tinwhiskers | to some degree that is true, but by GDP is medical research funding really higher there? | 00:00 |
---|---|---|
gigasu_shida | i don't know good question | 00:00 |
tinwhiskers | indeed | 00:00 |
tinwhiskers | err, sorry, per capita | 00:01 |
tinwhiskers | well, either way I guess | 00:01 |
gigasu_shida | i kinda knew what you meant | 00:01 |
tinwhiskers | total investment: China, US, japan, Germany, South Korea | 00:02 |
gigasu_shida | huh? | 00:03 |
tinwhiskers | by GDP US is ranked tenth. Per capita, US is fourth. | 00:03 |
tinwhiskers | that was a ranking. China spends the most in total, follwed by US | 00:04 |
gigasu_shida | wow China spends more? | 00:04 |
tinwhiskers | they have a LOT more people | 00:04 |
gigasu_shida | still...that's surprising | 00:04 |
tinwhiskers | per capita China is way behind the US | 00:05 |
gigasu_shida | can i see where you're getting these figures? | 00:05 |
Brainstorm | Updates for Switzerland: +146 deaths (now 5495) since 22 hours ago | 00:06 |
tinwhiskers | oh, crap... Now that I went to copy the link I see I got lost in a rabbit hole. That's total research, not healthcare. I'll try harder. | 00:06 |
gigasu_shida | sorry to bother you | 00:08 |
tinwhiskers | https://www.who.int/research-observatory/indicators/gerd_gdp/en/ | 00:08 |
tinwhiskers | That's OECD only though | 00:09 |
tinwhiskers | OK, this seems useful: https://ourworldindata.org/health-meta | 00:13 |
tinwhiskers | oh. no. That's healthcare expenditure, not healthcare research expenditure. it's no surprise they spend more on healthcare services considering the outrageously expensive system. | 00:14 |
gigasu_shida | it's ok i'm gonna go down the rabbit hole myself on this later | 00:15 |
gigasu_shida | lol | 00:15 |
gigasu_shida | can you add a population adjustment feature to offloop.net eventually? | 00:16 |
tinwhiskers | it already has that | 00:16 |
gigasu_shida | i'd like to be able to normalize data by country population | 00:16 |
gigasu_shida | oh really.... | 00:16 |
gigasu_shida | i'll look again | 00:16 |
tinwhiskers | ok | 00:16 |
gigasu_shida | ooo spain and italy it looks like lead the way if divided by population | 00:17 |
gigasu_shida | but looks like US could beat them soon | 00:18 |
tinwhiskers | deaths? | 00:18 |
tinwhiskers | for cases per capita US only lags behind Belgium and will soon take the lead. | 00:19 |
gigasu_shida | cases don't seem like a good way to compare things | 00:21 |
gigasu_shida | depends too much on government effort | 00:22 |
gigasu_shida | and healthcare system | 00:22 |
tinwhiskers | yeah, maybe | 00:22 |
gigasu_shida | Fauci said the wave due to the Thanksgiving holiday hasn't arrived yet =/ | 00:23 |
tinwhiskers | no, I guess not | 00:23 |
LjL | deaths can also depend to some extent | 00:26 |
LjL | lesser extent than cases, for sure | 00:26 |
LjL | but there are things like... is a death considered a case if they were never tested and just treated in a hurry until they died instead? | 00:27 |
LjL | i mean, is the death considered a COVID-19 death | 00:27 |
gigasu_shida | deaths may need to be normalized for the average age of the country or the average age of the deceased? | 00:30 |
gigasu_shida | or am i wrong? | 00:30 |
LjL | i dunno, depends on what you want to be measuring | 00:38 |
de-facto | Infection Fatality Ratio IFR(age) = Exp[ Ln[2] age / 5.75 years] / 1820 in percent, source https://www.medrxiv.org/content/10.1101/2020.07.23.20160895v7 | 00:40 |
de-facto | 5title | 00:41 |
de-facto | %title | 00:41 |
Brainstorm | de-facto: From www.medrxiv.org: Assessing the Age Specificity of Infection Fatality Rates for COVID-19: Systematic Review, Meta-Analysis, and Public Policy Implications | medRxiv | 00:41 |
de-facto | so they have Log10[IFR] == -3.27 + 0.0524 * age hence that means IFR[age] = Exp[ Ln[2] age / 5.74485 years] / 1862.09 | 00:47 |
de-facto | so normalized to 1 = 100% it would be IFR[age] = Exp[ Ln[2] age / 5.75 years] / 186200 | 00:49 |
de-facto | for example IFR[85] = 0.151366 or 1/6, hence a COVID-19 infection would be as fatal as Russian Roulette for that age | 00:50 |
de-facto | probability to die from a SARS-CoV-2 infection doubles with each increase of age by 5.75 years | 00:51 |
Brainstorm | Updates for Canada: +5186 cases (now 420839), +68 deaths (now 12733) since 23 hours ago | 01:06 |
kreyren[m] | Anything new I should know about in terms of covid | 01:14 |
LjL | lol, i don't know what you knew last time | 01:35 |
LjL | also i probably don't remember what's new since ;( | 01:35 |
LjL | maybe i should add a feature to the bot that spams you with ALL the news since last time you asked for them | