advises against it00:50
RougeRwut00:50
LjLthe italian SSN... who even knows or cares00:50
tinwhiskersVitamin D *deficiency* may may you more likely to become infected. "Smashing it" won't decrease your chances.00:51
LjLhowever little it may help with COVID-19, we certainly aren't going to get much sun if we can't leave our homes now00:51
RougeRtinwhiskers, nah gotta *SMASH* that like buttn00:52
LjLtinwhiskers, deficiency is quite common though, so it may be a good idea to be taking it now00:52
RougeR/s00:52
tinwhiskersfair00:52
RougeRLjL, agreed as people isolate more00:52
RougeRtinwhiskers, nah i know what you are saying00:53
BrainstormNew from CNBC Health at 23:44 UTC: (news): Coronavirus live updates: UK minister tests positive, Turkey confirms first case → https://is.gd/vJeQ1c00:55
BirossoBlimey.00:56
RougeR fingers crossed!00:58
RougeRhoping we can wipe out some tories00:58
RougeRalso lol turkey is SEETHING with ncov1900:59
RougeRit wont be its first case00:59
LjLRougeR, they made a big deal out of it, with the minister of health making himself awaited at his press conference01:06
LjLi guess maybe they're starting to condition people to accept it's suddenly much bigger01:06
LjLlike, i still have the TRT Haber stream going from earlier, and it's still talking about the coronavirus now01:07
LjLshowing some hand sanitizing01:07
LjLsome hand washing01:07
LjLsome... face disinfecting, apparently01:08
Brainstorm🔶 World: +33 cases (now 134750), +14 recoveries (now 68008) 🔸 Argentina: +2 cases (now 19) 🔸 Hong Kong SAR: +2 cases (now 120), +5 recoveries (now 65) 🔸 Hong Kong, Hong Kong SAR: +2 cases (now 120), +5 recoveries (now 65) 🔸 Mainland China: +4 recoveries (now 60124) 🔸 Chongqing, Mainland China: +5 recoveries (now 547) 🔸 Shanxi, Mainland China: +3 recoveries (now 131) 🔸 U.A.E.: +29 cases (now 74), +5 recoveries 01:08
oxalisWhat’s new in the last 4 hours?01:08
BrainstormNew from CNBC Health at 00:07 UTC: (news): Coronavirus live updates: Australia announces massive health package, UK minister tests positive → https://is.gd/vJeQ1c01:09
LjLmostly just the thing Brainstorm keeps repeating including now, unless you missed the "first" case in Turkey also01:10
dunnpugh classes not canceled yet01:14
dunnpnot sure why the US is not being proactive about this01:15
contingoI can't stop sneezing01:16
LjLsame reason as almost no other country has been, i guess, dunnp. denial and/or economy-first01:16
LjLcontingo, this cold is being a bit long isn't it01:16
contingoit's ridic01:16
contingoI guess I will cancel my on-campus things01:17
dunnpI've also had a cold for almost 2 weeks now01:17
contingobut it's very frustrating01:17
LjLi wonder if experiencing the 1918 flu was anything similar to this01:22
LjLmedia were obviously different, and they had also just barely got out of a war01:23
LjLlooks like most of the supposedly-earthquake tweets my bot is screening now are about earthquakes *and* coronavirus01:26
LjL%tr <tr corona var deprem var ne bakıyon01:26
BrainstormLjL, Turkish to English: Corona, earthquake, what's up? (MyMemory, Google)01:26
tinwhiskersI think the war was still going when the pandemic broke out because there were all sorts of horror stories about soldiers being shipped around like cattle01:26
LjLi could find some good reassuring book to read about it01:27
LjLor i could read my grandpa's ww2 diary instead, since it's been sitting there for a while and if i don't hurry up i may be dead before i get a chance to read it01:28
oxalisSpeaking of corneas https://v.redd.it/e3om26i70vl4101:28
contingothere are quite a few articles contrasting the two01:28
tinwhiskersTo maintain morale, wartime censors minimized early reports of illness and mortality in Germany, the United Kingdom, France, and the United States.[10][11] Papers were free to report the epidemic's effects in neutral Spain (such as the grave illness of King Alfonso XIII).[12] These stories created a false impression of Spain as especially hard hit,[13] giving rise to the pandemic's nickname, "Spanish flu". 01:29
tinwhiskershuh. well, interesting01:29
LjLoxalis, i don't even want to click01:29
LjLalso who was speaking of corneas anyway ;(01:30
oxalisOops a touch of dyslexia. Corona != cornea01:31
LjLabout 70 people escaped from prison here (well, in the south) yesterday, i think most were caught again though. but widespread riots in the prisons are a little concerning01:31
oxalisItaly?01:31
LjLyeah01:31
oxalisYou’re Italian?01:31
tinwhiskersYeah, would suck to be detained and not allowed freedom of movement... oh, wait.01:31
LjLyeah01:31
oxalisAwesome01:32
LjLtinwhiskers, heh... no, the riots began because the emergency law forbade any visits01:32
LjLbut... like... that's mainly to protect *them*01:32
tinwhiskersoh, yeah, I remember reading that now01:32
oxalisI made it to Italy once. I found Milan to be the most musical cityscape01:32
LjLvisits to nursing homes are also forbidden, but i'm not aware of all the gran's rioting01:32
tinwhiskersheh01:33
LjLoxalis, musical? that's a weird term for a cityscape01:33
tinwhiskersmaybe some form of synaesthesia?01:34
Spectinwhiskers: something's up with south korea / republic of korea01:35
oxalisI mean we opened the apartment window in the mornings and evenings and all the sounds is the city : the trains, traffic, distant bells pealing... I swear as a musician it sounded like music01:35
oxalisPerhaps “soundscape” would have been a better word01:36
LjLthat should make Birosso want to come here... or... not01:36
tinwhiskersSpec: Ah. Looks like they've changed to name from South Korea to Republic of Korea and it's mucked something up. I'll check it out01:36
LjLoxalis, the trains where i live are more vibration than sound01:36
Spectinwhiskers: thanks :)01:37
oxalisOur apartment was next to the station so we heard brakes squeal and announcements on the loudspeaker01:37
LjLtinwhiskers, that achieves at least two purposes, making life busier for you so you have to worry less about the coronavirus, and making it clearly less confusing whether they're referring to north or south korea01:37
LjLoxalis, you must be a bit of a masochist to like the sound of those damned Trenitalia brakes01:38
LjLoil them, ffs01:38
LjLi have tinnitus i swear i could stab whoever doesn't maintain trains01:38
yuttle[m]https://www.businessinsider.com/inmates-riot-escape-from-italian-prisons-amid-coronavirus-restrictions-2020-3?op=101:39
oxalisAll the sounds mingled as I have never heard and they were truly melodic.01:39
yuttle[m]> Six prisoners also broke into an infirmary where they overdosed on methadone and died.01:39
yuttle[m]> 01:39
yuttle[m]jesus 01:39
yuttle[m]> At least 50 inmates escaped from an Italian prison between Sunday and Monday as tension over sweeping coronavirus restrictions triggered riots in 27 prisons across the country.01:41
yuttle[m]Dont blame them at all01:41
tinwhiskershrm. John Hopkins have renamed "South Korea" to "Republic of Korea" but have lost all the time series data somehow01:41
tinwhiskersoh, ignore me. they have both. This will take some fiddling01:42
LjLoh good grief this matrix bridge can be terrible01:43
python476funny reminder that the web doesnt forget https://old.reddit.com/r/videos/comments/fg8aer/4_years_ago_bill_gates_talks_about_how_a_global/01:43
LjLthree link posts for a message edit :(01:43
LjLpython476, but the web (part of it anyway) is now blaming him for causing it01:47
python476LjL of course01:53
python476angry nerds turning villains01:53
python476bill gates is punishing us for not buying windows anymore01:54
tinwhiskersOh, crud. They've renamed Iran as well01:54
LjLis it Persia now01:54
LjLpython476, as if i ever did buy it01:55
tinwhiskersIran (Islamic Republic)01:55
tinwhiskersYou'd think they could just rename it, but no, they started a second series continuing where the old one stopped01:55
LjLas opposed to... the other Iran?01:55
LjLsigh01:55
LjLso wait01:56
LjL%cases south korea01:56
Brainstorm🔶 World: +2 cases (now 134752), +32 recoveries (now 68040) 🔶 Mainland China: +2 cases (now 80763), +36 recoveries (now 60156) 🔸 Argentina: +2 cases (now 19) 🔸 Hong Kong SAR: +2 cases (now 120), +5 recoveries (now 65) 🔸 Hong Kong, Hong Kong SAR: +2 cases (now 120), +5 recoveries (now 65) 🔸 Chongqing, Mainland China: +5 recoveries (now 547) 🔸 Guangxi, Mainland China: +3 recoveries (now 237) 🔸 Heilongjiang, Mai01:56
LjL... and wait more01:56
BrainstormLjL: In all areas, South Korea, there are 7513 cases, 53 deaths (0.7% of cases), 247 recoveries as of Wed Mar 11 01:45:00 2020. See https://offloop.net/covid19/?default=South%20Korea for time series data.01:56
LjLthis won't even work anymore if it's called "Republic of Korea"01:56
tinwhiskersWell, other sites are still calling it South Korea so it gets even messier01:57
tinwhiskersI guess I'll rename anything referring to South Korea to the new name assuming they will follow John Hopkins lead01:58
dunnpor ask them to switch it back?01:58
yuttle[m]Did NK and SK merge? ffs 2020 is wild01:59
LjLthey were never officially called either01:59
LjLbut gee what a pain in the ass01:59
LjLwe're having a pandemic and people are still nitpicking on country names02:00
dunnpor throw in some regex?02:00
tinwhiskersyeah, that's what I'm doing then but then I end up with two series with the same name and one is clomping the other. I just need to change the way this works a bit.02:00
BrainstormNew from BBC Health at 00:50 UTC: Coronavirus: Health minister Nadine Dorries tests positive: Nadine Dorries, the first MP to test positive, is one of 382 confirmed cases in the UK. → https://is.gd/ZetBU602:04
LjLtinwhiskers, looks like Taiwan was also changed to "Taipei and environs"02:13
LjLthis is pretty dumb02:13
LjLis the WHO running JHU?02:13
tinwhiskersIt's pretty dumb they started a second series instead of just renaming it02:14
tinwhiskersrenaming would have been easy to handle02:14
tinwhiskersit might just be that someone made a mistake and it will be corrected, but that could take a while02:15
Brainstorm🔶 World: +17 cases (now 134769), +1350 recoveries (now 69390) 🔶 Mainland China: +14 cases (now 80777), +1325 recoveries (now 61481) 🔸 Argentina: +2 cases (now 19) 🔸 Egypt: +25 recoveries (now 26) 🔸 Hong Kong SAR: +2 cases (now 120), +5 recoveries (now 65) 🔸 Hong Kong, Hong Kong SAR: +2 cases (now 120), +5 recoveries (now 65) 🔸 Beijing, Mainland China: +6 cases (now 435), +6 recoveries (now 326) 🔸 Henan, Main02:15
LjLtinwhiskers, no trust me, it's pretty dumb to call Taiwan "Taipei and environs" too in the first place02:16
tinwhiskersheh. yeah02:16
BrainstormNew from CNBC Health at 01:06 UTC: (news): Coronavirus live updates: China reports 22 additional deaths, Italy cases top 10,000 → https://is.gd/vJeQ1c02:18
yuttle[m]No official word from UK govt, but it appears interstates may be in the process of shutting down02:18
LjLO.O02:19
LjLhave they suddenly realized they have many more cases than they thought, or02:19
isbvm[m]how did you spot this?02:19
LjLare they actually being proactive, or02:19
yuttle[m]friend of a friend02:19
LjLis this a knee-jerk reaction to the health ministry getting sick, just like italy's initial reaction was to the PD leader getting sick02:20
commandocrypto[m:Ɑ ya that's .... not normal02:21
astraliam[m]there are still diversions around them,02:22
yuttle[m]looks to me they are in the process02:22
LjLyuttle[m], i am not seeing those closures on my google maps though02:22
LjLoh, nevermind02:23
LjLneeded to zoom in a bit further02:23
isbvm[m]not seeing anything on waze and can see cars going by02:25
isbvm[m]anywhere with a particularly obvious blockage?02:25
yuttle[m]possible google is putting this up in anticipation?02:26
Brainstorm🔶 World: +250 cases (now 135019), +41 recoveries (now 69431) 🔶 South Korea: +242 cases (now 7755), +41 recoveries (now 288) 🔸 Argentina: +2 cases (now 19) 🔸 Egypt: +25 recoveries (now 26) 🔸 Hong Kong SAR: +2 cases (now 120), +5 recoveries (now 65) 🔸 Hong Kong, Hong Kong SAR: +2 cases (now 120), +5 recoveries (now 65) 🔸 Mainland China: +1 cases (now 80778) 🔸 Panama: +7 cases (now 8)02:26
commandocrypto[mstopping the motorways and the trains might be the smartest thing the UK could do right now02:27
LjLrather unexpected though, considering Germany and France haven't done anything like that and the UK has fewer cases02:28
commandocrypto[mthe continent looks like it's circling the drain as we speak02:28
LjLi'm keeping an eye on BBC102:28
commandocrypto[mfrance also confisticated everyone's ppe. i'm pretty sure macron and merkel are both part of some kinda death cult02:29
LjLthat doesn't seem so unwarranted given the speculation with masks in italy which is now lacking them for health workers02:29
yuttle[m]im personally not convinced the health care system will completely collapse so keeping health care workers able to care seems like the right decision. At the same time, confiscating ppe from citizens is draconian af and something i dont aggree with02:31
BrainstormNew from BBC Health at 01:25 UTC: Coronavirus: Health minister Nadine Dorries tests positive: Nadine Dorries, the first MP to test positive, is one of 382 confirmed cases in the UK. → https://is.gd/ZetBU602:32
isbvm[m]ppe?02:32
LjLpersonal protective equipment02:32
isbvm[m]ah02:32
LjLmasks and googles and gloves etc02:32
LjLgoggles02:32
commandocrypto[mhttps://www.thesun.co.uk/news/11137090/brits-face-coronavirus-lockdown-italy/02:32
commandocrypto[m> Checkpoints on motorways, toll booths, train stations and airports are expected to be introduced on Tuesday. Dr Jenny Harris, deputy chief medical officer, fears thousands of Brits will be infected over the next week. She said: "The chief medical officer and chief scientific adviser say there's likely to be more cases.02:32
yuttle[m]Dang02:33
yuttle[m]15min leadtime02:33
yuttle[m]guess it makes sense google knows before us02:33
commandocrypto[mthe sun posted that 17 hours ago but no one i know had noticed02:34
yuttle[m]oh well there ya go02:35
Birrosso%cases Egypt02:35
BrainstormBirrosso: In all areas, Egypt, there are 59 cases, 1 deaths (1.7% of cases), 26 recoveries as of Wed Mar 11 02:30:00 2020. See https://offloop.net/covid19/?default=Egypt for time series data.02:35
BrainstormBirrosso: Mortality can be broadly expected to lie between 0.6% (assuming deaths/cases with ⅔ of cases undetected), and less than 3.6% (considering only deaths and recoveries).02:35
LjLcommandocrypto[m, that line from the Sun is about Italy though...02:35
IronY%data canada02:38
BrainstormIronY: In all areas, Canada, there are 94 cases, 1 deaths (1.1% of cases), 8 recoveries as of Wed Mar 11 02:30:00 2020. See https://offloop.net/covid19/?default=Canada for time series data.02:38
IronYthere getting better info then John Hopkins02:39
IronY"Because the John Hopkins data is only updated after the end of each day, interim non-authoritative data is also included for the current day and may be viewed by turning on the "Include latest non-authoritative data" checkbox. These values will increase over the course of the day and may be misleading. Use with caution." gotcha02:40
commandocrypto[mLjL: oh ya hrm ... sry. my reading comprehension goes to zero on that website which is kinda too bad because sometimes it's the best (or at least the first) sauce for some things02:40
Birrosso#cases Italy02:41
Birrosso%ases Italy02:41
BirrossoDAMN IT!02:41
Birrosso%Cases Italy02:41
BrainstormBirrosso: In all areas, Italy, there are 10149 cases, 631 deaths (6.2% of cases), 1004 recoveries as of Wed Mar 11 02:30:00 2020. See https://offloop.net/covid19/?default=Italy for time series data.02:41
IronY%cases ottawa02:41
BrainstormIronY: Sorry, ottawa not found. Either there aren't cases, or it's under a different name.02:41
IronY%cases toronto02:42
BrainstormIronY: Sorry, toronto not found. Either there aren't cases, or it's under a different name.02:42
IronY%cases canada toronto02:42
BrainstormIronY: Sorry, canada toronto not found. Either there aren't cases, or it's under a different name.02:42
LjLtry in PM02:42
BirrossoWait, did Italy increase by almost 300 in one day?02:42
LjL%cases ontario02:42
BrainstormLjL: In Ontario, Canada, there are 36 cases, 0 deaths (0.0% of cases), 4 recoveries as of Tue Mar 10 18:13:32 2020. See https://offloop.net/covid19/?default=Ontario for time series data.02:42
IronYLjL: Yeah they switched it 2 days ago02:42
LjLBirrosso, what, cases? no, they increased by more02:42
IronYCanada stopped reporting by city to these stat places02:42
BirrossoDeaths.02:42
LjLBirrosso, no i think it was about 16002:42
BirrossoWeren't we at 300 something yesterday/02:42
BirrossoHmm02:42
LjLafraid not02:42
LjLBirrosso, but the *cases* are probably being underestimated now, there was some glitch with the test results today02:43
IronYBirrosso: you may be thinking of Ontario Califronia?02:43
LjLso 6.2% looking even scarier than usual may go back down somewhat again i guess02:43
BirrossoIronY: No.02:43
LjLthe UK almost seems to have fewer motorways than Italy, incidentally02:48
LjL"South Korean officials have shared their experiences in containing the outbreak, saying that citywide lockdowns, as imposed by China in Wuhan, where the outbreak originated, are difficult to enforce in an open society."03:11
LjLSpec, guess we just have to turn into a closed society then :D03:11
Specbut they've been successful anyways?03:12
LjLyeah03:13
LjL"The importance of maintaining good hygiene has also been stressed. South Koreans seldom leave their homes without wearing a face mask, with many buildings putting up signs reading “No Masks, No Entry”. Restaurant workers and retail staff wear masks while serving customers."03:13
LjLwhile the WHO still tells us not to wear masks03:13
LjLi kind of wonder WHO they're working for03:13
BrainstormNew from CNBC Health at 02:10 UTC: (news): People are stealing hand sanitizer and surgical masks from doctors' offices because of coronavirus fears → https://is.gd/NVOAEE03:13
LjL"Covid-19 tests are prohibitively expensive in many countries but in South Korea, all tests are free. The country is also capable of processing up to 15,000 diagnostic tests a day, and the aggregate number of tests has reached almost 200,000."03:15
Brainstorm🔶 World: +248 cases (now 135267), +17 recoveries (now 69409) 🔶 Republic of Korea: +242 cases (now 7755) 🔸 Alberta, Canada: +7 cases (now 14) 🔸 British Columbia, Canada: +7 cases (now 39) 🔸 China: +1 cases (now 80955), +17 recoveries (now 61551) 🔸 Guangdong, China: +8 recoveries (now 1282) 🔸 Jiangxi, China: +5 recoveries (now 932) 🔸 Shandong, China: +1 cases (now 759), +2 recoveries (now 721) 🔸 Zhejiang, C03:21
SpecLjL: too bad about that global mask shortage?03:22
LjLSpec, except they somehow have them, and so chinese03:23
Specas far as i understand, china makes many of the masks03:23
LjLSpec, to be fair china is supposed to be sending us one million masks (surgical) and 100k "high technology" (n95 or so i guess)03:23
LjLwhich is only fair since we sent them masks before03:23
LjLour EU neighbors on the other hand are requisitioning their production and banning exports :P03:23
Specdo they have enough production?03:24
yuriwhohmm, British Health Minister tested positive03:26
LjLSpec, probably not03:26
LjLyuriwho, and coincidentally, the whole UK motorway network appears to be subject to closures on Google Maps03:26
yuriwhowow03:26
LjLyuriwho, it reminds me a bit of how Italy implemented lockdown after the leader of a majority party tested positive03:27
LjLSpec, yuriwho: potentially not so very good news for Italy... our ISS has somehow established that the Italian clusters originated from someone from Iran, although they haven't established the entire chain of contacts. now i know the virus is supposedly similar to the variety in Germany, but somehow both Iran and Italy seem to be taking a much worse toll than other countries03:28
LjL%tr Sono stati diagnosticati 583casi tra operatori sanitari, indicando la possibilità di trasmissione  nosocomiale  dell’infezione.Questo  dato  potrebbe  essere sottostimato in quanto per una parte dei casi, soprattutto quelli diagnosticati più recentemente, non è stata ancora completata l’indagine epidemiologica03:30
BrainstormLjL, Italian to English: 583 cases have been diagnosed among healthcare professionals, indicating the possibility of nosocomial transmission of the infection. This figure could be underestimated because for a part of the cases, especially those diagnosed more recently, the epidemiological investigation has not yet been completed (MyMemory) [... want %more?]03:31
tinwhiskersSpec: OK, that takes care of merging the data for the four series that changed (Hong Kong SAR, Republic of South Korea, Iran (Islamic Republic of), Taipei and environs)) for the time series graphs, but there's still a few issues with the "non-authoritatic data" so LjL might expect a few things to break in the near future :-)03:31
tinwhiskers*non-authoritative03:31
LjLtinwhiskers, you may expect me to be sleeping in the near future, so maybe just expect the bot to be broken :P03:32
tinwhiskersI'll try to minimise it :-)03:32
contingowhat is happen03:33
tinwhiskersAlso noteworthy is that South Korea has a *decline* in recovered cases. Presumably a correction.03:33
Spectinwhiskers: nice :)03:34
tinwhiskerscontingo: John Hopkins renamed some series but instead of just renaming them they made new series starting from today and left the older data under the old name so it broke stuff03:35
contingoright03:35
contingoOK, I was reacting to UK motorways closure rumor, but I don't think it's happening03:35
tinwhiskersoh. right.03:37
LjLit seems unlikely, it could just be that glitches that happen on things like google maps would normally be ignored but now you see them and you're like "?!"03:37
LjL%cases south korea03:38
BrainstormLjL: In all areas, South Korea, there are 7755 cases, 53 deaths (0.7% of cases), 288 recoveries as of Wed Mar 11 03:20:00 2020. See https://offloop.net/covid19/?default=South%20Korea for time series data.03:38
LjL%cases republic of korea03:38
BrainstormLjL: In all areas, Republic of Korea, there are 7755 cases, 54 deaths (0.7% of cases), 247 recoveries as of Wed Mar 11 03:18:14 2020. See https://offloop.net/covid19/?default=Republic%20of%20Korea for time series data.03:38
fructosehttps://github.com/CSSEGISandData/COVID-19/issues/40503:40
isbvm[m]what's the deal with people getting reinfected / dying after "recovering"?03:40
BrainstormNew from CNBC Health at 02:39 UTC: (news): Coronavirus live updates: China reports 22 additional deaths, Italy cases top 10,000 → https://is.gd/vJeQ1c03:41
LjLisbvm[m], wish i knew03:41
LjLtinwhiskers, see the issue fructose linked03:41
tinwhiskersAh, thanks fructose and LjL. I guess we'll just deal with whatever they decide tomorrow or so03:42
fructoseisbvm[m]: My guess would be infection of the central nervous system, but I'm no medical doctor03:42
isbvm[m]classic guardian 👀03:45
fructoseA previous coronavirus... https://pediatrics.aappublications.org/content/pediatrics/113/1/e73.full.pdf03:45
LjLfructose, i just hope these are rare and isolated cases :\03:47
LjLbecause it's a nightmare scenario within a nightmare scenario to think of widespread CNS involvement in most/all patients03:48
fructoseLjL: Likewise, I've been worried about it creating a chronic disease even after initial recovery03:49
fructoseBut that's worst-case thinking03:49
LjLi'm good at that03:49
ryoumafructose: this has ben a concern since the beginning even if it is not specifically caysing such.  m.e. gets started from many sources.03:52
LjL_stay_safeHello.03:52
ryoumaincluding ordinary flu03:52
ryoumathen nobody recovers03:52
ryoumawhat neur symptoms03:54
Spectinwhiskers: yo03:54
tinwhiskershey03:54
Spectinwhiskers: i'm super concerned we have zombies in japan03:54
tinwhiskerslol03:54
Specwhat gives? do you know?03:55
tinwhiskersI see03:55
tinwhiskersJohn Hopkins are reorganising their data03:55
LjL%cases india03:55
BrainstormLjL: In all areas, India, there are 62 cases, 0 deaths (0.0% of cases), 4 recoveries as of Wed Mar 11 03:47:00 2020. See https://offloop.net/covid19/?default=India for time series data.03:55
tinwhiskersI think I'll have to wait until they finish03:55
LjL%cases japan03:55
BrainstormLjL: In all areas, Japan, there are 587 cases, 10 deaths (1.7% of cases), 102 recoveries as of Wed Mar 11 03:47:00 2020. See https://offloop.net/covid19/?default=Japan for time series data.03:55
BrainstormLjL: Mortality can be broadly expected to lie between 0.6% (assuming deaths/cases with ⅔ of cases undetected), and less than 8.8% (considering only deaths and recoveries).03:55
Spectinwhiskers: yeah, likely related03:56
tinwhiskersThere03:56
tinwhiskersI also have a new country called Georgia with all the US states in it :-/03:56
Spechaha03:56
LjLthat's cruel and unusual03:56
ryoumathat is not proper social distancing03:57
tinwhiskersI think the realised doing all the counties might get a bit ridiculous03:57
Specyeah03:57
ryoumathe display is not accessible so i only see thefirst few letters03:58
LjLSpec, i wanted to recommend the (italian) seller of my new Walkman to a Walkman forum i'm on, but he said he's considering cancelling all his listing due to uncertainty about future availability of post/courier services :(04:00
LjL_stay_safeRip economy04:01
contingomy retrieving the barest of assessments  for you guys, "on the ground" in China,  from my more distant family, resulted in the fallout I feared04:18
contingonow being bombarded with fake news and conspiracy FUD vids from them via WhatsApp04:19
contingoso I consider that I took one for the team04:19
Specoh my04:20
Specare you sure it is fakenews and conspiracies?04:20
tinwhiskers heh04:21
BrainstormNew from Reddit WorldNews Live at 03:10 UTC: /u/slakmehl: Patricia Mazzei su Twitter: "The eight new Florida patients tonight bring the number of coronavirus cases in the United States to more than 1,000, according to our @nytimes database: https://t.co/8YE1Gdapxr… https://t.co/OifSFfoIKs" → https://is.gd/dXEGQl04:22
fructosecontingo: That's not so bad, it could have been TikTok04:23
LjLcontingo, so do they actually know anything about the practical situation outside of conspiracy theories they have enveloped themselves in?04:25
Brainstorm🔶 World: +37 cases (now 135304), +5 recoveries (now 69414) 🔸 Bosnia and Herzegovina: +2 cases (now 7) 🔸 Alberta, Canada: +7 cases (now 14) 🔸 British Columbia, Canada: +7 cases (now 39) 🔸 China: +1 cases (now 80955), +22 recoveries (now 61556) 🔸 Guangdong, China: +8 recoveries (now 1282) 🔸 Guizhou, China: +4 recoveries (now 133) 🔸 Jiangxi, China: +5 recoveries (now 932) 🔸 Shandong, China: +1 cases (now 759),04:28
contingoa lot of them are real news, footage of some actual, long-available press briefing concerning America-China corrupt business or espionage arrests and investigations, that in some cases have a connection with stuff in Wuhan (not the virus)04:28
contingobut the clip will be captioned IS CORONAVIRUS A BIOWEAPON04:28
LjLwell, time to sleep and find out if Britain is without a road network tomorrow04:29
contingoand some vital bit of info making clear whatever they're talking about has nothing to do with the virus, will be edited out04:30
contingolol fructose 04:30
contingome too LjL 04:30
LjLsuch very strange times04:30
LjLi don't actually mean to make an understatement but i don't know how to describe what's going on04:31
LjLi think the word is "pandemic" but the WHO says no04:31
Specwho knows best04:35
BrainstormNew from Reddit WorldNews Live at 03:35 UTC: /u/BlatantConservative: Two thirds of all active cases are now outside of China → https://is.gd/WvX9kT04:37
Brainstorm🔶 World: +42 cases (now 135346), +68 deaths (now 4646) 🔶 Iran: +54 deaths (now 291) 🔸 China: +1 cases (now 80956) 🔸 Taipei and environs, China: +1 cases (now 48) 🔸 Czech Republic: +22 cases (now 63) 🔸 Japan: +2 deaths (now 12) 🔸 Panama: +1 deaths (now 1) 🔸 South Korea: +8 deaths (now 61) 🔸 Spain: +1 deaths (now 36) 🔸 US: +19 cases (now 1020), +2 deaths (now 30) 🔸 Florida, US: +8 cases (now 28) 🔸 04:45
fructoseJust a fun reminder, it'll be down to close to zero within a couple of days: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eoJlNEmxf0w&t=187204:48
tinwhiskersfructose: phew. that's a relief.04:56
BrainstormNew from CNBC Health at 04:14 UTC: US coronavirus cases surpass 1,000, Johns Hopkins University data shows: There were just over 100 confirmed cases in the U.S. one week ago, on March 4, according to the World Health Organization. → https://is.gd/AXChZY05:22
BrainstormNew from CNBC Health at 04:26 UTC: (news): Coronavirus live updates: US cases cross 1,000, South Korea reports 242 new cases → https://is.gd/vJeQ1c05:36
Albright"Taipei and environs, China"05:43
AlbrightThe CCP appreciates your cooperation, Brainstorm.05:43
Albright%data taiwan05:43
BrainstormAlbright: In Taiwan, Taiwan, there are 45 cases, 1 deaths (2.2% of cases), 15 recoveries as of Wed Mar 11 01:05:03 2020. See https://offloop.net/covid19/?default=Taiwan for time series data.05:43
BrainstormAlbright: Mortality can be broadly expected to lie between 0.7% (assuming deaths/cases with ⅔ of cases undetected), and less than 5.9% (considering only deaths and recoveries).05:43
BrainstormNew from BBC Health at 04:47 UTC: Coronavirus: Health minister Nadine Dorries tests positive: Nadine Dorries, the first MP to test positive, is one of 382 confirmed cases in the UK. → https://is.gd/ZetBU605:49
swift110hmm05:51
IronYSo tired of reading about testing people05:53
IronYwe are we still testing people in areas of communal spread05:53
IronYso they get tested, test negative, contract it 2 mins later, and think there all good for 2 weeks05:53
IronYlogic I tell yeah05:53
swift110ph wow05:55
freebobby[m]would an italian be able to translate what going on here?05:57
freebobby[m]Besides them going ACAB 05:57
swift110wow05:57
Zalyssaugh I hate matrix06:08
freebobby[m]oh sorry if that fuqd ur chat06:09
swift110y06:15
BrainstormNew from CNBC Health at 05:15 UTC: Global coronavirus outbreak has 'exploded' and the aftermath could last a year, Singapore's foreign minister says: The new coronavirus has infected more than 110,000 people across at least 110 countries and territories, with over 4,000 deaths globally, according to the World Health Organization. → https://is.gd/xl9PzY06:17
bigfluff%data oregon06:18
Brainstormbigfluff: In OR, US, there are 12 cases, 0 deaths (0.0% of cases), 0 recoveries as of Tue Mar 10 20:13:21 2020. See https://offloop.net/covid19/?default=US for time series data.06:18
greyman%data turkey06:28
Brainstormgreyman: In all areas, Turkey, there are 1 cases, 0 deaths (0.0% of cases), 0 recoveries as of Wed Mar 11 04:33:05 2020. See https://offloop.net/covid19/?default=Turkey for time series data.06:28
IronYJust waiting for the WHO to announce weed cures coronavirus and the economy is saved by an investment in cheetos06:30
IronYthat be nice06:30
IronY*crosses fingers*06:30
BrainstormNew from CNBC Health at 05:17 UTC: (news): Coronavirus live updates: US cases cross 1,000, South Korea reports 242 new cases → https://is.gd/vJeQ1c06:31
AlbrightMy cancer, diabetes, and autism were cured by CBD oil tinctures06:31
bigfluffCBD is a beautiful creature06:32
swift110oh06:32
bigfluffTHC...I enjoy her more than I should too :)06:32
IronYI 100% guarantee someone out there is trying to cure them self with CBD right now06:33
AlbrightHomeopathic CBD oil06:35
AlbrightIt's water with no CBD in it and that makes the CBD even more powerful06:36
IronYI am assuming [m] is mobile06:36
AlbrightI think it's Matrix. Got some of those types over here.06:36
Poon%data vietnam06:55
BrainstormPoon: Sorry, vietnam not found. Either there aren't cases, or it's under a different name.06:55
Poon%data Vietnam06:55
BrainstormPoon: Sorry, Vietnam not found. Either there aren't cases, or it's under a different name.06:55
azbycxtwo words06:57
azbycxviet nam06:57
swift110lol06:57
Albright%data viet nam06:58
BrainstormAlbright: In all areas, Viet Nam, there are 31 cases, 0 deaths (0.0% of cases), 16 recoveries as of Tue Mar 10 20:13:21 2020. See https://offloop.net/covid19/?default=Viet%20Nam for time series data.06:58
azbycxsays 31 on the john hopkins site.06:58
PoonThanks @Albright07:04
tinwhiskersJohn Hopkins are working on their data as we speak so things are in a flux. They've now merged the duplicate data sets that arose from renaming some countries so my fix to address became useless. They still have both the US counties and US states inside down for US so now the total is double what it should be, but I'm not going to attempt to address that until things settle down.07:11
tinwhiskersSo expect some figures to be a bit wonky until sometime tomorrow-ish (GMT+13)07:12
tinwhiskerserm, just pretend what I said made sense for now.07:12
tinwhiskersAlso, due to the changed names the bleeding-edge figures for some countries won't be working. I'll fix those tomorrow as well.07:15
Brainstorm🔶 Veneto, Italy: +186 cases (now 856), +8 deaths (now 26), +18 recoveries (now 47) 🔶 Toscana, Italy: +98 cases (now 264), +1 deaths (now 1), +2 recoveries (now 3) 🔶 Piemonte, Italy: +93 cases (now 453), +12 deaths (now 17) 🔶 Marche, Italy: +122 cases (now 394), +6 deaths (now 13) 🔶 Lombardia, Italy: +1602 cases (now 5791), +201 deaths (now 468), +346 recoveries (now 896) 🔶 Liguria, Italy: +63 cases (no07:26
BrainstormNew from BBC Health at 06:15 UTC: Coronavirus: Health minister Nadine Dorries tests positive: Nadine Dorries, the first MP to test positive, is one of 382 confirmed cases in the UK. → https://is.gd/ZetBU607:26
otisolsen70%data italy08:35
Brainstormotisolsen70: In all areas, Italy, there are 10149 cases, 631 deaths (6.2% of cases), 1004 recoveries as of Wed Mar 11 08:30:00 2020. See https://offloop.net/covid19/?default=Italy for time series data.08:35
otisolsen70%data denmark08:35
Brainstormotisolsen70: In all areas, Denmark, there are 262 cases, 0 deaths (0.0% of cases), 1 recoveries as of Tue Mar 10 18:33:34 2020. See https://offloop.net/covid19/?default=Denmark for time series data.08:35
BrainstormNew from CNBC Health at 07:27 UTC: (news): Coronavirus live updates: Bank of England cuts interest rates, US cases cross 1,000 → https://is.gd/vJeQ1c08:35
otisolsen70%data sweden08:42
Brainstormotisolsen70: In all areas, Sweden, there are 355 cases, 0 deaths (0.0% of cases), 1 recoveries as of Wed Mar 11 03:18:14 2020. See https://offloop.net/covid19/?default=Sweden for time series data.08:42
otisolsen70%data norway08:42
Brainstormotisolsen70: In all areas, Norway, there are 401 cases, 0 deaths (0.0% of cases), 1 recoveries as of Wed Mar 11 08:30:00 2020. See https://offloop.net/covid19/?default=Norway for time series data.08:42
BrainstormNew from BBC Health at 07:45 UTC: Coronavirus: Health minister Nadine Dorries tests positive: Nadine Dorries, the first MP to test positive, is one of 382 confirmed cases in the UK. → https://is.gd/ZetBU608:49
BrainstormNew from r/Italy Live at 07:54 UTC: /u/pixelcraftables: Emergenza coronavirus, arriva il piano per l’economia da 10 miliardi - la Repubblica → https://is.gd/BxCypX09:03
BrainstormNew from CNBC Health at 08:14 UTC: Italy passes 10,000 coronavirus cases as national quarantine moves closer to total 'shutdown': More than 10,000 people have now been confirmed to have the coronavirus in Italy as a national lockdown remains in place and potentially tougher measures are considered. → https://is.gd/VlQgVK09:17
Brainstorm🔶 World: +55 cases (now 119377), +4 recoveries (now 66251) 🔸 Afghanistan: +2 cases (now 7) 🔸 Australia: +11 cases (now 127), +2 recoveries (now 24) 🔸 Austria: +24 cases (now 206) 🔸 Azerbaijan: +3 recoveries (now 3) 🔸 Bahrain: +2 cases (now 112) 🔸 Canada: +3 cases (now 97), +1 recoveries (now 9) 🔸 China: +2 cases (now 80957), +14 recoveries (now 61570) 🔸 Chongqing, China: +2 recoveries (now 549) 🔸 Henan, 09:26
BrainstormNew from CNBC Health at 08:21 UTC: (news): Coronavirus live updates: Bank of England cuts interest rates, US cases cross 1,000 → https://is.gd/vJeQ1c09:30
BrainstormNew from CNBC Health at 08:56 UTC: (news): Italy passes 10,000 coronavirus cases as national quarantine moves closer to total 'shutdown' → https://is.gd/VlQgVK09:58
commandocrypto[manyone heard any updates on the efficacy of traditional chinese medicine in treating the disease? asking for a friend10:06
Brainstorm🔶 World: +158 cases (now 119535) 🔶 Denmark: +78 cases (now 340) 🔶 Bahrain: +79 cases (now 189) 🔸 Afghanistan: +2 cases (now 7) 🔸 Australia: +11 cases (now 127), +2 recoveries (now 24) 🔸 Austria: +24 cases (now 206) 🔸 Azerbaijan: +3 recoveries (now 3) 🔸 Canada: +3 cases (now 97), +1 recoveries (now 9) 🔸 China: +3 cases (now 80958), +14 recoveries (now 61570) 🔸 Chongqing, China: +2 recoveries (now 549)10:07
petersjt014[m]So far it ain't looking like much of anything: https://pubpeer.com/publications/5E708B08D398F43E6AA5EE7446E4E3#110:07
petersjt014[m]Moreover, tcm isn't based in actual replicable science.10:08
petersjt014[m]If the person in question is subject to the placebo effect them maybe some minor positive effects could occur10:09
petersjt014[m]But we currently have no reason to believe it works in any measurable capacity in a proper triple-blinded controlled study.10:11
BrainstormNew from BBC Health at 08:58 UTC: Coronavirus: Health minister Nadine Dorries tests positive: Nadine Dorries, the first MP to test positive, is one of 382 confirmed cases in the UK. → https://is.gd/ZetBU610:11
commandocrypto[mpetersjt014: thanks. just trying to keep ourselves aware of how to be ready to treat. esp. since it's seeming like there won't be ample supply of medecine soon10:19
petersjt014[m]Wash your hands, use common sense, don't panic buy masks because the sick need them, and so on. An actual cure/treatment is likely over a year out,  so 'miracle cures' should be viewed with as much suspicion as always.10:26
petersjt014[m]Actually even more suspicion now that I think about it: con artists are found to be especially active and using the current panic to prey on the scared and gullible.10:28
petersjt014[m]Actually even more suspicion now that I think about it: con artists are going to be especially active and using the current panic to prey on the scared and gullible.10:28
mandiblegrippetersjt014[m]: My company sent around an email from the "CDC" today, warning of a coming pandemic.10:29
mandiblegripAnyone stupid enough to click the link in the email was forced to do phishing/cybersecurity training.10:29
mandiblegripI was pretty surprised that they would do something like that, but they did.10:30
petersjt014[m]Meta-phishing? Nice.10:30
mandiblegrippetersjt014[m]: haha yep10:30
petersjt014[m]Reminds me of something10:30
petersjt014[m]I had a relative who was interviewing someone who was maybe going to join the company10:31
petersjt014[m]Programming/IT position10:31
petersjt014[m]Apparently they gave very vague answers to any skill based questions10:32
petersjt014[m]So I suggested that they make up some nonexistent programming languages and ask the guy what kind of things he had written in them.10:33
petersjt014[m]hehehe10:33
petersjt014[m]I wanted to suggest Q# because that name amuses me but microsofts into quantum shit now so that's a real thing10:35
mandiblegrippetersjt014[m]: Oh no, why have you told me this? Now I'm going to read about this all night.10:37
petersjt014[m]It's okay, it's not _too_ interesting. They mostly just embiggened the type system and you can't even do much unless you wanna tolerate a slow-ass quantum emulator.10:38
BrainstormNew from CNBC Health at 09:37 UTC: (news): Coronavirus live updates: Bank of England cuts interest rates, US cases cross 1,000 → https://is.gd/vJeQ1c10:39
BoNgleger%data germany11:10
BrainstormBoNgleger: In all areas, Germany, there are 1574 cases, 2 deaths (0.1% of cases), 18 recoveries as of Wed Mar 11 10:53:03 2020. See https://offloop.net/covid19/?default=Germany for time series data.11:10
Timvde%cases Belgium11:16
BrainstormTimvde: In all areas, Belgium, there are 267 cases, 0 deaths (0.0% of cases), 1 recoveries as of Tue Mar 10 12:53:03 2020. See https://offloop.net/covid19/?default=Belgium for time series data.11:16
TimvdeFirst death11:17
Timvde90 year old with a long medical history11:17
mefistofeles%data Germany11:22
Brainstorm🔶 World: +70 cases (now 119605), +9 recoveries (now 66260) 🔸 Afghanistan: +2 cases (now 7) 🔸 Australia: +11 cases (now 127), +2 recoveries (now 24) 🔸 Austria: +24 cases (now 206) 🔸 Azerbaijan: +3 recoveries (now 3) 🔸 Bosnia and Herzegovina: +5 cases (now 12) 🔸 Burkina Faso: +1 cases (now 2) 🔸 China: +9 cases (now 80967), +8 recoveries (now 61578) 🔸 Guangdong, China: +3 cases (now 1356) 🔸 Hong Kong SAR, C11:22
mefistofeles%cases Germany11:22
Brainstormmefistofeles: In all areas, Germany, there are 1574 cases, 2 deaths (0.1% of cases), 18 recoveries as of Wed Mar 11 10:53:03 2020. See https://offloop.net/covid19/?default=Germany for time series data.11:22
Brainstormmefistofeles: In all areas, Germany, there are 1574 cases, 2 deaths (0.1% of cases), 18 recoveries as of Wed Mar 11 10:53:03 2020. See https://offloop.net/covid19/?default=Germany for time series data.11:22
mefistofelesoops, sorry11:22
mefistofelesso Korea does seem to be stabilizng, interesting11:24
BrainstormNew from r/Italy Live at 10:21 UTC: /u/pixelcraftables: Coronavirus: Conte, stanziati 25 miliardi. Non c'è nessuna chiusura verso misure più restrittive - Sanità - ANSA.it → https://is.gd/FyQJoP11:26
BrainstormNew from CNBC Health at 10:25 UTC: (news): Italy passes 10,000 coronavirus cases as national quarantine moves closer to total 'shutdown' → https://is.gd/VlQgVK11:33
BrainstormNew from CNBC Health at 10:43 UTC: Coronavirus live updates: Italy hikes spending to tackle virus, says further restrictions could come: Italy's Prime Minister Giuseppe Conte announced the government will set even more money aside to tackle the outbreak, raising spending to $28.3 billion. → https://is.gd/vJeQ1c11:47
Brainstorm🔶 World: +74 cases (now 119679), +2 deaths (now 4294) 🔸 Afghanistan: +2 cases (now 7) 🔸 Australia: +11 cases (now 127), +2 recoveries (now 24) 🔸 Austria: +24 cases (now 206) 🔸 Azerbaijan: +3 recoveries (now 3) 🔸 Bosnia and Herzegovina: +5 cases (now 12) 🔸 Burkina Faso: +1 cases (now 2) 🔸 China: +9 cases (now 80967), +8 recoveries (now 61578) 🔸 Guangdong, China: +3 cases (now 1356) 🔸 Hong Kong SAR, China:11:54
CatButtes[m]%cases uk11:57
BrainstormCatButtes[m]: In all areas, UK, there are 383 cases, 6 deaths (1.6% of cases), 18 recoveries as of Wed Mar 11 11:45:00 2020. See https://offloop.net/covid19/?default=UK for time series data.11:57
Brainstorm🔶 World: +76 cases (now 119755), +72 recoveries (now 66332) 🔶 Hubei, China: +72 recoveries (now 49134) 🔶 China: +9 cases (now 80967), +80 recoveries (now 61650) 🔸 Afghanistan: +2 cases (now 7) 🔸 Australia: +11 cases (now 127), +2 recoveries (now 24) 🔸 Austria: +24 cases (now 206) 🔸 Azerbaijan: +3 recoveries (now 3) 🔸 Bosnia and Herzegovina: +5 cases (now 12) 🔸 Burkina Faso: +1 cases (now 2) 🔸 Guang12:07
azy2https://youtu.be/cZFhjMQrVts12:13
BrainstormNew from The Atlantic at 11:00 UTC: What Happens If You Get Sick: COVID-19 is not the flu. We have a vaccine for the flu. We have anti-viral medications designed to treat the flu. We have a sense of what to expect when we catch the flu, and when it’s necessary to seek medical attention. Doctors have experience treating the flu, and tests to help [... want %more?] → https://is.gd/Kseul412:15
sneep:|12:22
BrainstormNew from CNBC Health at 11:18 UTC: US coronavirus cases surpass 1,000, Johns Hopkins University data shows: There were just over 100 confirmed cases in the U.S. one week ago, on March 4, according to the World Health Organization. → https://is.gd/AXChZY12:28
Lillie[m]%cases Poland 12:43
BrainstormLillie[m]: In all areas, Poland, there are 25 cases, 0 deaths (0.0% of cases), 0 recoveries as of Wed Mar 11 10:13:10 2020. See https://offloop.net/covid19/?default=Poland for time series data.12:43
BrainstormNew from CNBC Health at 11:53 UTC: Coronavirus live updates: Italy hikes spending to tackle virus, says further restrictions could come: Italy's Prime Minister Giuseppe Conte announced the government will set even more money aside to tackle the outbreak, raising spending to $28.3 billion. → https://is.gd/vJeQ1c12:56
Tobi[m]maybe this is a thing to do?13:03
Tobi[m]https://foldingathome.org/2020/02/27/foldinghome-takes-up-the-fight-against-covid-19-2019-ncov/13:03
mefistofelesTobi[m]: sure, I mean, it doesn't guarantee anything, but it doesn't hurt to give some computer power to that cause13:03
mefistofelesthere's also rosetta@home13:04
Tobi[m]yeah I knew the seti@home project13:04
mefistofelesI mean, rosetta@home is also focused now on SARS-CoV-2jobs13:08
mefistofelesI mean, rosetta@home is also focused now on SARS-CoV-2 jobs/tasks*13:08
Brainstorm🔶 World: +78 cases (now 121349), +3 deaths (now 4370), +240 recoveries (now 66573) 🔶 Sweden: +54 cases (now 409) 🔶 Iran (Islamic Republic of): +228 recoveries (now 2959) 🔸 Afghanistan: +2 cases (now 7) 🔸 Albania: +2 cases (now 12) 🔸 Australia: +11 cases (now 127), +2 recoveries (now 24) 🔸 Austria: +24 cases (now 206) 🔸 Azerbaijan: +3 recoveries (now 3) 🔸 Belgium: +47 cases (now 314), +1 deaths (now 1)13:11
oxalisWhich is the most effective home computer computational sharing networks for fighting Coronavirus?13:13
mefistofeleshttp://new.robetta.org/results.php?id=15652 it's a really large protein13:13
mefistofeleswould be nice to compare it to the RBD in the reported cryoEM structure 13:14
mefistofelesoxalis: I don't fully understand what you are asking, sorry, can you rephrase?13:14
oxalisI want to donate computational cycles to help. But aren’t there different @home things?13:15
oxalisWhich ones are doing the Coronavirus?13:15
mefistofelesah ok13:15
mefistofelesoxalis: so prbably now only folding@home, since I think rosetta@home already finished the coronavirus modelling jobs (not sure if there are some others going on, though)13:16
python476o/13:16
oxalisThanks, mefistofeles13:16
python476cool question oxalis13:17
python476thought folding@home worked on it, is it a different project than rosetta ?13:17
mefistofelespython476: yes, folding@home is doing protein-protein molecular dynamics (or similar) simulations to study the interaction or forming of complexes13:19
mefistofeleswhereas rosetta@home does modelling of structures, specifically they made a de-novo prediction of the whole S protein for the virion of SARS-CoV-213:19
oxalisBut Rosetta is no longer working on Coronavirus?13:21
mefistofelesI think they are not, but not 100% sure13:21
mefistofelessince they already came up with results for the whole S protein13:21
mefistofelesthey may be trying to model other parts of the virion, but not sure13:21
mefistofelesalso, since the S protein is known to be the relevant one for the binding to the ACE2 receptor13:22
oxalisI have a reasonably powerful PC with tons of memory. Maybe I’ll run both in parallel13:22
BrainstormNew from CNBC Health at 12:14 UTC: Italy hikes spending to tackle virus, says further restrictions could come: Italy's Prime Minister Giuseppe Conte announced the government will set even more money aside to tackle the outbreak, raising spending to $28.3 billion. → https://is.gd/vJeQ1c13:23
mefistofelesoxalis: actually, running just one each time should be better, imho13:24
mefistofelesyou can run one now and the the other later, and such13:24
mefistofelesalso the tasks done by folding@home are more coomputationally costly, so you may want to give them more computation time to that13:25
sneepStarted folding@home a couple days ago, used to be an active folder over 10 years ago13:28
sneepif anyone's interested in creating a group for this channel i'll join :p13:28
mefistofelesI actually need all my computational power for my work right now, but maybe later, sure13:32
mefistofeleswoah, Iç m actually very impressed with the rosetta@home work13:40
mefistofelesthe model is really close to the structure Executive: RMSD =    1.954 (16812 to 16812 atoms)13:40
mefistofelesjust did the calculations myself13:40
mefistofeleshow the f... they do it? I'm struggling with my models? :( haha13:42
BrainstormNew from CNBC Health at 12:49 UTC: (news): Coronavirus live updates: Germany's Merkel says most people will get COVID-19, Italy hikes outbreak spending → https://is.gd/i7KBtX13:51
Lillie[m]%cases France 13:52
BrainstormLillie[m]: In all areas, France, there are 1784 cases, 33 deaths (1.8% of cases), 12 recoveries as of Tue Mar 10 19:53:02 2020. See https://offloop.net/covid19/?default=France for time series data.13:52
mefistofeles%data Italy14:05
Brainstormmefistofeles: In all areas, Italy, there are 10149 cases, 631 deaths (6.2% of cases), 1004 recoveries as of Wed Mar 11 13:46:00 2020. See https://offloop.net/covid19/?default=Italy for time series data.14:05
mefistofelesthat's freaking crazy, do we have information about the age groups for the fatalities? Specially in the last few days14:06
LjLExpect a lot of cases today I think14:06
mefistofelesprobably14:06
LjLmefistofeles: not for the very last few days, but yes, they're in the pastebin, scroll to bottom14:06
LjLYesterday new cases were underreported14:07
LjLNew deaths weren't, hence the seemingly scary increase in fatality... At least I hope that's it14:07
LjLBut within Lombardy it is >6% anyway14:07
mefistofelesLjL: https://ugeo.urbistat.com/AdminStat/en/it/demografia/eta/lombardia/3/2 this?14:08
LjLThey are actually starting to built new hospitals (finally)14:08
LjLmefistofeles: no that's general demographics14:09
LjLThe ISS links14:09
LjLGoogle Translate will do an okay job with them14:09
mefistofelesLjL: sorry, I don't know which link is, I can't find it14:11
LjLmefistofeles: okay I'm using the phone now, I'll show you when I get at the computer14:12
mefistofelesLjL: sure, no problem14:12
BrainstormNew from CNBC Health at 13:13 UTC: (news): Coronavirus live updates: Germany's Merkel says most people will get virus, Italy hikes outbreak spending → https://is.gd/i7KBtX14:18
mefistofelesI like Merkel, that's expected14:19
oxalishttps://staythefuckhome.com/14:20
LjLMost people will get the virus... That's not something our authorities have ever had he guts to say14:20
LjLMaybe one particular epidemiologist with little restraint and bad manners (but who turned out to be right all along) may have said it14:21
python476I'm starting an online covid trading platform14:21
python476so people can benefit from getting viruses14:21
Brainstorm🔶 World: +110 cases (now 121459), +4 deaths (now 4374), +4 recoveries (now 66577) 🔸 Afghanistan: +2 cases (now 7) 🔸 Albania: +2 cases (now 12), +1 deaths (now 1) 🔸 Australia: +11 cases (now 127), +2 recoveries (now 24) 🔸 Austria: +24 cases (now 206) 🔸 Azerbaijan: +3 recoveries (now 3) 🔸 Belgium: +47 cases (now 314), +1 deaths (now 1) 🔸 Burkina Faso: +1 cases (now 2) 🔸 China: +3 recoveries (now 61653) 🔸 G14:21
mefistofelesLjL: yeah, even though the guys/girls/experts in TWIV did say it14:22
mefistofelesweeks ago, already14:22
oxalisI'm planning on getting infected next week14:23
oxalisNot looking forward to it though14:23
mefistofelesI probably have it already, likely14:24
LjLoxalis, don't be reckless, we don't know what this virus does in the long term14:24
LjLmefistofeles, do you?14:24
mefistofelesLjL: I mean, we have lots of cases and I've been near lots of people the alst few days14:24
LjLmefistofeles, my bad, the links i was pointing you to earlier are not in the pastebin yet, just my local version that i hadn't uploaded yet apparently...14:25
mefistofelesLjL: no worries, when you ahve the time14:25
mefistofeleshave*14:25
oxalisI'm going to be handwashing, disinfecting, etc. But I'll be traveling from Texas to southern California, so I'm probably going to get exposed14:25
mefistofelesI actually met someone yesterday that a collegue of her tested positive, she didn't, though14:25
LjLmefistofeles, https://www.iss.it/en/comunicati-stampa/-/asset_publisher/fjTKmjJgSgdK/content/id/5286166 and https://www.iss.it/en/comunicati-stampa/-/asset_publisher/fjTKmjJgSgdK/content/id/5288119 and https://www.iss.it/en/comunicati-stampa/-/asset_publisher/fjTKmjJgSgdK/content/id/5286166 (this last one is patients, not deaths)14:26
mefistofeles*colleague14:26
philhttps://twitter.com/SCMPNews/status/1237721182494957568?s=1914:26
LjLmefistofeles, the ISS also announced they are going to publish an epidemiology summary including ages and comorbidities twice a week from now one (tuesdays and fridays)14:26
oxalis%data SanDiego14:26
Brainstormoxalis: Sorry, SanDiego not found. Either there aren't cases, or it's under a different name.14:26
oxalis%data San Diego14:26
Brainstormoxalis: In San Diego County, CA, US, there are 3 cases, 0 deaths (0.0% of cases), 1 recoveries as of Wed Mar 11 06:35:03 2020. See https://offloop.net/covid19/?default=San%20Diego%20County,%20CA for time series data.14:26
oxalis%data Texas14:26
Brainstormoxalis: In TX, US, there are 16 cases, 0 deaths (0.0% of cases), 0 recoveries as of Wed Mar 11 10:13:10 2020. See https://offloop.net/covid19/?default=US for time series data.14:26
oxalis%data New Mexico14:26
Brainstormoxalis: Sorry, New Mexico not found. Either there aren't cases, or it's under a different name.14:27
fedorafanhello14:27
oxalis%data Arizona14:27
Brainstormoxalis: In AZ, US, there are 6 cases, 0 deaths (0.0% of cases), 1 recoveries as of Wed Mar 11 10:13:10 2020. See https://offloop.net/covid19/?default=US for time series data.14:27
sneepThere seem to be fewer people in the west who believe the virus can be contained14:27
oxalisThe USA Government has failed and given up14:27
LjLsneep, it cannot, and the WHO has been saying as much for a while, exept they also say we must act *as if* it can14:27
sneepEven though it was contained in China14:27
sneep(sort of)14:27
sneepI.e., not everyone in Wuhan got it14:28
pwr22I've just started watching contagion 😭14:29
sneepIt seems like China put in a huge effort to contain the virus and that effort was completely in vain14:29
mefistofelesKorea is also showing containment now14:29
LjLsneep, yes that's why the WHO is saying it, it worked in some places, so it would be foolish to send the message "just give up", but in Europe it doesn't seem like it has a chance of working, at least not *as* containment14:29
sneepUnless they managed to slow it down enough14:30
LjLKorea is showing a slowdown for now14:30
mefistofelesslowdown, yes14:30
LjLit's very promising but i wouldn't call it containment14:30
mefistofelesthat's a better work14:30
mefistofelesword*14:30
LjLthe WHO makes a distinction between containment and mitigation14:30
mefistofelesyes14:30
LjLthey say they don't want to send the message that mitigation is now the *only* option, because containment has sometimes been shown to work AND because thinking in terms of containment seems to actually help slowing it down (so, in practice, it's mitigation, but if you call it containment it works better)14:31
LjLit does appear that the WHO's job is mainly playing with semantics ;(14:31
mefistofelesLjL: yes, I did notice that as well14:32
BrainstormNew from CNBC Health at 13:29 UTC: (news): Coronavirus live updates: Merkel says most Germans will get virus, Italy hikes outbreak spending → https://is.gd/i7KBtX14:32
LjLmeanwhile, a beautiful warm sunny day with not a cloud in sight *sigh*14:32
mefistofelesthat may be good14:32
mefistofelesit's also warm around here, no sun, though14:33
fedorafandoes hv help?14:33
sneepNext time they should just immediately suspend all international travel for two weeks or so :p14:33
mefistofeleshv?14:33
fedorafanahh uv sorry14:33
mefistofelesno, but higher temperatures do14:33
fedorafanok14:33
LjLmefistofeles, eh, i doubt it14:34
LjLit's more of a glimmer of hope than knowledge14:34
LjLfedorafan, but anyway i was saying just in terms of... a day like this, and i have to stay home14:34
mefistofelesinfluenza and SARS are known to destabilize at higheer temperatures14:34
sneepuv helps too14:34
LjLmefistofeles, but MERS works better at higher temperatures14:34
mefistofelesyeah, but this looks much more like SARS than MERS14:34
mefistofelesgenetically and structurally14:35
LjLokay, but we just don't know14:35
fedorafansure, I associated it to the sun and I heard of uv and temps could help, could have been, that someone knew it better here14:35
mefistofelesLjL: there are good reaons to believe it can, but sure, that doesn't mean we don't have to worry then14:35
mefistofelesI mean, the usual14:35
mefistofelescommon sense14:35
Brainstorm🔶 World: +168 cases (now 121627), +1 deaths (now 4375) 🔶 Sweden: +67 cases (now 476) 🔶 Netherlands: +121 cases (now 503), +1 deaths (now 5) 🔸 Afghanistan: +2 cases (now 7) 🔸 Albania: +2 cases (now 12), +1 deaths (now 1) 🔸 Australia: +11 cases (now 127), +2 recoveries (now 24) 🔸 Austria: +24 cases (now 206) 🔸 Azerbaijan: +3 recoveries (now 3) 🔸 Belgium: +47 cases (now 314), +1 deaths (now 1) 🔸 Burkina14:35
LjLmefistofeles, also it seems to propagate okay in Singapore and Australia, although you could argue containment in Singapore worked *because* it's hot, but, well, i think it worked because they are Singapore14:35
sneepuv "helps" against all organic compounds14:35
fedorafanoh sweden is high14:35
LjLsneep, in terms of disinfecting yeah, i guess, at least depending on the strength and wavelength14:36
mefistofelessneep: the thing is that uv intensity is pretty low, temperature helps a bit more, in that regard14:36
LjLsneep, i briefly considering buying a UV disinfecting lamp to just use on everything we get through the front door, but then i saw how freaking dangerous it is to be exposed even briefly14:36
fedorafantrue the uv lamp idea sounds good14:36
sneepi was thinking of buying a uvc led and putting it in a case14:37
LjL%tr Complessivamente, sentita la Commissione europea, la richiesta di autorizzazione all’ulteriore ricorso all’indebitamento, aggiuntiva rispetto a quanto già indicato nella Relazione al Parlamento 2020, è incrementata di 13,75 miliardi di euro (pari a circa 0,8 punti percentuali), da utilizzare nel corso del 2020. Considerata anche la precedente richiesta di autorizzazione, l’obiettivo programmatico di indebitamento netto potrà pertanto a14:37
LjLumentare fino a 20 miliardi di euro, corrispondenti a circa 1,1 punti percentuali di prodotto interno lordo (PIL).14:37
sneepbut they're all smd apparently14:37
BrainstormLjL, Italian to English: Overall, after consulting the European Commission, the request for authorization for further recourse to debt, additional to that already indicated in the Report to Parliament 2020, increased by 13.75 billion euro (equal to approximately 0.8 percentage points) , to be used during 2020. Considering also the previous authorization request, the net debt [... want %more?]14:37
mefistofeleseven for the protease, shouldn't be as efficient at higher temperatures14:37
sneepand cost >2500 yen per piece14:37
LjL... will increase up to 20 billion euros, corresponding to 1.1% of PIL14:37
fedorafanahh you are italian14:37
fedorafan%tr dzien dobry14:38
Brainstormfedorafan, English to English: dzien dobry (Google)14:38
fedorafanlol14:38
LjLthat is not italian14:38
fedorafanok14:38
LjL%tr <pl dzień dobry14:38
BrainstormLjL, Polish to English: good morning (MateCat) — Welcome, (MateCat) — Good afternoon, (MateCat) — Good morning (Google)14:39
LjLalso, i wrote PIL, i meant GDP14:39
sneepwhy are you going to california?14:41
sneepif it's just for travel... maybe reconsider14:41
oxalisIt's not my choice.14:41
LjLall the information panels on our motorways are now displaying "CORONAVIRUS EMERGENCY AVOID TRAVEL"14:41
oxalisI'm being made to go.14:41
oxalisLjL: that's in Italy?14:42
LjLyeah14:42
oxalisThat's because Italy and the EU care more about people than profits.14:42
LjLyeah... no14:42
oxalisAll the companies in the US are getting in on the grift.14:42
oxalisHome Depot in now selling their own brand of Toilet Paper.14:43
LjLrest assured the EU cares a lot about profit, and right now Lombardy's government is in an argument with Italy's central government because Lombardy wants to close down all non-essential work activities and public transport, but the central government doesn't because of the economy14:43
oxalisHome Depot is a hardware store that sells screws, hammers, and building supplies.14:43
LjLbut, well, i heard Trump/Pence's press conference and it was all "companies companies companies industry industry industry subsidies subsidies also don't worry we are quarantining the cruise ship people, but, oh, hey, first and foremost we care about the american public"14:44
BrainstormNew from CNBC Health at 13:40 UTC: (news): Coronavirus live updates: Merkel says most Germans will get virus, Iran's death toll climbs → https://is.gd/i7KBtX14:46
LjLnow stop saying that Merkel, you got me anxious enough the first time around14:48
sneepLjL: https://pbs.twimg.com/media/ESwKNYxWkAQnKoY?format=jpg14:49
LjL;(14:49
mefistofeleslol14:50
LjLthere is a special parliamente session broadcast on tv about the prison riots, i assume it's mainly to show it to the inmates14:51
LjLpretty much empty parliament14:52
LjLalso, even when there are "full" parliament sessions, apparently they have agreed to only have half the MPs present14:52
LjL(partly because the law wouldn't allow them to sit close than 1m from each other anymore, so they cannot fill all the chairs)14:52
sneepoxalis: business trip? if yes, that's crazy14:52
oxalissneep: worse14:52
LjLa new prison revolt in Florence now14:54
sneepi don't get those prison riots14:55
sneepshouldn't they be happy that they're being isolated from the virus?14:55
darsiePerhaps ppl are closer than 2 m next to each other.14:55
darsiein the prison14:55
darsieBut what if the virus gets in the prison?14:56
darsieCertainly people are going in and out.14:56
darsieStaff, visitors, prisoners.14:57
oxalisthe headlines on r/coronavirus read exactly like headlines from Plague Inc14:57
LjLdarsie, well that's why visits are being stopped14:57
LjLif it gets into a prison it will spread a LOT14:57
LjLalready happened in China14:57
sneepiran released thousands of prisoners i think14:58
darsieDoes cooking inactivate cv?14:59
oxalisWhy did the cases in the US double 9-Mar? was it just numbers from the cruise ship?14:59
LjLthere is a cluster in New York14:59
LjLstate, not city15:00
oxalisOh - they only went on the rolls yesterday?15:00
darsieoxalis: What does that mean?15:00
oxalisI though they were already on the count15:00
darsieahh, rolls of paper where the infected are counted.15:01
sneep22:59 < darsie> Does cooking inactivate cv? <-- of course15:02
ubLIXLjL: https://twitter.com/vkjudit/status/123744812580098867515:02
mefistofeles%title15:02
Brainstormmefistofeles: From twitter.com: VKJudit su Twitter: "In a call between the two foreign ministers, China agreed to supply Italy with 1,000 ventillators and 2 million masks. Additionally, they are donating (!) them 100k respirators, [...]15:02
LjLubLIX, yeah. what do you think will be our next best buddy, China or the EU?15:04
LjLslash_ also, same consideration15:04
sneepso it will be canceled in all likelihood?15:05
darsiesneep: thx. There are thermophiles and heat resistant spores, so obviously some proteins/DNA can survive cooking. What temperature is needed to inavcitate cv?15:06
ubLIXLjL: i imagine as China gets its production back into full swing, they'll be doing a lot more of this for many countries15:07
sneepi bet most countries don't have much production of their own15:07
sneepdarsie: dunno, but i'd guess it's not a particularly high temperature15:08
LjLwell, i hope they quickly deliver what they've promised because i really don't want to keep reading things from Italian doctors that say patients over 65 are just allowed to die15:09
ubLIXamen15:09
LjLi am tempted to sneak out for a walk15:10
LjLsuch sun15:10
darsieLjL: Where are you?15:11
LjLMilan15:11
mefistofelesLjL: are you really? ¬¬15:11
darsieic15:11
LjLmefistofeles, my mental health is not going to benefit from staying home for... months?15:11
mefistofelesLjL: as long as you are not in contact with elderly people15:12
mefistofelesI guess15:12
LjLi am. but if i am to believe what has always been stated by authorities, i shouldn't have much to fear from being in the open air at a distance from other people15:12
pwr22Yeah, should be ok15:13
LjLif i am not, then i also don't see why i should follow their directions anyway!15:13
LjLapart from being fined15:13
darsieIs it illegal for you to go out?15:13
ubLIXjust don't get on any public transport, LjL 15:13
pwr22I would assume going on a private walk for mental health reasons would be a valid reason15:13
LjLdarsie, technically, yes, although there is a bit of confusion over whether we're allowed to do "outdoors activities" (in the sense of exercise, like jogging) if we are alone15:14
LjLubLIX, i wouldn't dream of doing that15:14
LjLgroup activities are banned, so i can't even go with someone else, but it should be okay for me to go alone, although it may be hard to explain to a cop that i'm just walking aimlessly15:14
BrainstormNew from CNBC Health at 14:11 UTC: (news): Coronavirus live updates: Merkel says most Germans will get virus, Iran's death toll climbs → https://is.gd/i7KBtX15:16
mefistofelesLjL: look what Merkel says15:16
mefistofeles;)15:16
pwr22Hmm, I got called a soydev in one of the other corona virus related rooms. Any clue what that means?15:16
LjLoh god Brainstorm15:16
mefistofeleshaha15:16
LjLmeanwhile it's not posting anything from Reddit and i still don't know why15:17
LjLwell, it's posting things from the live thread, but that's about it15:17
mefistofelespwr22: no idea15:17
sneepdarsie: These guys tested UV and temperature resistance of the original SARS virus, I'd guess the new one is similar: https://eprints.lib.hokudai.ac.jp/dspace/bitstream/2115/10516/1/52(3)_105-112.pdf15:17
ubLIXpwr22: urban dictionary thinks it means 'liberal', as in right wing people calling you a libtard15:18
pwr22ubLIX: next question, what's a libtard?15:18
ubLIXlol15:19
sneep(56°C water bath, rapid inactivation after 5 minutes, low infectivity after 30 minutes, no infectivity after 60 minutes)15:19
ubLIXportmanteau of liberal and... sigh... retard15:19
pwr22I think this was in response to a link to github....15:19
ubLIXa common insult in america (among rednecks anyway)15:19
pwr22Ah15:19
pwr22Some people seem to be full of such.... hatred of the rest of the human race15:19
ubLIXurban dictionary: soydev - A developer who is a liberal. They are most common in silicon valley15:20
pwr22I don't really have much desire to understand them too much or learn too much of their vocab 😆15:20
ubLIXprobably a portmanteau of soya beans and developer15:20
ubLIXliberals eat soya beans i guess :D15:20
sneeppwr22: see nobody on irc would use silly insults like that15:21
ubLIXclearly you're in better company here, pwr22 15:21
pwr22<sneep "darsie: These guys tested UV and"> It might not be - this one differs in other ways too15:21
pwr22<sneep "(56°C water bath, rapid inactiva"> Sous Vide to the rescue15:21
pwr22sneep, ubLIX: yes I really like this room / channel 🙂15:22
darsiedefine Sous Vide15:22
sneepit's a cooking technique15:23
sneeplow-temperature slow cooking15:23
darsieic15:23
LjLi changed reddit feeds again in an effort to get Brainstorm to post anything from them, if it starts posting *too much* from them (as in useless nonsense), let me know if i fail to notice15:23
astraliam[m]Sounds like Italy is running out of ventilators15:23
astraliam[m]https://www.instructables.com/id/The-Pandemic-Ventilator/15:24
LjLlol, Spec, you've found something to do i reckon15:26
sneepthat doesn't look very easy15:26
BrainstormNew from CNBC Health at 14:23 UTC: (news): Coronavirus live updates: Merkel says most Germans will get infected, NYU doc says hospitals unprepared → https://is.gd/i7KBtX15:27
izubLIX: hehe, i read your explaination of libtard in a Kif from Futurama voice15:27
darsieAvailable in Austria: denatured ethanol 5 EUR/l, isopropanol 12 EUR/l.15:27
ubLIXiz: lol15:28
sneepis that expensive?15:28
darsienon denatured 96% ethanol was 25 EUR/l recently, IIRC.15:28
darsie1 l milk is ~ 1 EUR15:29
darsielow monthly salary is 1200 EUR for 38-40 h/week15:30
darsiegasoline is 1.3 EUR/l. Much higher energy content than ethanol or IPA.15:31
contingoLjL et al, this is the kind of nonsense doing the rounds on my mother's family's whatsapp groups: https://dpaste.org/x5xL15:34
LjLcontingo, i gauge at moderate-to-high level of nonsense15:36
contingothat US House hearing just got very juicy15:41
oxaliscontingo: which?15:45
darsieI have 35% H2O2. Should I bother getting alcohol or is 0.5% H2O2 just as good?15:49
LjLdarsie, there is a paper in the topic that studies various coronaviruses' viability on surfaces, and also effectiveness of cleaners, iirc15:51
BrainstormNew from CNBC Health at 14:46 UTC: (news): People are stealing hand sanitizer and surgical masks from doctors' offices because of coronavirus fears → https://is.gd/NVOAEE15:51
pwr22%cases south korea15:52
Brainstormpwr22: Sorry, south korea not found. Either there aren't cases, or it's under a different name.15:52
LjL%cases republic of korea15:53
BrainstormLjL: In all areas, Republic of Korea, there are 7755 cases, 54 deaths (0.7% of cases), 247 recoveries as of Wed Mar 11 03:18:14 2020. See https://offloop.net/covid19/?default=Republic%20of%20Korea for time series data.15:53
LjL(typing just "korea" should work too)15:53
pwr22It's been renamed?15:53
LjLJHU renamed things with stupid names15:53
LjLworse:15:53
LjL%cases taiwan15:53
BrainstormLjL: In Taiwan, Taipei and environs, there are 47 cases, 1 deaths (2.1% of cases), 17 recoveries as of Wed Mar 11 06:35:03 2020. See https://offloop.net/covid19/?default=Taiwan for time series data.15:53
BrainstormLjL: Mortality can be broadly expected to lie between 0.7% (assuming deaths/cases with ⅔ of cases undetected), and less than 5.3% (considering only deaths and recoveries).15:53
LjLah, it was only "Taipei and environs" yesterday15:53
pwr22I'm trying to improve the search in my bot and this threw me for a loop since that was my test case15:54
LjLIran has also become "Iran (Islamic Republic of)" as if there is another Iran15:54
darsieThe arstechnica guide says "the viruses are efficiently inactivated by surface disinfection procedures with 62–71 percent ethanol, 0.5 percent hydrogen peroxide, or 0.1 percent sodium hypochlorite (bleach) within 1 minute.” but I'm not sure of the downsides of H2O2. Might be more unstable. Not sure if stability rises or drops at 0.5%. Should be less volatile. Bad for eyes.15:54
LjLbad for hands too, don't use it as hand sanitizer15:54
darsieok15:54
oxalisWhat about Sodium Hydroxide?15:55
darsieThat dissolves hands.15:55
darsieI used H2O2 on wounds.15:55
LjLit's okay on wounds, however it does make your cells explode a little, ending up with white fingers15:56
LjLit's not exactly something life threatening, but when you have a wound, you actually *want* to kill the cells around the wound15:56
darsieNot at 0.5%, IMHO.15:56
LjLwhen you're simply cleaning your hands, not so much15:56
LjLwell maybe not, i used 3%15:56
pwr22LjL: the code for Cov Bot is at https://github.com/pwr22/covbot if you want to take a look15:56
LjLpwr22, thanks15:57
LjLlikewise15:57
LjL%source covid15:57
BrainstormLjL, source code for module 'covid' can be found at https://paste.ee/p/eXitt 15:57
LjLif you want to cringe15:57
LjLbut i probably linked before15:57
pwr22I did take a look, I've seen far worse btw15:58
pwr22I'm trying to make the search better and learn some new things in the process15:58
pwr22My bot is being used in some of my less favourite covid rooms 😶15:58
pwr22The matrix guys seemed to like it though which is neat15:58
pwr22It's totally inspired by brainstorm btw, I wouldn't have though of making it otherwise15:59
sneepoxalis: sodium hydroxide is extremely caustic, do not touch16:01
BrainstormNew from CNBC Health at 15:00 UTC: (news): Coronavirus live updates: CEO calls it a 'painful setback,' Merkel says most Germans will get infected → https://is.gd/i7KBtX16:05
LjLhold on a second what did Merkel say?16:09
pwr22<sneep "oxalis: sodium hydroxide is extr"> Oven cleaner right?16:11
Brainstorm🔶 World: +130 cases (now 121837), +3 recoveries (now 66582) 🔶 UK: +73 cases (now 456) 🔸 Brazil: +1 cases (now 35) 🔸 Brunei: +5 cases (now 11) 🔸 China: +2 cases (now 80969), +3 recoveries (now 61656) 🔸 Gansu, China: +2 cases (now 127) 🔸 Sichuan, China: +3 recoveries (now 488) 🔸 Germany: +27 cases (now 1656) 🔸 Norway: +3 cases (now 443) 🔸 Romania: +1 cases (now 36) 🔸 Spain: +8 cases (now 2182) 🔸 US16:11
Birosso%cases Germany16:19
BrainstormBirosso: In all areas, Germany, there are 1656 cases, 3 deaths (0.2% of cases), 25 recoveries as of Wed Mar 11 16:03:00 2020. See https://offloop.net/covid19/?default=Germany for time series data.16:19
BrainstormNew from r/Italy Live at 15:16 UTC: /u/pixelcraftables: Coronavirus, il primario di Niguarda: "Basta fake news, non è vero che lasciamo morire i pazienti" → https://is.gd/PLJjuL16:19
BirossoMerkel said... unsettling stuff.16:19
mefistofeleswell, I guess that applies to most/all regions16:20
mefistofelesit s just the time variable what's important16:20
mefistofelesbut yes, this is now pretty much expected to infect most of the population eventually, I'd think16:20
mefistofelesor rather, that's not a crazy guess16:21
pwr22%cases wash16:22
Brainstormpwr22: In Washington, US, there are 273 cases, 23 deaths (8.4% of cases), 1 recoveries as of Wed Mar 11 10:53:03 2020. See https://offloop.net/covid19/?default=Washington for time series data.16:22
pwr22!cases wash16:22
pwr22!cases Washington, D.C.16:22
LjLI'm walking in Milan now, near my place, there are people and some cars, less than usual but not completely empty16:26
LjLBirosso: Better unsettling and true than reassuring and a lie, as it has been the case often during this16:26
LjLIMO16:27
BirossoLjL, I don't disagree. 16:27
sneepMy Matrix client says: "The last sync failed with error: internal server error" {"errcode":"M_UNKNOWN","error":"Internal server error"}16:29
sneepmkay16:30
BrainstormNew from BBC Health at 15:25 UTC: (news): Coronavirus: Biggest daily rise as UK cases reach 456 → https://is.gd/zuBQHY16:32
LjLSo in the pharmacy, I had to take my number, wait outside, then inside there were yellow strips on the ground stating where you had to stand (at a distance), and the personnel was wearing not masks but welding hoods sort of things (?) and finally next to the exit there was some hand gel16:42
LjLIt's ridiculously warm outside and I was sweating waiting for my turn, it's like the weather is laughing at us16:43
LjLMore than 19C I think16:43
sneepthat sounds good16:45
BrainstormNew from CNBC Health at 15:38 UTC: Coronavirus fallout: At least 150 companies have warned of earnings hit: Companies continue to warn of the threat that COVID-19 poses, with several anticipating they'll miss guidance in the March quarter. → https://is.gd/IsY0fQ16:46
LjLMass of the usual idiot kids playing ball in the square in front of the station16:46
LjLTempted to call police on them16:47
LjLThey have been known to destroy things and throw beer bottles into our building's ground level terrace before16:47
LjL-MatrixDoes this look like a "quarantined bus" to you?16:49
LjL-MatrixThey need to shut down everything ffs16:50
LjL-MatrixAnd this is what the outside of a big supermarket looks like16:54
LjL-MatrixThey must let a limited number of people inside... So this is the outside16:54
BrainstormNew from CNBC Health at 15:49 UTC: (news): Coronavirus live updates: CEO calls it a 'painful setback,' Merkel says most Germans will get infected → https://is.gd/i7KBtX17:00
python476bought 70% alcohol and h2o2 17:01
python476I haz readiness17:01
slash_US really needs to start tested en masse17:21
slash_they probably have more cases nationwide than Italy atm17:21
slash_more than China next week17:22
slash_I mean they "suddenly" found 100 cases in 1 county in NY state lol17:23
sneepHmm? You mean they should just test everyone?17:24
slash_everyone isn't possible (at least not short term), but at least everyone in hospitals/doctors with symptoms as much as they can17:25
sneepAh. I thought they were doing that more or less17:26
slash_well not so far, but the US is mass producing testing kits now17:26
slash_so hopefully soon17:26
BrainstormNew from BBC Health at 16:24 UTC: (news): Coronavirus: Biggest daily rise as UK cases reach 460 → https://is.gd/zuBQHY17:28
slash_but it's not like most European nations are doing any better lol, so who am I to criticize17:28
slash_they stopped testing direct family members of cases here due to test shortage and they tell them "just self isolate"17:29
LjL%cases Italy17:30
Brainstorm🔶 World: +277 cases (now 122114), +3 deaths (now 4379), +45 recoveries (now 66627) 🔶 Qatar: +238 cases (now 262) 🔸 Belgium: +2 deaths (now 3) 🔸 Brazil: +1 cases (now 35) 🔸 Brunei: +5 cases (now 11) 🔸 Canada: +2 cases (now 99) 🔸 China: +2 cases (now 80969), +3 recoveries (now 61656) 🔸 Gansu, China: +2 cases (now 127) 🔸 Sichuan, China: +3 recoveries (now 488) 🔸 Cyprus: +3 cases (now 6) 🔸 Germany: +27 17:30
BrainstormLjL: In all areas, Italy, there are 10149 cases, 631 deaths (6.2% of cases), 1004 recoveries as of Wed Mar 11 17:17:00 2020. See https://offloop.net/covid19/?default=Italy for time series data.17:30
slash_muhammadanasnaee I do not understand that info? this virus infects the lungs at first, coughing comes only after the virus spreads to the upper respiratory tract17:30
sneepI'm thinking of renting an apartment that would allow me to self-isolate if needed17:31
spybertslash_: I thought the problem now in the US was not the availability of test kits but rather the limited ability of the laboratories to analyze the samples17:31
sneepYou still need a lab to analyze the samples?17:32
sneepDamn, that's not quite as advanced as I'd hoped17:32
slash_no I think it was because at first it needed to be verified by the CDC17:32
slash_which severely limited capacity17:32
spybertsneep: Other places have more advanced, stand-alone tests17:32
slash_this has been lifted as the tests are now more reliable17:33
slash_yeah, hopefully those breathing tests will become available worldwide17:33
slash_they give much quicker results apparently17:34
spybertsure, but they weren't invented here, and their manufacturers didn't pay to get them approved in the US17:35
slash_spybert yes, but I think the US can use emergency laws to allow this if they want17:36
slash_ITS OFFICIAL BOYS17:37
slash_WHO has declared a pandemic17:37
slash_lemme find a source in English17:38
slash_https://www.bbc.com/news/world-5183994417:38
LjL-MatrixSmall supermarket. Imagine the big ones17:39
pwr22<slash_ "WHO has declared a pandemic"> 😭17:39
pwr22!cases new york17:39
slash_it basically means that the WHO does not think we can contain the virus anymore and that we must move to mitigation17:40
pwr22!cases uk17:40
pwr22!cases us17:40
slash_Qatar also jumped very hard today17:40
slash_!cases qatar17:40
slash_yesterday was 2417:41
pwr22Wow17:41
pwr22!cases world17:41
slash_probably started tested only recently17:41
BrainstormNew from CNBC Health at 16:36 UTC: (news): Coronavirus live updates: First death from virus in Ireland, US hospital considers temporary facilities → https://is.gd/i7KBtX17:41
LjLPandemic? Did anyone watch the WHO press conference?17:44
slash_I got like 5 push notifications from all my news apps lol17:44
slash_just go to any news site it's probably on there17:44
Brainstorm🔶 World: +204 cases (now 122318), +2 deaths (now 4381) 🔶 Germany: +224 cases (now 1853) 🔸 Belgium: +2 deaths (now 3) 🔸 Brazil: +1 cases (now 35) 🔸 Brunei: +5 cases (now 11) 🔸 Bulgaria: +1 deaths (now 1) 🔸 Canada: +2 cases (now 99) 🔸 China: +2 cases (now 80969), +3 recoveries (now 61656) 🔸 Gansu, China: +2 cases (now 127) 🔸 Sichuan, China: +3 recoveries (now 488) 🔸 Cyprus: +3 cases (now 6) 🔸 Georg17:45
slash_but it is from the news conference yes LjL17:45
LjLslash_: I don't not-believe you, I'm just on the go and was wondering what the WHO's final deciding argument was17:46
pwr22I get BBC pushes on virus stuff17:47
pwr22But I still found out here first17:47
slash_LjL previously they refused to label it a pandemic because they believed the virus could still be fully contained and snuffed out17:48
slash_LjL so what changed is that they no longer think that is possible17:49
LjLWell this is from Korea https://img7.yna.co.kr/photo/yna/YH/2020/03/03/PYH2020030303210001300_P4.jpg I guess it kinda dwarfs the pictures I posted of Milan...17:49
slash_LjL so nothing really changed really, except WHO now accepts reality17:49
pwr22I see it more as an official recognition of the severity17:49
slash_yeah exactly17:49
oxalisSo, do we officially have a pandemic?17:50
slash_maybe to motivate more nations to act more... many are severely lacking in measures17:50
slash_oxalis it is official! I did not bring champagne though, sorry17:50
oxalis13%ABV isn't enough to kill the virus, but It's enough to kill the pain17:51
slash_let's hope the announcement kicks our governments in the arse to act17:51
sneepLjL: Is that a line to get masks?17:51
pwr22I was thinking about making a still out of my sous vide setup and vodka to produce stronger ethanol17:52
oxalisMasks are soo last week.  People are cutting up bras now17:52
oxalisCan't you get Everclear?17:53
oxalisPPL are making a run on Vinegar for some reason17:53
oxalisdoes Acetic Acid do something I'm not aware of to the virus?17:54
sneepI didn't learn enough Korean to read the sign, but the second word is "mask" and picture is a pack of masks17:54
sneep+the17:54
slash_oxalis well vinegar has some antiviral properties, it's good for cleaning the house17:55
slash_not good enough as a hand sanitizer though17:56
slash_vinegar does supposedly kills influenza virus on surfaces, but I don't think anything is known if it affects coronaviruses17:57
slash_oxalis not sure about that one lol, but lots of things kill viruses17:58
Brainstorm🔶 World: +60 cases (now 122378), +3 deaths (now 4384), +21 recoveries (now 66648) 🔶 Japan: +52 cases (now 639), +3 deaths (now 15), +16 recoveries (now 118) 🔸 Bahrain: +5 recoveries (now 35) 🔸 Belgium: +2 deaths (now 3) 🔸 Brazil: +1 cases (now 35) 🔸 Brunei: +5 cases (now 11) 🔸 Bulgaria: +1 deaths (now 1) 🔸 Canada: +2 cases (now 99) 🔸 China: +2 cases (now 80969), +3 recoveries (now 61656) 🔸 Gansu, China17:58
sneepVinegar's not so great as a hand sanitizer17:58
slash_I mean viruses only really become a problem once they are inside us, can't drink bleach, but it does kill viruses17:59
slash_sneep yeah, but it's good for cleaning in the house17:59
oxalisOxalic acid is: HOOCCOOH17:59
oxalisI think I'll stick with HOOCH18:00
slash_is that the chemical formula? or the sound you make when you ingest it?18:00
oxalislol18:01
LjLsneep, no it's lines to supermarkets18:03
LjLthis terrible mask i wore outside gave me a headache somehow :(18:03
LjLJapan isn't looking great anymore18:05
LjL%cases Japan18:05
BrainstormLjL: In all areas, Japan, there are 639 cases, 15 deaths (2.3% of cases), 118 recoveries as of Wed Mar 11 18:04:00 2020. See https://offloop.net/covid19/?default=Japan for time series data.18:05
LjLthey were remarkably linear for a while but it looks like it's gone exponential now18:05
izmaybe just related to lags in testing?18:06
python476e3 cancelled18:06
izjapan says olympics are still on though18:07
LjLi don't know, i have no real information on the state of things in japan outside of the numbers18:07
izyeah same18:07
izsometimes i watch japanese news on tv, but that's about it18:07
python476iz: maybe public-less olympics18:07
python476and no contact sports18:08
python476e-sports fan are like :drool:18:08
izjudges in plexiglass containers18:08
python476iz: and silos corridors on track events18:08
izhehe18:08
muhammadanasnaee> muhammadanasnaeem I do not understand that info? this virus infects the lungs at first, coughing comes only after the virus spreads to the upper respiratory tract18:09
muhammadanasnaeeIf it benefits you try to follow. I do this too.18:09
BrainstormNew from CNBC Health at 17:06 UTC: (news): Three TSA airport screeners in California test positive for new coronavirus → https://is.gd/Trj1jJ18:09
LjLItaly daily press conference is on (already... but i started watching now)18:10
LjL10590 currently positive18:10
LjL>78% of deaths are in people with comorbidities18:10
LjL1028 in ICU18:11
LjL5838 hospitalized with symptoms18:11
python476hows the growth rate in there ?18:11
LjLthe increment in cases for today also includes the ones that failed to be counted yesterday18:11
LjLpython476, terribly exponential18:11
python476what about food supply and other daily requirements ?18:11
oxalisI think it's still geometric here18:11
python476people managed to have enough ?18:11
LjLpython476, there are long queues in front of supermarkets, since they are only allowing people in in small groups18:12
LjLi saw a couple18:12
LjLwouldn't recommend18:12
LjLfor now we're getting groceries delivered, but that's quickly becoming impossible18:12
LjLthey are giving numbers for the new tents and PPEs and stuff distributed18:12
LjL>1m masks distributed18:12
LjL116 ventilators and respirators will be distributed in the coming days18:12
python476i wonder if transport companies have new hygiene procedures18:13
LjLthe scientific committee gave an opinion about using surgical masks on the workplace18:13
LjLthey recommend to keep 1m distances in a rigorous way as the main containment method. if that is not possible then wearing a mask is recommended18:13
LjLpython476, they do according to law18:13
LjLpython476, which actually resulted in half the commuter trains being cancelled, because they couldn't disinfect them all18:14
LjLleading to even *more* people crammed in the train18:14
LjLgood job there18:14
python476fun18:14
DetectiveTacolet's be real here can this thing stop jacking the fucking stock market 18:14
LjLlet's be real the economy is crashing and won't stop crashing for a good while, meaning some years18:14
LjLquestions now18:15
DetectiveTaco%data US18:15
BrainstormDetectiveTaco: In all areas, US, there are 1050 cases, 31 deaths (3.0% of cases), 15 recoveries as of Wed Mar 11 18:04:00 2020. See https://offloop.net/covid19/?default=US for time series data.18:15
DetectiveTaco%data MD18:15
BrainstormDetectiveTaco: In MD, US, there are 8 cases, 0 deaths (0.0% of cases), 0 recoveries as of Wed Mar 11 10:13:10 2020. See https://offloop.net/covid19/?default=US for time series data.18:15
CatButtes[m]I'm expecting a bunch of lockdown announcements on Friday afternoon around market close time. Next Friday will be a bit late and governments like bad news to happen before the weekend to prevent panic trades18:16
LjLquestion: i have two questions, first, i think i understood there's a difference between deaths from coronavirus and people affected but died from other pathologies. i understand the ISS certifies deaths. what's the actual current number? second, from china, could the virus have gotten mutations that made it more aggressive here?18:16
LjLanswer: about the first question, the ISS is working on confirming causes of death, clearly it may occur that someone dies suddenly and afterwards a test is made and the person turns out to be affected, and this could reduce the number of people dead from the coronavirus (?)18:16
LjLbut we have no clear data on this, we must do further analysis18:17
LjLwhat we can say is that the death rate in italy does seem to be higher than in china, and this created many rumors, also from abroad18:17
izDetectiveTaco: there's oil messing w/ the stock market now also18:17
LjLfirst, if we stratify by age, we find out that it's not higher than the Chinese rate, but actually lower, because the italian population is much older18:17
mefistofeles%data South Korea18:17
Brainstormmefistofeles: Sorry, South Korea not found. Either there aren't cases, or it's under a different name.18:17
mefistofeles%data Republic of Korea18:17
Brainstormmefistofeles: In all areas, Republic of Korea, there are 7755 cases, 54 deaths (0.7% of cases), 247 recoveries as of Wed Mar 11 03:18:14 2020. See https://offloop.net/covid19/?default=Republic%20of%20Korea for time series data.18:17
DetectiveTaco everything is messing with the stock market 18:18
LjLsecond, there is no way to standardize the death rate internationally, because it all depends on how many tests are performed. if you do many tests, you find many cases, and the death rate is lower; if you test only symptomatic people, the death rate gets higher, because we're only testing people who are actually sick18:18
LjLthe question about the virus mutations: so far we have sequenced the virus in the original Chinese patient in Rome, another patient's full genome, and a Lombard patient's full genome as well, now we're doing it with a patient from Veneto18:19
LjLif we look at the virus's genome, there are only small mutations18:19
LjLit's undoubtedly the Chinese virus, obviously, to counter some rumours that this was a "local" virus18:19
LjLquestion: in light of the WHO's latest evaluation, has the committee evaluated the measures asked by Fontana, i.e. closing down all services in Lombardy except for essential services?18:20
LjLother question, there's talks of using the army to enforce the movement restrictions. is this going to happen?18:20
LjLanswer: okay, about closing everything, it will be evaluated but at the moment there are no decisions or news18:21
LjLabout the army, i think there must be a widespread voluntary respect of the restrictions18:21
LjLthere are fines, there is control by the police force, so there definitely are checks, and arrest in case of violations, but i want to point out that everybody must just act responsibly18:21
LjLquestion: after our [Chinese] foreign ministry talked to yours, i want to ask about ventilators and respirators that were offered by China, as well as the team of Chinese doctors that is being sent to a mission to Italy. (missed the actual question)?18:22
BrainstormNew from CNBC Health at 17:20 UTC: (news): Coronavirus live updates: WHO declares global pandemic, lawmakers push Big Pharma on supply chains → https://is.gd/i7KBtX18:23
LjLanswer: we are working, we thank China for giving us this generous chance, taking part in our experience, then about the relationship between chinese and italian doctors, i'm letting the doctor here speak18:23
LjLChina has taught us a lot in terms of control of this infection: what happened in Wuhan was really a success of containment measures, even though in Europe we're obviously applying these measures in a different way18:23
LjLbut the Chinese experience has shown that restrictive measures can contain or slow down even big clusters18:24
LjLabout the scientific community, we have a lot to learn from the clinical trials conducted in China18:24
LjLsince China has had a high number of patients, they could test various drugs, and we are waiting for data on efficacy of the various treatments, both antivirals and ICU treatments18:24
LjLi believe this knowledge exchange will be very important18:24
LjLquestion: first, the situation of ICUs in Lombardy: today you had to transfer 5 patients away to other regions, and same yesterday. couldn't more patients be transfered, given the Lombard system is collapsing? can't we bring the system back to a more acceptable situation?18:25
LjLsecond, a clarification on the emergency law: if one goes outside for reasons of health, work or grocery shopping, they must carry a self-certification. but what about going on foot? what about things like a walk in the park?18:26
darsieNo self certification required, then ;).18:27
oxaliswhat about BIRD scooters?18:27
LjLanswers: about cross-region ICU transfers, we only mobilize patients when there is a very real necessity, in part to avoid taking patients very far away from their residence, and you must consider that we're also transfering patients who have other pathologies, not just COVID18:27
LjLabout movement, if you go outside and the police forces stop you and ask for a justification for being outside, even if you hadn't filled in a self-certification module, you can just render it verbally18:27
python476still no new source of data for china ?18:28
LjLbut my own advice is to stay home as much as possible18:28
LjLour site's FAQ helps clarify these aspects18:28
LjLand yes, if you're on foot you still should carry a self-certification18:28
LjLquestion: the WHO has now declared a pandemic, and talked of a "alarming" inaction from countries. they probably weren't talking about Italy since they praised us yesterday, but what phase are we in? there was talks of phase 1, phase 2, where are we?18:29
LjLanswer: declaring a pandemic doesn't add much for ourselves, since we were among the first to get hit, so since a pandemic is about global reach of the outbreak, it changes little for us18:29
LjLwhat the WHO is pointing out is that a few countries have, in effect, done little to slow down circulation of the virus. Italy found it in Lombardy at the same time as flu peak, and we couldn't do much18:29
LjLChina did a lot to contain the outbreak, Korea is trying with all their powers, so is Japan18:30
LjLunfortunately the situation has gotten out of hand in some countries, like Iran18:30
mefistofeles%data Iran18:30
Brainstormmefistofeles: In all areas, Iran (Islamic Republic of), there are 9000 cases, 354 deaths (3.9% of cases), 2959 recoveries as of Wed Mar 11 12:53:03 2020. See https://offloop.net/covid19/?default=Iran%20(Islamic%20Republic%20of) for time series data.18:30
LjLwhat i've expressed more than once is that maybe a stronger reaction by the EU would have been welcomed18:30
LjLbut it does seem (or doesn't?) France and Germany are taking some stronger measures18:30
LjLItaly has a patchy situation, with areas that are very much affected, and others where containment is working, as well as initial clusters, small ones in Rome and the south18:31
LjLi am not saying the situation there is alarming, but we must contain them preemptively18:31
LjLi understand various regions are requesting even stronger measures18:31
LjLa pandemic state is declared to encourage other countries to take actions18:32
LjLWHO is saying: this is harder to contain than SARS, evne though that's harder to manage clinically18:32
LjLbut China and other countries have shown it's possible to an extent, unlike the flu18:32
LjLso the state of a pandemic is a warning, a warning to other countries to intervene much more strongly, but it's not directed towards us18:32
LjLquestion: about children, there is a study by the ISS published the other day, which says 43 children are affected. can you say anything about that?18:33
LjLanswer: we can say the number of infected children is small, and they appear to get over the disease fairly well, which is good news. the fact there are children with clinical symptoms, though, and the fact that even though who don't have symptoms can be positive (which is from a foreign study), this all reinforces the decision to close all schools18:34
python476https://www.reddit.com/r/wallstreetbets/comments/fdl2bk/dd_trump_knew_about_coronavirus_buy_fucking_puts/18:34
LjLit was necessary to add new measures to that. we must ensure children who are no longer going to school aren't gathering together in other places18:34
LjLwe are looking forward to the results of that18:34
LjL--- end18:35
oxalishttps://www.reuters.com/article/us-health-coronavirus-secrecy-exclusive/exclusive-white-house-told-federal-health-agency-to-classify-coronavirus-deliberations-sources-idUSKBN20Y2LM18:35
oxalisThere you have it.18:35
mefistofelesthanks LjL 18:35
mefistofelesI was wondering what a self-certificate actually means' 18:35
oxalisIf coronavirus response makes Trump look bad, then hold the meetings in the dark and keep the people in the dark.18:36
LjLmefistofeles, it's a form you can download and print, then you fill it in with some simple details (although the space allowed is ridiculously tiny), who you are, where you're coming from, where you're going, and why18:36
LjLif you are later found to have lied, that's criminal18:36
mefistofelesLjL: ok18:36
LjL(although i think it's practically impossible they find out anything)18:36
mefistofelesyeah18:36
BrainstormNew from CNBC Health at 17:34 UTC: (news): Washington state and San Francisco ban large gatherings to slow the coronavirus outbreak → https://is.gd/prHMPa18:37
Brainstorm🔶 World: +2541 cases (now 124919), +196 deaths (now 4580), +41 recoveries (now 66689) 🔶 Italy: +2313 cases (now 12462), +196 deaths (now 827), +41 recoveries (now 1045) 🔶 Germany: +55 cases (now 1908) 🔶 Denmark: +102 cases (now 442) 🔸 Austria: +40 cases (now 246) 🔸 Bahrain: +5 recoveries (now 35) 🔸 Belgium: +2 deaths (now 3) 🔸 Brazil: +1 cases (now 35) 🔸 Brunei: +5 cases (now 11) 🔸 Bulgaria: +118:38
oxalis^ On these reports the +numbers are from when?18:39
oxalissince midnight?18:39
oxalissince the previous report?18:39
LjLoxalis, since the previous report18:39
LjLso it definitely varies how frequent they are18:39
oxalishow often are the reports?18:39
LjLItaly only publishes once a day for instance18:39
LjLother countries could be virtually real time18:39
LjLthe bot polls every ~15 minutes18:40
LjL(or rather, tinwhiskers's site does, then the bot gets data from it)18:40
oxalisso 196 people have died in 15 minutes?18:40
mefistofelesno18:40
LjLi would hope not18:40
slash_Netherlands once a day too, seems US states report at various times18:40
oxaliswhat's the +196?18:40
LjLoxalis, most of it is from Italy18:40
slash_South Korea also reports several times a day18:40
mefistofelesoxalis: from previous day up to 15 minutes ago18:40
LjLwhich publishes once a day18:40
LjL%cases Italy18:40
BrainstormLjL: In all areas, Italy, there are 12462 cases, 827 deaths (6.6% of cases), 1045 recoveries as of Wed Mar 11 18:31:00 2020. See https://offloop.net/covid19/?default=Italy for time series data.18:40
LjLdeath rate keeps getting higher, wonderful18:41
mefistofelesoxalis: in average, that is...18:41
slash_LjL Italy is now in the worst scenario so far..18:42
LjLquite18:42
LjLway worse than China if you look at it population-wise18:42
LjL%wa population of italy18:42
LjL%wa population of prc18:42
BrainstormLjL, Wolfram|Alpha (Italy | population): Result: 59.4 million people (world rank: 23rd) (2017 estimate) → https://www.wolframalpha.com/input/?i=population+of+italy18:42
mefistofelesyeah, explained by age, probably18:42
slash_still talk to people who think the response is an overreaction.. sigh18:42
LjL%wa 12462 / 5940000018:42
mefistofelesalso, not so aggressive policies for containment/quarantine18:42
BrainstormLjL, Wolfram|Alpha (12462/59400000): Decimal approximation: 0.000209797979797979797979797979797979797979797979797979797... → https://www.wolframalpha.com/input/?i=12462+%2F+5940000018:43
BrainstormLjL, failed to get any hits! 18:43
LjL%wa population of china18:43
BrainstormLjL, Wolfram|Alpha (China | population): Result: 1.41 billion people (world rank: 1st) (2017 estimate) → https://www.wolframalpha.com/input/?i=population+of+china18:43
LjL%cases china18:43
BrainstormLjL: In all areas, China, there are 80969 cases, 3162 deaths (3.9% of cases), 61656 recoveries as of Wed Mar 11 03:18:14 2020. See https://offloop.net/covid19/?default=China for time series data.18:43
BrainstormLjL: Mortality can be broadly expected to lie between 1.3% (assuming deaths/cases with ⅔ of cases undetected), and less than 4.9% (considering only deaths and recoveries).18:43
LjL%wa 80969 / 141000000018:43
BrainstormLjL, Wolfram|Alpha (80969/1410000000): Decimal approximation: 0.000057424822695035460992907801418439716312056737588652482... → https://www.wolframalpha.com/input/?i=80969+%2F+141000000018:43
figuinhasLjL are you sure the death rate is getting higher in Italy?18:43
figuinhaswasn't yesterday 6.8%18:43
figuinhasAnd a week ago more than 8%18:43
figuinhas?18:43
LjLthey have *two* zeroes more than we do in the fraction of affected population...18:43
LjLfiguinhas, no, it was around 5%18:44
LjLdefinitely never seen it at 8%18:44
figuinhasdo you have a source of evolution?18:44
LjLit's higher in Lombardy than countrywide, but still not 8%18:44
LjL%cases lombardy18:44
BrainstormLjL: Sorry, lombardy not found. Either there aren't cases, or it's under a different name.18:44
figuinhasI believe I calculated it last week18:44
LjLfiguinhas, what do you mean a source of evolution?18:44
figuinhaslike some entity published the death rate in multiple days18:45
figuinhasor I will have to check in the news18:45
LjLwell doesn't https://offloop.net/covid19/?default=Italy provide it?18:45
LjLbut there is also the civil protection's dashboard18:45
LjLhttps://opendatadpc.maps.arcgis.com/apps/opsdashboard/index.html#/b0c68bce2cce478eaac82fe38d4138b118:46
figuinhasthx18:47
slash_shouldnt death rate be calculated like this: deaths / (recovered + deaths)?18:47
slash_otherwise it will fluctuate very wildly18:47
figuinhasthat is non survivability rate18:48
figuinhasdeath rate is comparing the deaths / infected18:48
figuinhasI mean deaths / cumulative infected18:48
slash_yeah, but we do not know the true amount of infected atm18:48
slash_there are limits to how much people can be tested18:48
figuinhasrecovered / (recovered + deaths) is survivability rate18:49
figuinhasbut it is too soon for data to be reliable in Italy18:49
slash_yeah, that's what I mean. currently it is all just very crude estimates18:50
mefistofelesdeath rate is commonly the case fatality ratio, which is just cases/deaths18:50
slash_until we have more data18:50
mefistofelesor the other way around deaths/cases18:50
Brainstorm🔶 World: +80 cases (now 124999) 🔶 Norway: +80 cases (now 569) 🔸 Austria: +40 cases (now 246) 🔸 Bahrain: +5 recoveries (now 35) 🔸 Belgium: +2 deaths (now 3) 🔸 Brazil: +1 cases (now 35) 🔸 Brunei: +5 cases (now 11) 🔸 Bulgaria: +1 deaths (now 1) 🔸 Canada: +2 cases (now 99) 🔸 China: +2 cases (now 80969), +3 recoveries (now 61656) 🔸 Gansu, China: +2 cases (now 127) 🔸 Sichuan, China: +3 recoveries (now 18:50
mefistofelesthe other specificity and sensitivity measures are not good numbers right now with such little data18:50
BrainstormNew from CNBC Health at 17:47 UTC: (news): Large gatherings banned in San Francisco and Seattle area to slow the coronavirus outbreak → https://is.gd/prHMPa18:51
slash_damn so many European nations are reporting huge increases18:51
slash_!cases germany18:51
mefistofeleswell, it's an exponential function after all18:51
mefistofelesstill peaking18:51
LjLtinwhiskers, how stupid is JHU exactly? look at this now18:51
LjL%cases Vietnam18:51
BrainstormLjL: Sorry, Vietnam not found. Either there aren't cases, or it's under a different name.18:51
LjL%cases Viet Nam18:52
BrainstormLjL: In all areas, Viet Nam, there are 38 cases, 0 deaths (0.0% of cases), 16 recoveries as of Wed Mar 11 11:53:03 2020. See https://offloop.net/covid19/?default=Viet%20Nam for time series data.18:52
mefistofelesonly Korea reached a slowdown already... Japan somehow never had the expontential increase!!18:52
slash_mefistofeles yeah, we are not even near the peak18:52
mefistofeles*exponential18:52
figuinhasMost countries were not testing people with symptoms that have no contacts with confirmed infected18:52
LjLmost countries still aren't18:52
figuinhasECDC at it's best18:52
mefistofelestrue18:52
figuinhasChanged today18:52
figuinhasin most18:52
figuinhasMy country, Portugal18:53
slash_Japan is an odd case yes, they do not seem to take very strict measures so far18:53
figuinhasleaped from 41 to 5918:53
figuinhasin 12 hours18:53
figuinhasdue to this18:53
mefistofelesLjL: what's wrong with Vietnam? Other than they are evidently not testing18:53
mefistofelesThailand as well18:53
slash_vietnam does take very drastic measures tho?18:53
mefistofelesand many latin american countries probably as well18:53
LjLslash_, deaths/cases is flawed because there will be more deaths (not yet counted) from current cases (already counted). however, deaths / (death+recoveries) is usually also flawed due to the time to recovery being very different from the time to death, as well as recoveries being counted a bit weirdly by many countries18:53
LjLmefistofeles, nothing, just that nobody calls it "Viet Nam" in English except apparently the JHU18:54
mefistofelesLjL: I see haha18:54
LjLthey are making it much harder to guess the name of various countries18:54
LjLTaiwan became "Taipei and environs"18:54
slash_LjL yes you are correct.. we are working with very crude numbers and estimates atm18:54
LjLIran became "Iran (Islamic Republic of)", clearly to distinguish it from... the other Iran?!18:54
figuinhasI believe there is a chance many patients died in Italy before detecting the cluster18:54
figuinhasBut I have no sources18:55
LjLslash_, that's why my bot provides a lower and an upper estimate for mortality in the second line, but it only does it for countries where those don't look completely inplausible18:55
twomoonwhere do you see this going from here mefistofeles ?18:55
figuinhasThey were not looking for the disease in the area18:55
twomoonhow is colombia doing?18:55
LjLfiguinhas, yes, there were a few suspicious pneumonias going back to november. they may test post-mortem maybe...18:55
mefistofelestwomoon: the same I actually saw when I first heard the TWIV podcast, probably most of the population getting it eventually and some countries struggling with health care18:56
mefistofelesbut those countries are probably the ones that are already struggling with it so they may not even notice18:56
twomooni expect USA to get hit very hard. i don't think we are leaders in terms of ICU beds or other hospital beds per 100k ciudadanos18:57
mefistofelestwomoon: true18:57
twomoonare rural USA is far worse than urban USA for the most part18:57
mefistofelesbut I don't see it being worse than in Italy, at least for now18:57
twomoonitaly somehow i suspect got hit with a more virulent mutation as well as having a very old population 18:58
mefistofelestwomoon: also rural USA is less likely to get it, so it's not that simple18:58
twomooni dunno man it's showing up in Nebraska now18:58
LjLthere is a joint press statement by Conte and von der Leyen in that link18:58
slash_less population density might slow spread though18:58
LjL(in English)18:58
mefistofelestwomoon: it's the same, just that Italy's population is much older, so they are "playing" in the higher death rate scenario18:59
LjLi see basically no substance18:59
LjLnot much of a surprise18:59
twomoonyes18:59
twomoonljl any updates vis a vis your family?19:00
figuinhasmefistofeles, it is much older, but still not old enough to justify such a big difference in death rate19:00
LjLtwomoon, they're staying at home and trying to remain sane. i brought my sister some things, she's okay19:00
mefistofelesfiguinhas: they say it actually evens it out with China rates19:00
twomoonit depends how those old people are clustered figuinhas . what if they all happen to hang out together playing card games at a local club?19:01
mefistofelesone would have to run the numbers, but getting the info on age is a bit tricky19:01
twomoondoes your sister live wiht you ljl ?19:01
mefistofeles:/19:01
LjLno19:01
twomoonoh ok, coo. stay safe ljl !19:01
LjLi'll try. i had a walk today. tried to stay away from people, wore a (re-used :\) mask, next time i'll ditch the mask, it's just awful to wear19:02
LjLi wonder if surgical masks feel less awful19:02
twomoonyeah i tried my P95 mask it was awful19:02
LjLthis is a "duck" fpp1 mask19:02
LjLnot sure if "duck" describes it19:02
mefistofelesI haven't seen anyone wearing a mask around here, tbh19:02
twomooni hate to say it but western folks in general are "too cool for school" when it comes to wearing masks19:03
mefistofelesit's not that effective either19:03
mefistofelesit can make things worse, as well19:03
twomooneven if it's mildly effective people should still do it right?19:03
freebobby[m]not if it puts healthcare workers in shortage imo19:04
slash_twomoon in EU we have severe lack of masks, it's not possible atm to get majority to wear masks19:04
mefistofelesno if it makes you touch your face more than you should and you are less cautious because you think you are safe, which happens commonly19:04
twomoonthat's 3M's fault. why can't 3M bring online 100 more manufacturing machines 19:04
freebobby[m]according to them they are19:04
twomoonhaha yea mefistofeles i was taking mine off at random intervals and gasping for breath19:04
twomoonso true19:04
slash_twomoon healthcare alone has huge shortage now, and this is with very few people wearing them..19:04
slash_we are simply very badly prepared19:05
freebobby[m]in the midwest, ive seen much more elbow bumps19:05
freebobby[m]instead of handshakes19:05
mefistofelesI'd think having masks for everyone doesn't say well prepared, fwiw19:05
slash_there is one company in the Netherlands that can make masks, they are getting orders from all over the world but they can only produce like 100k a month or so19:05
twomoonslash_, where u at may i ask?19:05
LjLmefistofeles, i have heard too much conflicting information about masks, types of masks, who should wear them... all i know is there is a global shortage, and health workers definitely need them, so if someone thinks by lying about their effectiveness, people will hoard them less... they'll lie19:06
slash_twomoon Netherlands, but the situation is similar all over the EU19:06
twomoonnetherlands has a small cell turning into a big one pretty quickly19:06
LjLfreebobby[m], i don't understand this thing, can't people just say "Hello"19:07
twomoon100k a month is pathetic19:07
izre: masks, i've heard they are really only effective at stopping the spread if you already have it, which is good and extra important for healthcare workers19:07
LjLi always felt weird shaking hands tbh19:07
twomoonman, we're smarter than this. we can make robots and shit19:07
mefistofeleslol19:07
mefistofelesLjL: true19:07
slash_twomoon yes, and this is when we have stopped testing direct family of cases, they are only told to self-isolate for 2 weeks, and will only be tested with severe symptoms19:07
twomoonljl, we need to kill off british culture19:07
izbut if you are just wearing one to try to prevent your own infection, you are probably just causing yourself to touch your face way more than you normally would19:07
twomoondon't ever wear a suit or shake hands.19:07
mefistofeleswhen I'm back at my country I will need to self-quarantine for sure19:07
mefistofeles:/19:08
LjLiz, your face, or your mask instead of your face. whether the latter will help or harm... is arguable, and probably ultimately unknown19:08
twomoonyou don't kiss ppl as a greeting do you?19:08
twomoon=/19:08
mefistofelesnever19:08
mefistofeles:P19:08
mefistofelesnever do that again, ever19:08
twomoonrofl19:08
skyofdustIf it gets bad masks for me will be prohibitive for me. I'm at the end of a sabbatical leave, I wonder how easy will it be to get work on the coming weeks, oh geez, hadn't thought of that.19:08
slash_we do haha, but I think it is a lot less now19:08
slash_we do not kiss as much as the italians though19:08
twomoonlol19:08
slash_only close family/friends usually19:08
twomoonljl control your instinct to kiss bruh19:09
mefistofelesI find kissing weird, tbh19:09
LjLslash_, when we do the cheek kissing thing, much of the time we aren't even actually touching though, it's kind of a gesture. it's more like, if you touch the other's face while doing it, it's no big deal (usually! obviously a big deal now) but it's kind of accidental19:09
LjLleast here in Milan19:09
slash_mefistofeles i always hate the cheek kissing yes, it's quite nasty lol19:09
mefistofeles:/19:10
slash_LjL yeah it's something like that here too, but you always have those people who feel the need to do a very wet triple kiss on the cheeks ugh19:10
mefistofelesugh19:10
LjLslash_, like people who'll shake your hand energetically and for about one full minute19:11
mefistofelesnow with that on my mind, I should have some dinner xD19:11
slash_LjL yes.. just let go of my hand omg... maybe we are not that different from Italians haha19:11
mefistofelessame in many latin american countries, fwiw19:12
twomooni wonder if the cheek kissing habit explains higher virulence in italy19:12
mefistofelesI don't think so19:12
slash_well it doesn't help19:12
LjLslash_, i cannot say that here in public without causing... problems... but i feel northern italy's culture is sometimes closer to other countries in europe than it is to southern italy :P19:12
twomoonmaybe the virus seeds itself with more particles initially when it infects someone because there was greater proximity due to the kissing stuff19:12
mefistofelesLjL: and that's good?19:12
freebobby[m]re: effectivness of masks https://imgur.com/gallery/iqm6nzW19:12
twomoonso the virus multiplies exponentially starting from a much higher virus count19:13
twomoonand the onset is much quicker in some people19:13
twomoonyou going out for dinner mefistofeles ?19:14
twomoonlol just eat canned beans bro19:14
mefistofelestwomoon: nah, I'm going out, I'm already out, btw19:14
LjLmefistofeles, i don't know19:14
mefistofelesgoing to the university mensa and watch a football game as well19:14
twomoonokay man, choose hot steamy food over room temp food19:14
mefistofeleslots of people19:14
mefistofelesas it should19:14
twomoonlol Mensa 19:14
twomoonam i interpreting that wrong19:14
mefistofelestwomoon: I don't know, how are you interpreting it?19:15
twomoonMensa the international 'club' for 'smart ppl'19:15
LjLmefistofeles, i know when this whole thing started and we all panicked, a computer magazine published an article with Google Trends that i found sort of enlightening: the regions that had searched for "coronavirus" were the expected northern regions, the ones hit, Lombardy first... but those that searched for "hand sanitizer" were 5 southern regions, and only after those came some northern ones19:15
slash_LjL there is bound to be customs that are shared in many european countries, I went to north Italy a few times at the Garda lake (lago di Garda?) the people there are much more friendly than over here lol (but maybe it was because I was a tourist)19:15
LjLmefistofeles, now considering there was a lot of speculation on masks and hand gel, being sold on ebay, amazon or the black market for extortionate prices, i kind of wondered just how much southern italians cared for us at all19:15
mefistofeleslol19:16
mefistofelesI mean, it's always a good time for doing business xD19:16
twomoonlol 19:16
LjLmefistofeles, yeah, they do seem to have that sort of attitude19:16
mefistofelestwomoon: ah nah, it's just the university student restaurant thing19:16
LjLMilan too, but a bit differently :\19:16
twomooncoo . remember mefistofeles order something very hot and steamy19:16
mefistofelesLjL: yeah, they sure look similar to latin americans in some ways19:16
twomoonie, no hamburgers19:17
slash_where do you think LATIN comes from? :P19:17
mefistofelestwomoon: haha ok, but don't worry19:17
twomoonlol19:17
mefistofelesslash_: language, not culture ;)19:17
mefistofeleswell, not whole culture19:17
LjLmefistofeles, there was a fairly large emigration wave from Italy to various Latin American countries. i believe in Argentina, it was mainly *northern* Italians, somehow, but elsewhere it was mainly southern19:17
twomoonljl i never asked you this but are you more latin or more germanic?19:18
mefistofelesyes, in Argentina you get a lot of italian culture, not so much in the norther parts of south america, though19:18
mefistofeles*northern19:18
slash_mefistofeles yes of course I am oversimplifying :P but southern Europeans do look a lot like people from South and Central America (mostly, the are of course regions where this is not so)19:18
LjLtwomoon, that's not a question i have any idea how to answer :P19:18
LjLtwomoon, i can pronounce ö and ü19:19
twomooni need entertainment while i'm quarantined bro!19:19
twomoonhahaha19:19
LjLbut you aren't even quarantined, i am19:19
twomooni'm pseudo-self-quaranteening19:19
mefistofeleshe's paranoid19:19
LjLwell, countries aren't being paranoid *enough*, so maybe that's faily okay19:20
LjLfairly19:20
LjLbut possibly faily also19:20
LjLwe'll see19:20
mefistofelesI don't think so, tbh19:20
twomooni'm imagining you pseudo-self-quaranteening when you arrive back to colombia. riding your bike constantly at 40km/hr thinking the virus won't stick to your body surfaces at that speed =/19:20
mefistofelesmost likely19:20
mefistofelesxD19:20
slash_you're gonna sweat a lot bicycling at 40km/hr19:21
twomoongo live in the forest for a while like you've always wanted 19:21
mefistofelesthanks for telling others where I'm from without my consent, btw19:21
mefistofeles:P19:21
twomooni thought you told everyone already sorry19:21
mefistofeleshaha no, but no worries19:21
twomoonok i'll shut up now19:21
slash_there is people from all over the world here :p19:21
skyofdustYup.19:21
mefistofelesso, let me load these trajectories and off I go!19:22
slash_we only speak english because the Brits conquered like most countries in the past19:22
skyofdustSadly yes, and it's the language of the current empire.19:23
skyofdustThat sounded less drammatic in my head.19:23
slash_if the Brits didn't take new Amsterdam we might be speaking Dutch!19:23
figuinhasslash_ this is off topic,  but I think english is the easiest language to learn19:23
figuinhasin the world19:23
mefistofelesskyofdust: haha19:23
slash_although that is something I do not wish upon anyone else19:23
mefistofelesanything with empire gets dramatic instantly19:23
twomoonspanish is more consistent than english19:24
mefistofelesfiguinhas: is it? I think like most chinese would disagree19:24
figuinhasI have this friend that has that problem that he can't right properly19:24
slash_figuinhas I agree, but this is maybe because of so many english media here (tv/movies/games/etc)19:24
figuinhasNo19:24
twomooni think spanish is easier to learn but we need to get rid of the n with the tilde over it and replace it with the 'gn' like italian19:24
figuinhasit is too simple19:24
figuinhaseven for chinese19:24
skyofdustOh yeah no kidding, I learned english with Mario RPG and Final Fantasy VI.19:24
slash_figuinhas i really cannot judge, I see native English speakers have issues with there/their/they're but to me19:25
skyofdustI was attending english classes, but understanding that media motivated me.19:25
figuinhas... for chinese, compared to learn portuguese or french19:25
figuinhasMy friend is portuguese as me19:25
figuinhasHe writes better in english19:25
figuinhasthan he does in portuguese19:25
figuinhasand he uses portuguese daily19:25
figuinhasand I know this walish woman19:26
figuinhasthat her son had to change from walish school to english school19:26
twomoonhow can that be? 19:26
figuinhasbecause he had that problem19:26
figuinhasthat you change the letters19:26
figuinhaswhat is it called19:26
slash_tbh, English grammar makes more sense to me than Dutch grammer19:26
twomoonhow is it possible to write better in english that one's own native language19:26
slash_well, my language doesn't make any sense19:27
figuinhasbecause he knows both languages well19:27
twomooni understand that portuguese writers don't usually use much punctuation19:27
figuinhasand english is more simple19:27
slash_the rules are: "it's like this because it is like this"19:27
figuinhasnot so many words19:27
figuinhasno so many sounds19:27
twomooni remember reading some brazilian newspapers are was surprised at how few commas there were19:27
oxalisI don't know anything but English and some spanish. and I'm here to say, the English language is fuckd19:27
twomoonand was surprised*19:27
figuinhaswhat have I done19:27
figuinhashow is this related to covid19:28
mefistofelesoh hell, I cannot visualize these trajectories on my machine :(19:28
mefistofelesI need to download more ram19:28
twomoonproblem of changing letters? not sure what to call that19:28
LjLhey you know i do have ##language19:28
figuinhasI actually don't like the portuguese keyboard for example19:28
figuinhasfor programming is a nightmare19:29
figuinhasalways having to use shift19:29
skyofdustlol19:29
figuinhasthat is not portuguese19:29
python476twomoon: nostalgia19:29
oxalistengo un caganer de Trump19:29
figuinhasoxalis that is inapropriate19:30
oxalisIt's catalonian19:30
figuinhasoh19:30
LjLit's not catalonian19:30
figuinhasthe toy?19:30
LjLat least not the "tengo" part19:30
oxalisyes19:30
oxalistengo is "I have"19:30
LjL... in spanish19:30
LjLit's "tinc" in catalan19:30
oxalisdid I just say something awefull?19:31
LjLbut really, ##language :)19:31
twomoonlol i just found out what a caganer is19:31
figuinhasoxalis you said you have a toy of Trump taking a number 219:31
oxalisyes... caganer.com19:31
oxalisIt's a thing19:31
slash_wat19:31
tinwhiskersMorning folks. So we're in a pandemic now. That's good news.19:31
oxalisthe version I have, he's pooping on the US constitution19:32
slash_good evening tinwhiskers :P19:32
LjLtinwhiskers, also we're talking about languages having words for pooping figurines in nativity scenes, somehow19:32
figuinhasis this about the pandemic?19:32
LjLalso there's a helicopter seemingly hovering above us19:32
figuinhasI tought it was about the desease19:32
oxalisStrictly speaking, it's a figurine not a toy19:32
Brainstorm🔶 Veneto, Italy: +167 cases (now 1023), +3 deaths (now 29), +7 recoveries (now 54) 🔶 Toscana, Italy: +56 cases (now 320), +2 recoveries (now 5) 🔶 Marche, Italy: +85 cases (now 479), +5 deaths (now 18) 🔶 Lombardia, Italy: +1489 cases (now 7280), +149 deaths (now 617), +4 recoveries (now 900) 🔶 Liguria, Italy: +53 cases (now 194) 🔶 Emilia Romagna, Italy: +206 cases (now 1739), +28 deaths (now 113), +7 reco19:32
figuinhasI never heard the word figurine before19:32
figuinhasSo yesterday19:33
oxalisI little character doll for display19:33
figuinhasI installed tinder19:33
figuinhasbecause of the pandemic19:33
figuinhasI am now going to meet women online19:33
slash_you're planning to repopulate the earth?19:33
figuinhasI wasn't thinking that way19:34
figuinhasbut it sounds a deeply honorable mission19:34
LjLthere really was a helicopter hovering above my street for a while19:35
LjLnot quite above my building but almost19:35
LjL%cases lombardia19:35
Brainstorm🔶 World: +92 cases (now 125115), +5 deaths (now 4585) 🔶 US: +58 cases (now 1109) 🔸 Austria: +40 cases (now 246) 🔸 Bahrain: +5 recoveries (now 35) 🔸 Belgium: +2 deaths (now 3) 🔸 Brazil: +1 cases (now 35) 🔸 Brunei: +5 cases (now 11) 🔸 Bulgaria: +1 deaths (now 1) 🔸 Canada: +2 cases (now 99) 🔸 Chile: +6 cases (now 23) 🔸 China: +2 cases (now 80969), +3 recoveries (now 61656) 🔸 Gansu, China: +2 cases (19:35
oxaliswere they checking for people that were not supposed to be out?19:36
BrainstormLjL: In Lombardia, Italy, there are 7280 cases, 617 deaths (8.5% of cases), 900 recoveries as of Wed Mar 11 17:00:00 2020. See https://offloop.net/covid19/?default=Lombardia for time series data.19:36
oxalis%cases Deep South19:36
Brainstormoxalis: Sorry, Deep South not found. Either there aren't cases, or it's under a different name.19:36
LjLoxalis, considering i met no police or anything when i went out earlier today, that seems unlikely19:36
slash_that happens here too, military trains nearby occasionally19:36
figuinhasLjL is the helicopter related subject related with the coronavirus?19:36
LjLfiguinhas, depending on what the helicopter was here for, i dunno19:36
oxalis^19:36
figuinhasI installed tinder19:37
figuinhasBecause...19:37
figuinhasI need a girlfriend, in case we can't get out of home19:38
figuinhasIn case I don't get a girlfriend19:38
figuinhaswhat sex toy can I buy as a substitute19:38
twomoonlol19:38
figuinhasto survive this outbrak?19:38
python476god I can't imagine pornhub stats right now19:38
LjLdon't push it19:38
LjLi can see what you're doing, and it's not funny19:38
python476plus the new fetishes19:38
slash_lmao19:38
python476hot milf in hazmat suit19:39
commandocrypto[mcan someone explain how lombardy had less than 100 cases less than 10 days ago, and yet now is claiming 900 recoveries??? If they actually think that ppl recover in 10 days - are they in the middle of shooting off their other foot??19:39
twomoondamn lombard region has 8%+ mortality 19:39
figuinhasI think it is part of the subject19:39
figuinhasbut if it is not19:39
figuinhasI will no longer talk about my struggle19:39
LjLcommandocrypto[m, i barely look at recoveries, everyone seems to calculate them differently, and in many countries' graph they have sudden spikes19:39
LjLtwomoon, yes, that IS something i look at :(19:39
commandocrypto[mthis is a pretty on-topic chat, figuinhas  19:40
LjLfiguinhas, there was a discussion that had veered offtopic for a while, so i just gently noted there is another channel for that. it's not like i'm banning people for making one offtopic comment... but then, after the helicopter thing, which i noted because it was somewhat alarming, you started seeing how far you could push the "it'll be okay as long as i connect it to the coronavirus" concept. that's one thing ops generally don't like19:41
commandocrypto[mLjL:  same - i'm geniunely wondering if the medical workers and authorities in europe are even aware of really important precautions at this point19:41
LjLcommandocrypto[m, considering 12% of the sick in italy are medical personnel?19:41
slash_they are telling medical personnal that show any sign of illness to go home and rest and recoup19:42
slash_because soon they might be doing very harsh hours19:42
slash_so they should be as healthy as possible while they still have the opportunity19:43
LjLslash_, but here, medical personnel who tests positive but has no symptoms is allowed (encouraged?) to continue working, as long as... they wear a mask19:43
LjLat least that was my understanding19:44
slash_LjL yes I read that as well19:44
LjLon the other hand, can you blame anyone for this policy, when you consider also the policy of letting people oevr 65 or 70 or with comorbidites just die because there aren't enough ICUs for everybody?19:44
LjLi mean, yes, you can, you can blame the government for not acting during the several weeks the epidemic panned out in China19:44
figuinhasslash_ I think they are already making harsh hours19:44
figuinhasthere are some news referring19:45
slash_fignuinhas here it is still "under control" (well, not overwhelmed at least), so the idea is that they can now get healthy for when it gets worse19:45
figuinhasChina is going to send experts19:46
BrainstormNew from BBC Health at 18:41 UTC: (news): Coronavirus: Biggest daily rise as UK cases reach 460 → https://is.gd/zuBQHY19:46
aradeshwhy do our leaders keep telling us that it's inevitable that most of us will get it, when china, a country much larger with a lot more densely populated areas than us, has managed to contain it?19:46
freelock<commandocrypto[m "can someone explain how lombardy"> how about they actually got ahold of some tests?19:46
figuinhas*medical experts19:46
freelockhttps://www.king5.com/article/news/health/coronavirus/seattle-woman-recovered-from-coronavirus-shares-her-story/281-126b5ec3-27f1-4e87-b488-2c7a9c67f34a19:46
LjLfreelock, testing negative after just ten days is pretty rare though, i believe19:46
LjLfreelock, i get an access denied on that page, not sure if it's just me19:47
slash_aradesh because we in Europe are not trying to contain it anymore it seems to me... only mitigation (slowing down virus)19:47
freelock... here in King County, the epicenter of the US outbreak, I've heard lots of stories of people with potential exposure, with symptoms, and even with conditions that put them in a high risk category not being able to get tested19:48
figuinhasI have to go19:48
aradeshslash_: why dont they try?19:48
freelockthat's a story about a woman who went to a dinner party, got sick, and actually was part of an influenza study that randomly chose her sample to test for COVID-19, and came back positive19:49
figuinhaskeep up the good work guys19:49
figuinhasthanks for creating the channel19:49
twomoonljl is multimorbiliti a adj or noun?19:49
slash_aradesh this is something that needs a truly global response, if too many countries fail the virus cannot be container... perhaps they expected this?19:49
LjLtwomoon, in what language? that's not a word for me in either english or italian O.o19:49
slash_aradesh I mean, we cannot lock down countries for years right19:49
twomoonoh ok nevermind. yeah italian. google translated it as 'multimorbable'19:50
freelockI suspect we have a huge number of people here that have already been infected... but our numbers look terrible, 10% fatality rate19:50
aradeshwe'd have a vaccine eventually though19:50
aradesh10%? where?19:50
freelock(I think mainly because they're only testing dead people!?!?!)19:50
freelock!cases Washington19:50
twomooni wonder what they mean by multimorbably disease. one that can kill in your several different ways?19:50
figuinhasslash_ I have been following the situation for a while19:50
slash_aradesh a vaccine will make it manageable, it won't make the virus go away. this is as infectous as the flu, and we cannot eradicate the flu either with vaccines19:51
freelock... we had 51 cases 2 days ago, and some 20 deaths19:51
figuinhasin my opinion the CDC and specially the ECDC did not take as serious as they could have this pandemic19:51
LjLtwomoon, i think normally what they mean is that you die *from* multiple diseases and it's hard to establish which one killed you exactly19:52
figuinhasthe european countries have been following ECDC recommendations19:52
slash_figuinhas a lot of countries failed on this tbh19:52
LjLtwomoon, which is something that can make death figures from different countries (or even different regions within Italy, or provinces in China) hard to compare19:52
twomoonoh ok ljl suddenly it makes more sense19:52
figuinhasbut ECDC have not been following WHO or China advice as much as they could19:52
LjLfiguinhas, i'm only now starting to hear anything from the EU on this epidemic at all. they've seemed so... utterly silent19:53
slash_EU nations at least have been focusing more on preventing panic than preventing spread, and still seem to be unwilling to implement proper containment measures19:53
figuinhasI checked an inner statement, I think kynda 3 weeks ago19:54
twomoondid you like how Merkel admitted that 100% of germans could get covid, ljl ?19:54
slash_my country is doing less than Italy when it had similar number of cases... and we are much smaller (NL)19:54
figuinhasThey were predicting the possible situation of containment not being possible19:55
skyofdust%data mexico19:55
Brainstormskyofdust: In all areas, Mexico, there are 8 cases, 0 deaths (0.0% of cases), 4 recoveries as of Wed Mar 11 19:40:00 2020. See https://offloop.net/covid19/?default=Mexico for time series data.19:55
figuinhasand the focus on mitigation19:55
figuinhasdon't interpret me wrong19:55
figuinhasI said possibility19:56
aradeshi wonder when work will start telling me to work from home19:56
figuinhasmine already did19:56
LjLtwomoon, it made my blood freeze for a while, but yeah, i prefer it to lies19:56
figuinhasfrom next week on19:56
aradeshalso, i've been hearing lots of peolpe with nasty coughs while i've been out and about...19:56
aradeshmaybe i'm just noticing it more because of this thing, but... i dunno19:56
figuinhasaradesh are you from a country affected seriously by the coronavirus?19:57
aradeshthe UK19:57
figuinhasI went with a couple to a music concert on friday19:57
slash_aradesh I have the same thing, but I think it's because you are just much more aware of it now19:57
figuinhasand they are now sick19:57
figuinhasI am concerned about it19:57
twomoonljl contrast Merkel's admission and openness to what Trump and co are doing19:57
figuinhasThey are my friends19:58
slash_aradesh also touching things in public transport, it just seems so filthy now lol19:58
figuinhasguys19:58
figuinhasreally have to go19:58
figuinhascatch an overcrowded train19:58
slash_tinder date?19:58
figuinhasnah19:58
figuinhasI just installed it19:58
LjLslash_, i would recommend against *using* public transport if at all possible :(19:58
figuinhasbut already two girls liked me19:59
figuinhasLjL good advice19:59
slash_LjL I try, but I have to use it at least once every 2 weeks for a long range trip.. so could be worse19:59
figuinhasbut I have to catch this one19:59
figuinhasslash_20:00
figuinhasUK cases are escalating20:00
LjLslash_, stab someone who's wearing a mask and wear it first20:00
slash_LjL well for now at least20:00
LjL(disclaimer: not serious advice)20:00
figuinhasnot sure you will be able to do that20:00
BrainstormNew from r/WorldNews Live at 18:46 UTC: /u/slakmehl: McClatchyDC su Twitter: "North Carolina has more than 10.5 million people. And just 300 coronavirus tests left. https://t.co/l8tvFHluGQ" → https://is.gd/uRJOqb20:00
figuinhasthe next time20:00
slash_LjL I'll try to stab someone next time thanks!20:00
LjLi have worn a mask today that i had worn the other day. that's against most official advice, and yet, i did it anyway20:01
LjLi'm also pondering ways to clean masks that seem reasonable. cleaning masks is also against official advice20:01
LjLbut, then, there is the fact that wearing masks *at all* is also against "official advice"20:01
slash_maybe soak it in alcohol? not sure if its actually possible to disinfect those N95 masks20:01
LjLslash_, yeah, either that, or steam-clean it, are the options i'm considering20:02
LjLit's not an N95, just a horrible to wear FPP1 mask20:02
mefistofelesuse the alcohol for the molotov better, works best with a mask20:02
LjLmolotov?20:02
mefistofelesnvm20:02
mefistofeles:P20:02
slash_yes throwing molotovs keeps people away20:02
LjLoh20:02
LjLgood idea20:02
slash_I mean what are they gonna do? arrest you??20:03
LjLmaybe strap a jacket with dynamite-like sticks coming out of it and a push button around me?20:03
LjLthat should let me take public transport safely20:03
mefistofelesslash_: they can't if you are self-certificated20:03
slash_(yes btw, do not try this at home, or on the streets, etc)20:03
LjLslash_, well, no, they're gonna shoot me20:03
slash_but it's illegal to shoot people20:04
LjLonly for some20:04
LjLwoah Guardian20:04
mefistofelesThe guardian view on the guardian view20:04
mefistofelesmeta view20:04
aradeshi thought that said, "we are all kenyans now" lol20:04
LjLfive article, and none of them makes me want to click on it20:05
dTaldo not soak your paper filters in alcohol, they will degrade20:05
dTalmy advice would be to bake them20:05
mefistofelesLjL: most of Guardian's article are kinda crappy, tbh20:05
LjLdTal, so i've heard... but then i haven't heard of any other methods that would make it better. "just use a new mask" is certainly good advice, if you have those20:05
LjLdTal, hmm, that'd take a while, but hadn't thought of that20:06
slash_dTal doesn't paper become very fragile after baking?20:06
mefistofelesthat's bread20:06
LjLprobably if you bake it at 240°©20:06
LjLalso C20:06
dTalyou don't need to bake them at 900C, just 100 will do20:06
slash_900C? what kind of ovens do you people have20:06
mefistofeleshaha20:06
LjLslash_, italians have a pizza oven fit as standard in most kitchens obviously20:07
dTaljust an exaggeration for effect :)20:07
slash_but, won't baking them a few times at 100C also degrade the masks?20:07
LjLprobably, but what won't?20:07
slash_yeah that's true20:07
LjLi'm trying to maximize the ability to use 3 masks. total.20:07
dTalMy worry is it's difficult to test for degradation20:07
slash_it's hard to determine if they are properly desinfected too20:08
skyofdustWhy not put them in boiling water for a few seconds? Like blanching vegetables?20:08
AlbrightRun 'em through the dishwasher20:08
LjLdTal, but then, there was also this piece i'd been reading... it countered a bit the notion that anything beyond an N95 (or FPP2/3) mask is useless, by saying that while they do not guarantee they'll stop 95% of particles of the required size, in practice, many do, and it's a matter of probabilities anyway. which is what makes me think that wearing a reused mask, at least if it's cleaned somehow, has decent chances to be better than wearing none at all...20:09
LjLAlbright, already did that20:09
LjLby accident though ;(20:09
LjLi might not reuse that one!20:09
LjLAlbright, wait, no, you said dishwasher. i ran it through the washing machine20:09
AlbrightI was joking, but how do you accidentally put a mask in… oh okay20:10
LjLyeah, i'm stupid20:10
slash_the virus also seems to handle cold poorly, maybe rotate the masks and keep the used ones in low temperature (like a shed/outside somewhere)?20:10
dTalskyofdust: it's paper. Water + paper = not good20:10
slash_sorry I meant, heat it handles heat poorly20:10
slash_so the opposite of what I suggested (keep it in a warm place)20:10
LjLslash_, well i sweated today but i fear it's not *quite* that hot yet20:10
LjLdTal, i must say though, even the one that ended up in the washing machine, it doesn't *look* much different from the ones that didn't. i realize looking at it with my bare eye doesn't tell much20:11
LjLbut... actually, i do have a USB microscope, don't i20:11
oxalisare we still talking about caganers?20:11
slash_LjL sunshine also kills the virus apparently, maybe put it someplace it gets hit by the sun20:11
LjLdoes anyone care to see what my masks (washing machine'd and not) look like under a microscope20:11
AlbrightWe have the virus spreading in areas where it's already summer like South America and sub-Saharan Africa, so is the "it won't spread so much in heat" thing confirmed really?20:11
mefistofeleso/20:11
dTalLjL: wait, are we talking about disposable N95s?20:13
slash_it's doesn't prevent it fully, but it appears to reduce spread as it dies faster outside the body when it's hotter (like influenza)20:13
slash_Albright, sorry that was meant as a response to you20:13
dTalI was thinking about respirator cartridges, which I don't think would handle the washing machine well at all20:13
BrainstormNew from BBC Health at 18:56 UTC: Coronavirus: Biggest daily rise as UK cases reach 460: The NHS confirms two more patients with coronavirus have died in the UK, bringing the total to eight. → https://is.gd/zuBQHY20:14
dTalThough I suppose all the same points apply.20:14
oxalisaren't people cutting up braziers now for masks?20:14
mefistofelesIndia closing its frontiers with 7 countries with most cases20:14
AlbrightWhat does it mean to close a disputed, militarized border?20:16
slash_in the case of India, it's probably referring to Kashmir20:18
slash_does anyone have a news source about it?20:19
mefistofeleswhole India, that'swhat I've read20:19
python476https://youtu.be/IzXQ6Bu9JVI20:19
python47611 March, Italy and the United States -- Dr John Campbell20:20
mefistofeles%title20:22
Brainstormmefistofeles: From youtu.be: 11 March, Italy and the United States - YouTube20:22
mefistofeleslol20:22
BrainstormNew from CNBC Health at 19:20 UTC: (news): Ex-FDA chief on coronavirus: Governments must follow lead of businesses and impose more restrictions → https://is.gd/1D02Mo20:28
LjLdTal, we're talking about worse than N95 unfortunately, just FPP1s... but the washing machine was definitely not intentional20:28
darsieHow effective is washing hands with water with soap and without soap?20:29
slash_regular soap is probably the best20:30
darsieIt's bad for the skin.20:30
slash_yeah20:30
LjLdarsie, soap melts away your oils, which results in washing away most pathogens too, although if it results in dry hands that's not great20:30
oxalisGood question - I suppose using soap would break down the natural oils on the skin and help to dislodge viruses that are adhering to the oils20:30
slash_washing with alcohol based sanitizer is even worse20:30
slash_but, washing with just water is pretty useless20:31
slash_just use soap + some moisturizer20:31
darsieI guess non soap detergent is just as good.20:31
darsiesoap being sodium salts of fatty acids.20:31
oxalisdoesn't the moisturizer make your hands sticky/greasy and cause more microbes to adhere ?20:32
slash_detergents are usually worse than soap for your skin20:32
darsieSome are even advertised as pH neutral.20:32
slash_oxalis yes, maybe just use it at home20:32
oxaliswhat's the difference between a detergent, a soap, and a surfactant?20:32
darsieI thought detergent and surfactant are the same.20:33
darsiesoap is sodium salts of fatty acids.20:33
darsieIt's alkaline.20:33
oxalissoap?20:33
darsieneutralizes the acidic protection of the skin.20:33
darsieyes20:33
LjLas far as removing pathogens go, i think any surfactants will work, so if you don't like soap, or a given soap, any other should work. about effects on the skin i'm not so sure... i'd also just use moisturizing cream if your hands get dry20:33
slash_darsie ph neutral means ph of 0, skin is 5.520:33
darsieneutral pH is 7.20:33
oxalisso soap is caustic?20:34
slash_yeah sorry, 7 idd, but it's not the same as skin20:34
darsieNot really caustic. It won't dissolve you quickly.20:34
python476oxalis: isnt soap basic ?20:34
darsiebasic and alkaline are the same.20:34
python476yes20:34
oxalisIsn't caustic also alkaline?20:35
python476oh caustic too ..20:35
python476stupid me20:35
python476yeah my bad20:35
tinwhiskersSurfactants are compounds that lower the surface tension (or interfacial tension) between two liquids, between a gas and a liquid, or between a liquid and a solid. Surfactants may act as detergents, wetting agents, emulsifiers, foaming agents, and dispersants20:35
darsiecaustic is dissolving tissue. Acids are caustic, too.20:35
oxalisah20:35
darsieSome acids.20:35
darsieDNA is not caustic.20:35
tinwhiskersBoth soap and detergent are surfactants20:36
python476vitamin c is caustic20:36
python476hence the c20:36
python476jk20:36
oxalistinwhiskers: so, what IS a surfactant?20:36
tinwhiskerslol20:36
python476yeah and historically caustic was mostly about soda lye20:36
python476surfactants are very thin volumetants20:37
python476jk20:37
slash_but really, regular soap is fine to wash your hands20:38
darsieA detergent is a surfactant or a mixture of surfactants with cleansing properties in dilute solutions. Surfactants are compounds that lower the surface tension (or interfacial tension) between two liquids, between a gas and a liquid, or between a liquid and a solid.20:38
darsie^wikipedia20:38
oxalisso, hydrophobic coatings are surfactants?20:39
python476i dont even get how surface tension lowering works20:39
darsieidk20:39
tinwhiskersoxalis: I don't think hydrophobic things are surfactants. Quite the opposite.20:40
tinwhiskersI think even salty water is a surfactant, but I might be wrong20:40
twomoonwater itself is a surfactant20:41
tinwhiskersrather, salt20:41
python476i think yo mamma is a surfactant20:41
python476*this free joke was offered to you by facebook.com*20:41
aradeshseems to me like our governments in europe, are more concerned about economy and GDP than saving a few million old people who they pay pensions to.20:41
BrainstormNew from BBC Health at 19:25 UTC: Coronavirus: Biggest daily rise as UK cases reach 460: The NHS confirms two more patients with coronavirus have died in the UK, bringing the total to eight. → https://is.gd/zuBQHY20:41
darsietwomoon: Does water lower the surface tension ... of what?20:41
oxalishttps://i.imgur.com/XpbVKP0.jpg20:42
aradeshsorry to sound conspiratorial, but if our governments just let coronavirus spread around without serious attempts at quartining, stopping all flights from infected areas, then they'll have the deaths on their hands.20:42
aradeshquarentining*20:42
aradeshquarantining*20:43
Albrightoxalis: Jesus, tell me that's not real20:43
slash_yeah they call it the "boomerpocalypse"20:43
slash_but that doesnt really make sense because all those leaders are old and boomers themselves20:43
aradeshyeah, but the boomers probably aren't voting for them.20:43
aradeshor maybe they are, who knows20:43
ubLIX*a few million old people who, disabled and medically ill people, and poor people20:43
aradeshyup20:44
AlbrightAlso, how can a 2/2 be only $110 more expensive than a studio? What sense does that make? Heck, the 1/1 is more expensive.20:44
oxalisWelcome to Austin20:44
oxalissome of the highest real estate costs in the US20:44
AlbrightNaah, that's gotta be fake.20:44
python476`Surfactants will diffuse in water and adsorb at interfaces between air and water or at the interface between oil and water, in the case where water is mixed with oil.`20:44
python476that's all i understand20:44
oxalisthe prices are real20:44
python476aradesh: 10$ their first thought was "retirement fund issues: gone"20:45
slash_well if a shitload of old people die housing prices will drop I suppose..20:45
oxalisPrices in Florida my finally go down20:45
python476then Florida will go down20:45
slash_Florida is already slowly sinking in the ocean anyway20:45
twomoondunno darsie 20:46
AlbrightI had a 1K in Tokyo, one stop away from Shinjuku, that was only like US$750 a month. But every other person I tell about living in Tokyo asks me, "Wasn't it so expensive to live there?" pssh. I can't pay that little for rent in freakin' Boise.20:46
AlbrightGranted, the economy changed a bit between those two points in time.20:47
twomoonwhat's a '1K' ?20:47
slash_you can get a small studio in a shitty neighborhood for €600/month (no utilities included) in Rotterdam, the Netherlands20:47
slash_which is cheap20:47
twomoonthat seems cheap, but does it come with a hot water heater?20:47
Albrighttwomoon: Basically a studio but with a separate kitchen20:48
slash_water and heating is not included in that price20:48
twomoonbut do i have to install my own heater like in latin america?20:48
slash_so add around €90-13020:48
slash_no20:48
twomoonoh ok 20:48
slash_but the rent is just you being able to live there, no power, water, heating etc included20:49
twomoonyeah i'm used to that20:49
twomoonaltho here most of the time water is included in rent 20:49
slash_you will also pay a 'service fee', which is for cleaning and maintenance of the building20:51
slash_maintenance inside apartment is covered by the rent though20:51
pwr22tinwhiskers: looks like http://offloop.net/covid19h/unconfirmed.csv is a bit broken20:51
slash_I once paid €250 a year for window cleaning, and the windows where cleaned once in the two years that I lived there...20:52
pwr22Right at the top of the file20:52
darsieAre there public exponents of exponential spread by region?20:52
slash_had bird poop on 1 window for almost 2 years lol20:52
freelock... and they just closed down Seattle Public Schools for 2 weeks20:52
freelockhttps://www.seattletimes.com/seattle-news/education/seattle-public-schools-to-close-for-two-weeks-in-light-of-coronavirus-concerns/20:53
slash_freelock what I wonder with those things is, where do the kids go? arent parents working usually? sending them to grandparents seems a worse idea...20:53
oxalishttps://www.texastribune.org/2020/03/11/coronavirus-texas-community-spread-may-be-montgomery-county/20:54
slash_do they roam free? like zebras20:54
freelocklots of companies here have gone 100% remote20:54
oxalis(Montgomery County is in the Houston area - one of the largest metros in USA)20:54
pwr22%cases uk20:54
BrainstormValueError: invalid literal for int() with base 10: '' (file "/home/brainstorm/brainstorm/bot/modules/covid.py", line 65, in covid)20:54
oxalisoops20:54
slash_freelocks that helps, but there's lots of jobs that cannot be done remote20:55
oxalis0/0cases johnny drop tables20:55
twomoonslash_, the landlord (owner) should just pay that fee. it complicates shit when they pass those fees onto the renter. really stupid20:55
slash_freelocks cant stock a supermarket like that I think :p20:55
freelockI've been coming in to our co-working space, which feels kind of empty... lunch spot that normally has a line around the corner had 5 people eating there at the peak of the lunch rush20:55
pwr22Yeah same bug as mine20:55
BrainstormNew from CNBC Health at 19:52 UTC: (news): Ex-FDA chief on coronavirus: Governments must follow lead of businesses and impose more restrictions → https://is.gd/1D02Mo20:55
freelockyeah there's already restaurants that have gone out of business here due to lack of customers20:56
slash_twomoon it has to do with rental subsidies which only applies to the housing, not utilities. It is a complicated mess ugh..20:57
twomoonlol goddamnit20:57
yuriwhoMy wifes company (contract pharma) laid off ~4% of R&D, and mandatory 2/days per month off unpaid for all employees + additional 1 week off for my wife (volunteered), all due to work slowdown and shortages of chemical starting materials from China20:57
yuriwhothis is in Canada20:57
slash_twomoon I am so glad I bought a house haha, don't have to deal with all that nonsense anymore20:57
oxalishttps://giffiles.alphacoders.com/104/104400.gif20:58
twomoongod i gotta get out of the rental game 20:58
twomoonrenting from parents is a step up but still bad20:59
twomoonneed to move to different state bro20:59
slash_twomoon having parents as landlords doesnt seem that bad though20:59
pwr22!cases uk21:00
oxalis!cases montgomery county21:01
oxalis!cases houston21:01
pwr22oxalis: the data is broken atm so it is blank21:02
oxalisah21:02
oxalisall of it... gotcha21:02
slash_twomoon I rented from a company and when I left they took €50 out of my deposit because I had damaged the plaster, I was like "bitch there was NO plaster when I moved in here dammit, I had to do that myself"21:02
pwr22Yeah I had to restart the bot to handle the exception so now it has no valid data21:02
underscore_https://i.redd.it/5tjn0v4yl3m41.jpg21:03
underscore_I didn't screenshot it myself but found it online21:04
twomoonhaha slash_ yeah i've dealt with that my whole life it's irritating. i now just don't even pay the last months' rent and just let em take the security deposit21:04
underscore_https://i.redd.it/g1fqyurxk3m41.png21:07
slash_twomoon what is crazy here is that renters are almost always supposed to put in their own floor AND remove that floor when leaving. It's a huge waste of resources... For me they where "lenient" because they didn't charge me €500 for removing my €3000 floor and so I only had to pay €50 for damaging the plaster that I myself had put on the wall...21:09
BrainstormNew from CNBC Health at 20:06 UTC: (news): Large gatherings banned in San Francisco and Seattle area to slow the coronavirus outbreak → https://is.gd/prHMPa21:09
twomoonman that's a lot of work21:09
aradeshit really annoys me how western governments seem happy to let the virus spread around the whole continent, because they're too worried about taking the actions required to actually stop it, because it harms "muh economy"21:10
aradeshtypical of us21:10
slash_twomoon I could remove the floor myself of course, but I figured who the hell is going to turn down an almost brand new free floor lol21:10
twomoonlol aradesh21:10
aradeshchina will actually be looking over at us and thinking how inhumane we are, for letting it affect so many of our people21:10
twomoongonna buy chinese stocks lol21:10
twomoonthat's the weirdest policy slash_ but on the other hand i guess i wouldn't mind putting in my own rug instead of dealing with shitty old carpeting21:11
slash_aradesh meanwhile our inaction is gonna cost VASTLY more money because this is going to last for months... :S21:11
aradeshslash_: they probably think, "the young people will be fine, andk eep going to work"21:11
aradesha lot of people i know IRL are like, "it's levelled off in china, and look what percentage of the population that is." not realising how they've taken drrastic precautions compared to us21:12
aradeshthey actually think that we must be taking better precautions here than there!21:12
slash_twomoon yeah I suppose that's the idea, so you don't get some shitty nasty floor from the previous occupant. But there is no sense involved it's just "remove the floor" regardless of condition. I was only spared the €500 removal fee because the new tenants visited and said they would like to keep it21:13
twomoon!cases it21:13
aradeshhow long until italy goes above china? :/21:13
twomoonslash_, suddenly i'm turned off to the nederlands21:13
twomoonneoliberalism gone wild21:13
twomoonevery apartment should just have tile flooring and then you can just rent a rug from a rug shop21:14
slash_twomoon oh yes, neoliberalism since 2002 over here!21:14
twomoonthey should just outlaw permament carpeting21:14
slash_twomoon it was mostly carpeting haha21:15
slash_twomoon but very new :p21:15
twomooncarpeting has caused me so many problems...i'm allergic to dust mites21:15
twomoonit should seriously be outlawed21:15
slash_twomoon oh yeah, the dust is unreal21:15
slash_twomoon 0 carpeting in my current house lol21:15
twomoonmy mom made a cheap rug from a piece of carpeting21:16
twomoonyou can just buy carpeting and then sew it around the edges with canvas or something and make a cheap rug21:16
twomoonthrow that over the bare tile or wood floor 21:16
twomoonthen it can be replaced quite easily when it gets nasty21:16
slash_yeah carpet is going to get nasty eventually and will need to be replaced21:17
slash_can't clean it easily either21:17
twomooncarpet should ideally be replaced once every 2-3 years if you have allergies21:17
twomoononly reason carpeting is good is to keep footsies warm in the winter 21:18
twomoon"is this the first time for you to visit this country?" does this sound wrong to you in any way as an english speaker slash_ ?21:18
slash_my bathroom/toilet rugs can be machine washed, only have 1 rug in the living room that cant be cleaned that way21:18
slash_twomoon I am not a native english speaker :P but I think it is ok, maybe "is this your first visit to this country?" is better21:19
twomoonour homemade rug had so much dirt in it after 4 years that when we cleaned it with the hose outside it just kept bleeding dirt21:19
twomoonafter the fifth washing it was still bleeding dirt21:20
twomoonit disgusting to realize how much dirt and grime had settled into it21:20
slash_oh yes21:20
slash_I have one of those mats at the front door, and I clean it weekly21:21
twomoonif you wanna live a healthier life clean your carpeting and don't wear shoes in the house and don't live in a place with a lot of dirt in the air21:21
slash_but when you slap that thing against the wall dust just keeps coming forever21:21
twomoonlol21:21
slash_also, use a duster, and use it regularly21:21
slash_it's super fast to remove dust from stuff21:22
slash_maybe also get one of those air filter machines if you are really sensitive to dust21:22
slash_my friend has it for her asthmatic cat, but it helps a ton21:23
BrainstormNew from CNBC Health at 20:09 UTC: (news): Up to 150 million Americans are expected to contract the coronavirus, congressional doctor says → https://is.gd/XlKhp921:23
tinwhiskerspwr22: yeah. thanks. checking21:23
pwr22Np21:24
twomoonasthmatic cat ! 21:24
pwr22!cases kora21:24
pwr22!cases korea21:24
pwr22tinwhiskers: should those two be getting merged?21:24
pwr22!cases viet21:25
pwr22Another case21:25
pwr22Seems like JHU has changed the upstream names of some things21:25
twomoon!cases italy21:25
tinwhiskerspwr22: ignore that. it's incorrect, due to JH arcgis data now being unavailable and it holding onto previous naming. I'm just fixing it21:25
pwr22Ah cool, thanks!21:26
slash_twomoon yeah when I visit he often gets exited and then he hyperventilates :S he can handle that, but he is also trained to use an inhaler if needed21:26
twomoonwow never met an allergic cat21:27
twomoonusually i'm wheezing around cats21:27
slash_twomoon no not allergic, he has asthma, so he gets out of breath21:27
twomoonasthma is a type of allergy i think?21:27
pwr22Well it is auto-immune21:27
slash_twomoon no it's a lung illness21:28
pwr22So kind of21:28
twomoonusually it's an allergy to dust but your immunse system goes nuts21:28
slash_twomoon well he gets short of breath when he is too exited, when he calms down he is fine21:28
pwr22slash_: does the cat use the inhaler?21:28
pwr22On it's own?21:28
slash_pwr22 he accepts the inhaler, but it's not one he can use on his own21:29
pwr22Ah, I was imagining some sort of amazing cat inhaler21:30
pwr22where they like put their face into a mask and press down on a button with their front paws21:30
pwr22which releases the inhalant into a chamber attached to the mask21:30
pwr22Then successful usage, it dispenses treats to help with the training21:31
twomoonslash_, classic asthma then21:31
slash_pwr22 would be neat :p but I don't think he fully understands what is happening when he gets the inhaler21:31
slash_twomoon I think so yeah21:31
twomoonmy asthma is always brought on by dust or a perfume 21:31
twomoonor a cat21:32
slash_the dust caused it as well, so they got this air filtering machine21:32
slash_twomoon as a cat he is luckily not allergic to other cats :P21:32
twomoonlol21:33
slash_twomoon he lives with 2 others too, but it's really the dust in the air and overexcitement that causes issues21:33
pwr22!cases cook county21:34
twomooni didn't know cats get excited21:34
slash_twomoon it really depends on the cat haha21:36
BrainstormNew from CNBC Health at 20:31 UTC: Top US health official says the coronavirus is 10 times 'more lethal' than the seasonal flu: "I can say we will see more cases and things will get worse than they are right now," said Dr. Anthony Fauci, director of the National Institute of Allergy and Infectious Diseases. → https://is.gd/O2ufiP21:37
Brainstorm🔶 Norway: +51 cases (now 621) 🔶 France: +497 cases (now 2281), +15 deaths (now 48) 🔸 Austria: +40 cases (now 246) 🔸 Bahrain: +6 cases (now 195), +5 recoveries (now 35) 🔸 Belgium: +2 deaths (now 3) 🔸 Brazil: +18 cases (now 52) 🔸 Brunei: +5 cases (now 11) 🔸 Bulgaria: +1 cases (now 7), +1 deaths (now 1) 🔸 Chile: +6 cases (now 23) 🔸 Croatia: +3 cases (now 19) 🔸 Cyprus: +3 cases (now 6) 🔸 Estonia: +3 21:38
slash_twomoon he also seems really really calm, until he starts hyperventilating which looks a bit like he's choking :S kinda scary21:38
slash_twomoon like some sort of cough-breathing through his mouth21:39
twomooni'm glad it could be helped by a air purifier21:39
pwr22!cases it21:40
slash_well, it helps, but not a cure of course21:40
pwr22😁21:40
slash_lol21:40
slash_did you mean Italy? Italy? or Italy? maybe Italy?21:41
aradeshi've gotten way better at washing my hands and not touching my face lately21:42
aradeshi am pretty much going the whole day without touching my face except like, while showering, getting dressed, etc21:42
aradeshspecific times when i can make sure i've washed them first21:43
twomooni need to control touching my face when i have a minor itch21:44
twomoonit's very hard21:44
slash_I touch my face all the time :S21:44
slash_at least I now work from home...21:44
slash_in public transport I try to put my hands in my pockets21:45
LjLItaly PM speaking21:45
slash_so I remember to not touch my face21:45
LjLPress conference21:45
twomoonu watchin it live ljl ?21:45
LjLYes21:45
slash_LjL shit, again so late? this isn't good..21:46
LjLhe's just saying standard stuff for now21:47
LjLi think he's about to say all activities will be closed down countrywide21:48
darsieVienna subway doors now open automatically. No more lever or button touching.21:48
twomoonwhere will the homeless stay at a time like this ljl ?21:48
LjL"when i asked you to make sacrifices, i knew there would be more coming"21:48
LjLnow is the moment to make a further step21:48
LjLthe most important one21:48
LjLitaly will remain one area, a protected italy21:48
LjLbut now we are stopping all commercial activities21:49
LjLshops, except for foodstuff21:49
LjLand pharmacies21:49
LjLdo not rush to buy food in supermarkets21:49
LjLbut we are closing shops, bars, pubs, restaurants21:49
LjLleaving only the option to buy for delivery21:49
LjLfor production and professional work, remote working must be used as much as possible21:49
LjLindustries will continue working, as long as they enact adequate safety protocols21:50
aradeshLjL: i hope he has success21:50
LjLpublic transport will keep working21:50
LjLbanks, insurance companies and financial services must continue21:50
aradeshthat sounds kind of... like not really trying?21:50
aradeshif they're not even closing public  transport?21:51
LjLagriculture and farming as well as services connected to those activities will continue21:51
BrainstormNew from CNBC Health at 20:48 UTC: (news): Amazon launches $25 million relief fund for delivery drivers and seasonal employees amid coronavirus outbreak → https://is.gd/KE1PfT21:51
LjLaradesh, he's basically closing shops21:51
LjLLombardy wanted to stop everything, other regions didn't, he's making a compromise21:51
aradeshah21:51
LjLi am disappointed21:51
LjLthis will mean difficulty in buying things21:51
LjLbut not really stop the spreading of the virus via transport and at work21:52
slash_LjL meanwhile, in the Netherlands: "the Italians are overreacting, they're damaging the economy"... I am ashamed of my country21:52
LjLslash_, :\21:52
LjLhe's also nominating a commissioner with strong powers for health21:52
aradeshLjL: people at my work place seem to think that the numbers china is levelling ouut at is a sign of how bad it could possibly get here, and that they suspect that our methods for preventing it spreading are likely better than china's21:52
LjLbetter than china's? sure21:53
LjLi mean, not21:53
LjLnow he's just reiterating that we must respect the rules21:53
aradeshthey just assume that a country like the UK would be doing a better job21:53
LjLaradesh, that's a pretty silly assumption21:53
LjLbut we also had a moment of "we overreacted" some weeks ago21:53
LjLlook where that got us21:53
slash_LjL to clarify, that was not a government response btw, but it was from a healthcare professional. Does not make it better though..21:54
aradeshand they're like, china had 3000 people died and they have billions of people, so i mean, how bad can it possibly be?21:54
LjLconference ends21:54
BoNgleger%data germany21:55
BrainstormValueError: invalid literal for int() with base 10: '' (file "/home/brainstorm/brainstorm/bot/modules/covid.py", line 66, in covid)21:55
aradeshmeanwhile merkel is like, "most of us will get it. keep calm carry on ¯\_(ツ)_/¯"21:55
LjLuh i thought i had handled ''21:55
pwr22Oh dear21:56
aradesh^^21:56
pwr22!cases germany21:56
pwr22LjL: the csv broke earlier, could be the same again21:56
tinwhiskers!cases germany21:56
aradeshLjL: int(data or 0) will do the job21:56
tinwhiskersoh21:56
LjLaradesh, yeah, i had used that in the first place, then i used .get('blah', 0) because someone suggested it was neater, but... well, that doesn't work :P21:57
pwr22tinwhiskers:  `R&eacute;union;;1;;;1583959920`21:57
pwr22That's likely the issue?21:57
tinwhiskersheh21:57
tinwhiskersI think I've fixed most of the issues now. I'll take a look at that though21:58
LjLtinwhiskers, time to change the separator again? :P21:58
tinwhiskerslol21:58
pwr22I've improved Cov Bot to handle the data transiently breaking21:59
pwr22!cases uk21:59
pwr22Guess it isn't noticed a problem yet (it'd let us know it had problems)21:59
aradeshLjL: hm ^^21:59
LjL%cases germany22:00
BrainstormValueError: invalid literal for int() with base 10: '-->' (file "/home/brainstorm/brainstorm/bot/modules/covid.py", line 66, in covid)22:00
LjLlol22:00
LjL"-->" is definitely not handled by "or 0" i'm afraid22:00
ubLIXI wonder if Merkel saying 100% is an "influence operation" but in the opposite direction to most other countries; basically a version of "wake up, everyone get your game faces on"22:00
aradeshif we have millions of deaths across europe, and china remains roughly the same due to having contained it better... and then if our politicians startt saying, "as we lost so many, we should bring in more migrants to make up the loss" it will cause some craziness in elections22:00
aradeshLjL: ah xD22:00
LjLDiamond Princess;;;-->;;158395992022:01
pwr22lol nice22:01
aradeshaccelerationism (tm)22:01
pwr22Don't think Cov Bot will be too happy with that either22:01
pwr22!cases Diamond22:01
LjLnow they're multiplying22:02
pwr22!cases Princess22:02
aradesh1583959920 cases on diamond princess?22:02
aradeshlol22:02
LjLJHU is really working to break everything for us22:02
pwr22Ah ha! now it's noticed the issues22:02
pwr22!cases Diamond22:02
pwr22Oh damn.... my mitigation is broken 🤦‍♂️22:02
tinwhiskers!cases reunion22:03
tinwhiskers!data reunion22:03
tinwhiskers%data reunion22:03
BrainstormValueError: invalid literal for int() with base 10: '-->' (file "/home/brainstorm/brainstorm/bot/modules/covid.py", line 66, in covid)22:03
tinwhiskers:-(22:03
LjLtinwhiskers, they actually have "-->" in the data?22:04
BrainstormNew from CNBC Health at 21:01 UTC: Amazon and Gates Foundation may team up to deliver coronavirus test kits to Seattle homes: Amazon Care has offered Bill & Melinda Gates Foundation its assistance with a project that aims to provide kits to Seattle residents who suspect they have symptoms of the COVID-19 coronavirus. → https://is.gd/eSuoX722:04
slash_I think that's just for the error message22:04
tinwhiskerso.O22:04
tinwhiskersfuck you JH22:05
slash_in any case '-->' is not a valid integer no22:05
slash_except maybe in javascript22:05
LjLslash_, no the --> is in the csv22:05
LjLwhile tin is busy fixing that, anyone have a clue how toxic breathing in sprayed isopropyl+water is going to be?22:06
slash_LjL well then it looks like something isn't escaped properly, or something goes wrong with converting22:06
LjLnot that i'm actively going to breathe it in on purpose22:06
LjLbut i put some in a spray bottle and i'm not sure how dangerous it is22:06
tinwhiskers%data reunion22:08
Brainstormtinwhiskers: In all areas, Reunion, there are 1 cases, 0 deaths (0.0% of cases), 0 recoveries as of Mon Jan 19 08:59:20 1970. See https://offloop.net/covid19/?default=Reunion for time series data.22:08
tinwhiskers!cases reunion22:08
ubLIX"Isopropyl alcohol inhalation occurs anytime you are around an open container, although working with reasonable amounts of IPA is generally safe, it can cause headaches. Inhaling large amounts of isopropyl alcohol can cause nausea, vomiting, irritation of the nose and mucous membranes, throat irritations, and even difficulty with breathing as coughing can occur making it difficult for you to catch your breath."  -  https://blog.gotopac.com/22:09
ubLIX2016/01/06/the-dangers-of-isopropyl-alcohol/22:09
ubLIX* https://blog.gotopac.com/2016/01/06/the-dangers-of-isopropyl-alcohol/22:09
CatButtes[m]LjL: it probably won't kill you22:09
CatButtes[m]probably22:09
LjLhmm22:09
LjLwell, thanks, i've heard more dangerous i guess22:09
CatButtes[m]Looks like it used to have use as an anaesthetic if you believe wiki22:09
tinwhiskers%data republic of korea22:10
Brainstormtinwhiskers: In all areas, Republic of Korea, there are 7755 cases, 60 deaths (0.8% of cases), 288 recoveries as of Wed Mar 11 22:05:00 2020. See https://offloop.net/covid19/?default=Republic%20of%20Korea for time series data.22:10
contingothey mostly come at night22:10
darsieInhaling water can kill you.22:10
CatButtes[m]So almost certainly safe in the quantities you are looking at22:10
LjLdarsie, well, yes, but you do it all the time in the form of humidity, and a water-based spray doesn't generally kill you unless you spray it directly into your lungs maybe :P22:10
Tangent-Man[m]How comes the % of deaths in Korea is so low?22:10
Tangent-Man[m]What are they doing differently?22:11
LjLgood healthcare, very widespread testing22:11
darsieIs Republic of Korea NK or SK?22:11
LjLSK22:11
CatButtes[m]And I believe their infections skew low due to the cult22:11
Tangent-Man[m]SK22:11
LjLwe have no data on NK anyway22:11
CatButtes[m]*younger22:11
pwr22Hmm, I see to be blowing away the search index even if the update fails :sad22:12
BrainstormNew from CNBC Health at 21:02 UTC: (news): Up to 150 million Americans are expected to contract the coronavirus, congressional doctor says → https://is.gd/XlKhp922:12
slash_!cases22:12
slash_that doesnt seem right22:13
darsieUSA has 330 Mhumans22:13
slash_what dat is it?22:13
slash_dtae22:13
LjLit does say the data may be wrong22:13
slash_sigh, I meant: "what date is it"22:13
slash_ah ye missed that22:13
slash_!cases22:13
slash_how often does the bot update?22:14
LjLmine just pulls from the offloop.net csv whenever you call it, so every 15 minutes, since i believe that's how often offloop.net polls22:16
pwr22Cov Bot does every 15 minutes, though if it's giving that error about updating it should be trying repeatedly22:16
tinwhiskerspwr22: do you know if the JH arcgis data is unavailable at present?22:17
slash_I use https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/ myself, it seems to be quite up to date most of the time22:17
tinwhiskersbefore I bother looking into it22:17
tinwhiskersslash_: yes, that data is also incorporated into the bot data22:17
pwr22tinwhiskers: I don't, i'm just pulling your data atm22:17
slash_tinwhiskers ahh alright22:17
tinwhiskersoh. ok.22:18
tinwhiskersWell, I thought my data was looking ok right now, except for a few leftover naming issues. Is there a problem from your point of view?22:18
LjLtinwhiskers, the site/map is available22:19
pwr22tinwhiskers: I'll take a look22:20
tinwhiskersLjL: thanks. I'm getting an error fetching their data but haven't looked into why. 22:20
LjLtinwhiskers, i haven't checked their json though, don't know/remember where it is, i'm just looking at the dashboard22:20
LjLmy bot is okay with your csv now22:20
twomoonwho made offloop.net?22:21
twomooncan i copy this person's code? i wanna learn coding22:21
slash_is it open source?22:21
tinwhiskersoffloop.net is my server. the covid graph is in... perl22:21
tinwhiskersit's not open source22:21
slash_shit I thought Perl was extinct! :p22:22
tinwhiskersI don't want to subject anyone to that!22:22
twomooncan i have it?22:22
twomooni wanna yoink it22:22
LjLi think you'd fall under "anyone"22:22
pwr22I like Perl22:22
twomooni wanna see if i can convert it to python django22:23
LjLour "patient 1" is apparently recovering and spoke today22:23
LjLfwiw22:23
slash_pwr22 I do not hate Perl, I just rarely see it in the wild anymore22:23
pwr22😁22:23
LjLitalians are stupid22:24
LjLthey're showing on TV how empty Piazza del Duomo is in Milan22:24
LjLbut guess what22:24
LjLthere's like... a SHITTON police cars parked there22:24
LjLno surprise that's empty22:24
LjLthey should check the rest of Milan maybe22:24
slash_all of governments are stupid, it's like a "bet you can't do less than us" contest22:24
LjLit definitely wasn't empty this afternoon22:24
LjL:(22:25
LjLi don't really like this new ordnance22:25
slash_at least you have ordinances..22:26
LjLthey're making it difficult to buy needed things, because 1) food is not the only needed things and 2) if people have to buy all the other needed things at supermarkets, the already long supermarket queues will get unmanageable22:26
LjLbut they aren't stopping public transport and most people's jobs22:26
LjLwhich is what is required to really slow this down at all IMO22:26
slash_instead of "maybe, like, sortof try to wash your hands and also... maybe not be with more than 1000 people... if you feel like it. No pressure, do what you think is right"22:26
pwr22tinwhiskers: I'm still seeing at least one numerical field being an empty string22:27
pwr22{'Country': 'Bolivia', 'Province': '', 'Confirmed': '2', 'Deaths': '', 'Recovered': '', 'LastUpdated': '1583961300'}22:27
LjLslash_, it was just like that here (or worse) when we had your numbers, and even until now, it wasn't *much* more than this in practice. i mean... some things were forbidden, but people did them anyway, so22:27
tinwhiskerspwr22: Ah. OK. I'll look into that.22:28
pwr22I'll make the bot interpret those are zeroes but unsure if you'd like to clean that on your end too?22:28
tinwhiskersYeah, I'll fix that anyway22:28
slash_LjL I am very well aware of that.. it is why I am so frustrated with my government, they know what will happen dammit :S22:28
LjLslash_, and ours knew what happened in China, and the next one will...22:28
LjLi mean, some people make crazy conspiracy theories and say this was all planned to "trim" humanity22:29
LjLbut do we really need to get there?22:29
LjLwe're managing just fine even if it's just a very natural virus22:29
slash_LjL why are humans so damn bad at being proactive...22:29
dunnpbecause humans are selfish22:30
slash_dunnp probably yeah, but in this case the ignorant (old people in government) are more likely to suffer22:31
slash_so I guess that's the silver lining?22:31
pwr22!cases bolivia22:33
jcaywhat22:33
jcay197022:33
pwr22tinwhiskers: I handle that ok now. If this was Perl I wouldn't need to 😁22:33
pwr22Oh their timestamp is blank too I guess22:34
pwr22tinwhiskers: Bolivia;;2;;;158396130022:34
pwr22The timestamp is in seconds instead of milliseconds22:34
pwr22I guess22:34
LjLyeah i saw that before22:35
tinwhiskersheh. I'll fix that shortly22:35
pwr22Cool22:35
slash_looks like the timestamp defaulted to 0 on initial import or something22:35
pwr22I might change the bot to try to sanitise strictly and throw away "wrong" looking things to avoid unexpected failures 😁22:35
jcaywe might start working from home next week22:35
tinwhiskersok, that should fix the blanks and timestamp problem.22:38
jcayIceland is doing really bad, 85 people from 300k22:39
pwr22Cool thanks!22:39
pwr22!cases iceland22:39
pwr22!cases uk22:40
Brainstorm🔶 World: +101921 cases (now 227236), +3645 deaths (now 8245), +64992 recoveries (now 131749) 🔶 US: +129 cases (now 1238), +5 deaths (now 36) 🔸 Australia: +1 cases (now 128) 🔸 New South Wales, Australia: +10 cases (now 65) 🔸 Queensland, Australia: +2 cases (now 20) 🔸 South Australia, Australia: +2 cases (now 9) 🔸 Tasmania, Australia: +1 cases (now 3) 🔸 Victoria, Australia: +3 cases (now 21) 🔸 Western A22:51
BrainstormNew from r/WorldNews Live at 21:47 UTC: /u/slakmehl: Shimon Prokupecz su Twitter: "In less than 24 hours over 200 new cases. There are at least 1209 cases of the novel coronavirus in the United States, according to the state and local health agencies, governments and the U.S. Centers for Disease Control and Prevention." → https://is.gd/RbE0Pm22:52
Timvde+101k, what?22:52
TimvdeThat's probably faulty data?22:53
LjLuh22:53
LjLearlier it was too low, now it's too high22:53
LjLit's not on my end22:54
tinwhiskerscrud22:55
jcaycurrently all cases 125,81122:55
tinwhiskersyes, there's something wrong there22:55
python476april 1st is gonna be awesome22:58
python476think of all the "China covid stats: 1.4B"22:59
LjLpython476, except it will be true? ;(23:03
python476thus 6B humans infected with acute confusion23:04
aradeshLjL: fwiw i do python programming for my work, and i do stuff like int(data or 0) all the time23:04
python476eww23:04
python476python4, now with non nullable23:04
aradeshlol, we still haven't upgraded to python 3...23:05
slash_wait there's a python 4 already?23:05
LjLaradesh, have a chuckle at the if statement in my code then23:06
LjL%source covid23:06
BrainstormLjL, source code for module 'covid' can be found at https://paste.ee/p/35MmR 23:06
python476slash_: nah only fantasy-ing23:06
python476aradesh: what kind of application are you on ?23:06
aradeshyou have some very long lines!23:06
aradeshpython476: django server23:07
dunnpLjL: should put it on github so we can all push fixes :) 23:07
LjLdunnp, just pastebin it :P23:07
LjLi don't do git, i can't do git, and i'm not about to learn now23:07
BrainstormNew from CNBC Health at 22:01 UTC: (news): Up to 150 million Americans are expected to contract the coronavirus, congressional doctor says → https://is.gd/XlKhp923:07
dunnpits like 3 commands23:07
LjLaradesh, my bot is python 2 as well, and now some of the essential modules it's using (praw, namely) are python 3-only now... so pipenv won't even let me install new modules23:07
Timvdearadesh: I also do Python programming for work, and we're using Python 3.8 since less than two weeks after the initial release :D23:07
TimvdeHaving a modern and healthy codebase is really nice23:08
dunnpgit add, git commit, git push23:08
python476Timvde: bragger !23:08
slash_LjL this is the first time I have ever heard of the Eiffel Forum License23:08
aradeshTimvde: we've been trying to get the python 3 version out for ages, it's just other things keep coming up23:08
TimvdeLjL: Git is *really* worth the effort23:08
TimvdePlease trust me on this :)23:08
LjLslash_, i didn't choose it, it's just Phenny's license, i simply kept it for my modules since it seemed easier than figuring out license compatibility23:08
python476seconds Timvde 23:09
Timvdearadesh: We did a major architectural overhaul in the past 4 years, so almost all code is new since then23:09
slash_LjL no problem, it seems very similar to MIT license, I just had never heard of it before :P23:09
TimvdeThat helps23:09
LjLokay maybe i'll learn git in the several months of quarantine before i die23:09
LjLbut not tonight23:09
python476git reset --hard earth23:09
slash_I can help you with git LjL if you want :)23:10
TimvdeBecause we also had a major legacy codebase stuck on Python 2 before that23:10
slash_it's fairly easy23:10
dunnpme too LjL 23:10
Timvde+1, I'm also pretty good at git, and according to other people, also good at explaining things23:10
dunnpI've got some lecture slides on it23:10
TimvdeI've given a handful of git workshops already23:10
aradeshnight all23:10
LjLslash_, the thing is, it's pointless to just put this one module on git. it's a very simple page of code. the whole bot, on the other hand, is a mess, which should definitely be overhauled, made compatible with python 3, and all that, at which point i guess it would also make sense to have it on git somewhere23:11
TimvdeIncluding one advanced one, that was fun :D23:11
LjLhonestly i do believe that right now if i can't find a simple error in this one page of code and one of you can, it's much simpler to point it out in a pastebin23:11
TimvdeLjL: If it's code and you're going to make changes, it's useful to put it in git23:11
LjLif i showed you the earthquake-related code, on the other hand...23:11
dunnphow about tinwhiskers' code for scraping?23:11
LjLhe said it's not open source and he doesn't intend to make it23:12
dunnpwoudl be interesting to show trajectories 23:12
dunnphmm23:12
twomoontimvde: git protocol seems very difficult to me after my first tutorial23:14
twomooni just don't quite git it23:14
LjLbadumtssh23:14
slash_LjL well you could put the bot code on github? others can help! But do not feel obligated, it is your property (until you share it as open source :p)23:14
Timvdetwomoon: The interface isn't really user-friendly if you don't know how it works under the hood23:15
TimvdeBut as soon as you get a feeling for that, it's nice, clean and easy23:15
twomoonlol23:15
BrainstormNew from r/WorldNews Live at 22:07 UTC: /u/BlatantConservative: 99 new cases were just announced in Washington State, USA, making it the largest increase in North America at any one time → https://is.gd/HZYwYC23:15
Timvdetwomoon: In my git workshops, I always explained why things are as they are23:15
TimvdeIt really helps23:15
CatButtes[m]Git is very much a tech tool written by techies for techies. You have to understand quite a bit before it really starts to make sense23:16
CatButtes[m]but you can get going with basic commands pretty easily23:16
LjLuntil something goes wrong and then you have no idea how to get out of it23:16
TimvdeYea, you can totally just use a cheat-sheet and be okay 99% of the time23:16
slash_git was written by Linus Torvalds because of his hatred of other source control system for himself23:16
LjLand you start following tutorials that make it worse if you don't know how it works inside like Timvde said23:16
slash_not for other techies23:16
TimvdeLjL: that's what the git.txt file is for :) https://xkcd.com/1597/23:17
python476twomoon: why did you need to know the protocol ?23:17
LjLTimvde, okay, then i'll make the bot include your phone number with its source pastebin! :P23:18
Timvdepython476: not the protocol, but you really need to understand that git is an ADG of commits, which each by themselves represent the entirety of the repository and not the diffs (which is what most people think)23:18
TimvdeAnd what the staging area is and how to manipulate it23:18
twomoonpython476, i just wanna change careers23:18
TimvdeIf you understand those two things, everything makes more sense23:19
twomoonfrom electrical engineering hardware crap to python coding23:19
LjLwell you've already lost me23:19
twomoonor web coding23:19
twomoonwhat's an ADG?23:19
slash_Timvde git is for source control, you really not need to use all that much to start using it23:19
TimvdeOh, and that rebase is not a weird command, but just an interface over git reset, git cherry-pick and git commit --amend :)23:19
Timvdeslash_: Sure, if you're okay with "I know these few commands and that works for me"23:20
TimvdeBut then it'll keep being unintuitive23:20
python476twomoon: I though EE was amazing23:20
Timvdetwomoon: acyclic, directed graph23:20
python476Timvde: yeah it's true that learning git top-bottom is weird23:20
twomoonthat's too far under-the-hood bro23:20
python476bottom-up yields clearer view and faster results23:20
Timvdepython476: It really depends on how much you use git23:20
python476also23:21
twomoonthat's more like underneath the car23:21
python476but any serious use..23:21
Timvdeif you use it every now and then to just commit and push on your own projects, sure, do whatever23:21
twomoonyeah EE is fun for hobby but not as a job anymore. doesn't pay very well lots of jobs are going overseas23:21
slash_Timvde Well yes? that's how you begin? You do not start using git by knowing everything that is possible. That is absurd23:21
python476twomoon: it's just a network with no cycle23:21
TimvdeIf you use it every day, you should definitely learn it23:21
python476twomoon: think like circuit.. well the opposite :D23:21
python476twomoon: super sad about EE, I think it's a great discipline23:21
Timvdetwomoon: Well, I must say that's comming from a CS graduate, if you say ADG to me, I'm like "oh yea, that's clear"23:22
slash_Timvde you start using it as a simple source control, then you learn branches, then syncs/pull requests, etc23:22
python476I learned a few things about code structure on circuits23:22
TimvdeBut in less techy words: each commit has a link to its parent(s)23:22
Timvdeslash_: "syncs"?23:22
python476Timvde: #pedantism: usually it's DAG 23:22
TimvdeThat's not a git thing23:22
twomooni'd rather say 'state machine that never returns to a prior state' than saying ADG23:23
Timvdepython476: Right, I'm not a native English speaker, sorry23:23
python476twomoon: https://external-content.duckduckgo.com/iu/?u=https%3A%2F%2Fi.stack.imgur.com%2FcJd3i.png&f=1&nofb=123:23
python476Timvde: oh so DAG is the yankee variant ?23:23
python476nevermind, I misread you23:23
slash_Timvde sync is just a merge, but some git software uses sync instead of merge when merging master => stage for ex23:24
TimvdeEnglish is technically my third language language even (or fourth, I got Latin in class before I got English :P)23:24
python476twomoon: well graphs are more general than statemachines that's why its used23:24
twomoonoh really23:24
TimvdeBut in fluency it's definitely my second23:24
TimvdeBecause well, internet23:24
twomooni never learned about graphs in school =/23:24
TimvdeHmm, calling it a state machine sounds weird to me23:25
twomoonyeah it's stupid23:25
twomooni was just looking for the closest thing i had studied before23:26
TimvdeBecause well, a staet machine defines a language23:26
twomoonstate machines usually have a finite # of states so bad example23:26
python476twomoon: if you studied complex circuits and topology.. it's the same with different terminology23:26
python476at least at the git level23:26
twomoonstate machines don't really define language, that's a stretch23:26
twomooni don't know where you're going with this but now we're under the car not under the hood23:26
Timvdetwomoon: State machines have _by definition_ a finite number of states23:26
twomoonright23:26
twomoonthat's what i just said23:26
Timvdetwomoon: a theoretical language23:27
twomoonalthough in theory you could have a state machine that constantly adds new states to itself23:27
python476twomoon: there's nothing more we can discuss to help you more than reading scott chacon - pro git book23:27
python476maybe 'git inside out'23:27
twomoonyes ok i just need to have more patience23:27
python476yeah23:27
twomoonCS related stuff really tests my patience for some reason23:27
Timvdetwomoon: That wouldn't be a state machine23:27
twomoonit wouldn't?23:27
python476funny I never thought about self modifying state machines23:28
twomoonso a language can't evolve and add new vocabulary ?23:28
TimvdeNot in the theoretical definition, no23:28
slash_then it becomes another language23:28
slash_or a version of it23:29
python476I guess a language is defined by a known in advance alphabet and rules23:29
python476in the old school grammar sense23:29
slash_why are we now discussing computer science stuff lol?23:29
python476now advanced linguistics probably have models for growing languages23:29
python476slash_: because anxious nerds are everywhere 23:30
Timvdeslash_: Because it's interesting? :D23:30
TimvdeAnd because LjL has to start using git23:30
Timvdeor somethign23:30
Timvde:P23:30
slash_we where talking about git, it is not that complex23:30
slash_haha23:30
python476slash_: I'm on a medical chan and once every hour, CS pops up23:30
TimvdeThis is IRC, it's pretty much unavoidable23:31
twomoonwas ljl scared of git?23:31
TimvdeThe majority of people here are IT people23:31
slash_Timvde yes, that is true23:31
LjLwell, at least, it's symmetrical: anywhere else you go, you'll probably hear about COVID-1923:31
TimvdeYea, at my IT job, people talk about it all the time!23:32
slash_the #reddit-sysadmin channel often devolves into coronavirus talk23:32
TimvdeAlthough they don't call it COVID-1923:32
slash_so I guess it is only fair that we talk about CS here23:32
twomoonlol ljl you're right. i can't get away from covid now23:32
python476slash_: so every irc chan is basically ###off-topic underneath23:33
slash_python476 nothing is offtopic if the mods are asleep!23:33
LjLi mean, i'd rather this channel be roughly on topic, but in flexible times, i need to be flexible too23:33
LjLif i start arguing with people and then banning them i get too uppity anyway, which is bad for the immune system :P23:33
python476truth23:33
twomoonwow ljl 4 best admin of the decade!23:34
slash_agreed23:34
TimvdeNow I wonder if there's a channel about theoretical CS23:34
TimvdeI miss it23:34
slash_I enjoy it when the topics are a bit fluid :)23:34
keithnis it true you can catch covid-19 through irc23:34
slash_in fact23:34
LjLkeithn, no, but you can die from it23:34
slash_it is mandatory23:34
LjLif you let the panic take over23:34
slash_LjL developed a bot that will seek you out and infect you23:35
LjLas i ruminate tonight's new ordnance in my head... i still don't like it23:35
LjLyou have to stop public transport, you have to stop most people's jobs, you can't just close pubs and make stuff harder to buy and think that solves it23:36
exotericwhich country?23:36
TimvdeI just saw that my work sent new guidelines, let's read them when I get home23:36
LjLthat wasn't what the governor of Lombardy was wanting, it's a pretty silly compromise23:36
LjLexoteric, Italy23:36
TimvdeI hope they don't cancel the party on Friday :(23:36
slash_LjL yeah I really wonder how Italy will react to this...23:36
RougeRLjL, hey23:36
slash_LjL this are very severe restrictions23:37
jcayno time for parties now23:37
LjLbut not severe enough23:37
LjLlook at the graph23:37
jcaygraph is alagging at elast 5 days, that's the prob23:37
slash_but what more can Italy do?23:37
slash_martial law?23:37
jcaybut I do agree on trasnaport and stuff23:37
RougeRLjL, work from home and social distancing and no large events23:37
LjLi know effects can't be instantaneous, but if you just think what the graph will be in 5 days... either they START working in 5 days, or we're pretty much all... maybe not dead, but in a reall really bad place23:37
RougeRand transportr yeah23:37
slash_it's not feasible to control so many people...23:38
RougeReh it is23:38
LjLslash_, it can do what it's doing, except go further23:38
RougeRits not easy23:38
LjLslash_, and we don't need martial law to deploy the army as police forces23:38
keithnare people gonna self quarantine when they believe thousands of undiagnosed people are out and about anyway23:38
LjLit's already being done23:38
LjLjust very blandly23:38
RougeRthe government needs to guarentee pay for workers too23:38
gareppa[m]italy has takev very sever restrictions. what do you think is bland?23:38
LjLthe government needs to guarantee that the workers stay alive to be there to get paid23:38
BrainstormNew from r/WorldNews Live at 22:37 UTC: /u/BlatantConservative: Kuwait closes airport due to coronavirus | Fortune → https://is.gd/eYcpkd23:39
RougeRi mean italy did fuck itself23:39
TimvdeRougeR: but that's socialism! #America23:39
LjLgareppa[m], because i live here and i saw the city is still full of people and i saw full buses23:39
LjLhow exactly is a full bus stopping the spread of this?23:39
RougeRitaly is just UK in 2 weeks and France in 1 week23:39
slash_RougeR no the fucking happened in Wuhan with a bat23:39
jcayLjL: people must be crazy23:39
RougeRLjL, i agree23:39
gareppa[m]i'm italian too. they should enforce the minimum distance on buses too23:39
RougeRslash_, huehue23:39
LjLjcay, no, people must be going to work or they get fired23:40
RougeRgareppa[m], public transport should be stopped23:40
LjLUNLESS the government says they just can't23:40
slash_RougeR alwasys use a rubber when going down on bats!23:40
LjLTHAT would be safeguarding their job, their pay, and ultimately their life23:40
RougeRinfection can happen between 2 different floors on a bus23:40
twomoonljl: ordinance23:40
jcayLjL: don't comanies realize they need to protect workers?23:40
RougeRLjL, jersey got its first case lol23:40
LjLgareppa[m], who enforces that on buses? two cops on every bus, saying "no, you can't board, it's full"? i mean... sure, let's go ahead and do it23:40
LjLor maybe just stop all buses, since i can't see the above happening23:41
gareppa[m]that chinese study on scmp has been retracted23:41
LjLoh whew, it has been retracted, so now we know we can't catch the virus, that's a relief23:41
gareppa[m]no, the one about the huge distance, this23:41
gareppa[m]https://www.scmp.com/news/china/science/article/3074351/coronavirus-can-travel-twice-far-official-safe-distance-and-stay23:41
Birosso#cases Denmark23:42
Birosso%ases Denmark23:42
BirossoI hate my life.23:42
jcay!cases Denmark23:42
jcayhuh23:42
python476%cases Denmark23:42
Brainstorm🔶 World: +491 cases (now 227727), +3 deaths (now 8248), +286 recoveries (now 132035) 🔶 Washington, US: +85 cases (now 366), +5 deaths (now 29) 🔶 Europe, France: +497 cases (now 2281), +15 deaths (now 48) 🔶 Diamond Princess, Cruise Ship: +1 deaths (now 7), +285 recoveries (now 325) 🔶 Cruise Ship: +1 deaths (now 7), +285 recoveries (now 325) 🔸 Australia: +1 cases (now 128) 🔸 New South Wales, Australia: +123:42
jcayhere23:42
python4768)23:42
LjLgareppa[m], i know which one you mean, i just don't think it being retracted means much23:42
RougeRgareppa[m], hmmmm weird23:42
Brainstormpython476: In all areas, Denmark, there are 514 cases, 0 deaths (0.0% of cases), 1 recoveries as of Wed Mar 11 23:25:00 2020. See https://offloop.net/covid19/?default=Denmark for time series data.23:42
jcayDenmark is pretty bad23:43
keithn/notice is bad 23:43
LjLi still see good reasons to assume the virus is airborne, and even if it's not, i still see plain data showing how damned easily it spreads - one way or another23:43
RougeRdenmark at leastr has different healthcare23:43
RougeRdecent23:43
LjLand by now we're being told "wash your hands" twelve times a day, and the graph's still not changing23:43
keithndoesnt matter if they dont have the capacity23:43
slash_northern Italy has good healthcare23:43
RougeRi got sent this from Uber just23:43
RougeRhttps://i.imgur.com/ipacI94.png23:43
slash_it is not enough23:43
jcayLjL: how many people actually wash their hands, what do you think?23:44
RougeRkeithn, no but it gives them more capacity23:44
jcayand again... the graph is lagging 5 days... so can't judge yet23:44
keithnis that really true?23:44
RougeRlol paris hospital overwhelmed with 100 cases23:44
twomoonljl it doesn't take a genius to see that it's airborne23:44
RougeRpretty stark stuff23:44
LjLjcay, i don't know, but it's irrelevant: once you've told them 12 times a day for many days, if they still aren't doing it, then that's clearly a behavior you're not changing23:44
twomoonstop making it seem like a leap of faith to believe that23:44
RougeRi forced my dad to do it (hand washing)23:44
RougeRi finally got some alcohol antiseptic gel too23:45
slash_more countries in the EU are going to have to do triage soon, determine which patients can be helped, and who cannot be helped23:45
RougeR5 x 100ml23:45
LjLtwomoon, well apparently it takes many people dying to convince many italians (and others) that it is. or a well-made study, i guess. should only take about, i dunno, six months?23:45
jcayRougeR: good, since not only corona is deadly and health risky anyway23:45
twomoonthe only question is, is it airborne via mucous membrane or airborne directly from sweat or skin shedding23:45
Birosso"Denmark at least has decent healthcare"23:45
slash_we are looking at war scenario's for healthcare right now23:45
BirossoI assume you all heard Denmark is shutting down?23:45
BirossoThey are literally displaying on TV, "DENMARK IS SHUTTING DOWN."23:46
LjLBirosso, uh?23:46
slash_Birosso really?23:46
keithnsomething is rotten in the state of denmark23:46
BirossoOne sec.23:46
RougeRLjL, lol in UK we are still havinf huge gatherings23:46
BirossoYahoo has the story.23:46
RougeRwe have cheltenham festival happening right now23:46
RougeR250,000 people23:46
BirossoReddit has comments from the Danes.23:46
LjLBirosso, i see they're closing schools23:46
Birossohttps://old.reddit.com/r/worldnews/comments/fh3bcj/denmark_partially_shuts_down_for_at_least_two/23:46
jcaywhat's wrong with UK, RougeR 23:46
BirossoLjL23:46
BirossoCheck comments.23:46
RougeRjcay, we have the tories23:46
RougeRthey are scum23:46
BrainstormNew from CNBC Health at 22:42 UTC: Amazon and Gates Foundation may team up to deliver coronavirus test kits to Seattle homes: Amazon Care has offered Bill & Melinda Gates Foundation its assistance with a project that aims to provide kits to Seattle residents who suspect they have symptoms of the COVID-19 coronavirus. → https://is.gd/eSuoX723:46
RougeRliteral human scum23:46
Birosso"Law from next week will make all assembled above 100 illegal.23:47
BirossoAll employers is asked to send home All employees.23:47
BirossoAll non-critical treatments at hospital will be cancelled and All visiting hours Will be closed."23:47
Birosso"Headline on national TV is 'DENMARK IS SHUTTING DOWN'23:47
BirossoThey might add health checks at the boarders of denmark, testing everyone."23:47
RougeRthey reckon seattle has 1000 cases alone!23:47
twomoondenmark shutting down?23:47
LjL"As a Dane - This is unreal. This has never happened before in our history. Monday we had 30 cases, tonight it's 514." ← as an italian, this is unreal, thinking they are surprised at this happening after seeing it happen in italy23:47
BirossoYes.23:47
twomoonwtf since when was denmark slated to be next in line after italy?23:47
RougeRhttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IzXQ6Bu9JVI23:47
slash_we have almost as many cases as Denmark... and similar population. why are we not doing anything23:47
BirossoAccording to comments on Reddit, they are calling in retired health care professionals to boost the health system's capacity.23:48
RougeRshould all be watching Dr.John Campbell23:48
RougeRhttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IzXQ6Bu9JVI23:48
TimvdeIn France, apparently thousands of people came together dressed up like Smurfs to break the record of gathering the most people dressed up like Smurfs23:48
twomoonBirosso are u Dane?23:48
slash_I watch Dr. Campbell daily23:48
keithnbased france23:48
RougeRey23:48
Birossotwomoon: Like I said, these are comments from Danish people on Reddit.23:48
slash_he is a good resource23:48
RougeRyeah i agree23:48
twomoonBirosso where u at?23:48
BirossoGermany.23:48
twomoonDane Lite23:48
BirossoNot German, though.23:48
RougeRtbh is cross border travel that bad?23:48
BirossoFar from either. :)23:48
RougeRif you isolate within23:49
LjLBirosso, but, "In addition, all employees in the public sector with non-critical jobs are to be sent home" is quite a qualification23:49
twomoonyou mean exception23:49
RougeRLjL, how much is SSP in italy>23:49
twomoonqualification sounds odd there23:49
LjLRougeR, what is SSP23:49
LjLtwomoon, well maybe it does, but no i meant https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/qualification #423:50
twomoonsocial security payment23:50
RougeRsick pay23:50
RougeRstatuatory23:50
LjLsick pay is 100% the first time you get sick, then at some point progressively goes down if you get sick more times during the year23:51
RougeRno i mean23:51
RougeRhow much is it23:51
LjL100% of your wage23:51
RougeRis it?23:51
RougeRsource?23:51
pwr22In the UK it's very little23:52
LjLthe hell do i know? i know it from memory. part of it is paid by INPS, part by your employer, i don't know how much each23:52
RougeRhttps://ec.europa.eu/social/main.jsp?catId=1116&langId=en&intPageId=462023:52
TimvdeYea, here it is 100% too23:52
TimvdeAt least for a month, paid by your employer23:52
slash_well, worldometers is down23:52
pwr22I missed the git and merkle dag chat 😭23:52
RougeRTimvde, is that statuatory yeah>23:52
TimvdeThen you get social security and I'm not sure how much it is23:52
python476dagela merkle23:52
TimvdeYes23:52
RougeRBetween the 4th and 20th day of illness, the statutory sick pay amount is, generally, equal to 50% of average daily pay, moving to 66% between the 21st and 180th day. Entitlement to this benefit ends at the end of the prognosis (end of illness) and, therefore, you are entitled to a maximum of 180 days per calendar year.23:53
RougeRso LjL you need to understand that is NOT the case in the UK23:53
darsieWhy didn't extracorporeal membrane oxygenation save Li Wenliang? Could it save Trump?23:53
LjLwhat's Trump to do with anything now?23:53
darsieHe might get/have cv.23:54
darsieAnd efforts would be made to save him.23:54
romareis there a source where I can see the ages of the people who died in italy?23:54
BrainstormNew from r/WorldNews Live at 22:52 UTC: /u/BlatantConservative: Coronavirus: Japan says postponing Tokyo Olympic Games is 'inconceivable' | Stuff.co.nz → https://is.gd/TLZe3023:54
LjLromare, yes, although it's not quite up to date. it's in the topic23:54
LjLromare, look for the ISS link(s)23:54
pwr22<Brainstorm "New from r/WorldNews Live at 22:"> Well that's a stupid thing to say23:55
RougeRLjL, in the UK it is £20 a day23:55
darsieWhat's ISS?23:55
RougeRfor sick pay23:55
RougeRLOL23:55
BirossoSick pay in Germany is 100%.23:55
RougeRthis is why we cant just cancel work23:55
LjLRougeR, that sounds... useful23:55
RougeRLjL, SOOOO USEFUL23:55
TimvdeOkay, so, apparently it's 60% up to one year23:55
RougeRyou used to have to wait 3 days before it kicked in too23:55
RougeRnow its instant23:55
RougeRoh great £60 a mointh23:55
RougeRSSP doesnt cover rent for most23:56
slash_60?23:56
slash_what23:56
LjLRougeR, well, or, you could make emergency laws that change that. i mean, our government pulled €25 billion out of thin air to face this. will we *dearly* have to pay for them later? yeah, afraid so, but meanwhile i think i'd rather people not die23:56
RougeR£6023:56
RougeRLjL, they just did23:56
RougeRthis is the improved laws23:56
twomoonljl go relax somewhere you seem on edge23:56
RougeRthis was in the budget today23:56
slash_really? it's 100% of wage here, at least for the first year or seo23:56
RougeRour government are shite23:56
RougeRa lot of companies voluntarily pay more23:56
LjLRougeR, i can agree on that23:56
Timvdeslash_: If I'm reading it right23:56
RougeRbut a lot dont23:56
RougeRslash_, yes really23:57
RougeRhttps://www.gov.uk/statutory-sick-pay23:57
slash_RougeR jesus, what the fuck23:57
ubLIXdidn't you listen to the budget, RougeR? out government is the Peoples' Government!23:57
ubLIX*our23:57
RougeRubLIX, hahahaha23:57
ubLIX^.^23:57
BirossoI like the way things work in Germany. They give you 100% of sick pay, but they also foster solidarity and team spirit in the work place, so you would feel guilty if you abused the system.23:57
RougeRmy mother kept trying to tell me well at least its an improvement23:57
LjLubLIX, People's Republic of the United Kingdom?23:57
RougeRand ohhhh if you give people too much theyll just not work23:57
ubLIXsomething like that, LjL 23:57
RougeRshes a dumbass sometimes...23:57
BirossoOf course now that's changing with a lot of places adopting, uh, foreign practices, increasing responsibility and reducing number of employees.23:58
slash_RougeR 94.25 per week!? that's insanely low23:58
RougeRslash_, its like 2nd or 3rd lowest in europe23:58
RougeRthe tories have fucked us23:58
ubLIXRougeR: tell her the whole point of UBI is that we can afford it and if it people decide to use it to not work then that is just fine23:58
RougeRhaha UBI23:58
RougeRoh boy23:58
RougeRshe doesnt get UBI23:58
slash_RougeR yeah but those lowest in Europe probably have like 400 median monthly wage...23:58
BirossoOkay, tough question time: Why is the UK so terrible compared to its neighbours?23:58
ubLIXthe robots can pick up the slack. or something23:58
RougeRBirosso, tories23:58
RougeR10 years of tories23:59
RougeRand we just voted them back in23:59
TimvdeRougeR: Yea, you're screwed23:59
BirossoSo elites hoarding everything for themselves, that kind of thing?23:59
figuinhasguys23:59
TimvdeI just don't understand how that could've happened23:59
RougeRBirosso, yes23:59
BirossoGot it.23:59
darsieHow successful is extracorporeal membrane oxygenation with covid-19?23:59
RougeRand cutting all public sector and health care to the bone23:59
RougeRand lying and controlling media23:59
figuinhaswhen was the last change in case definition for surveillance?23:59
keithnsome people just cannot see past politics in everything lol23:59
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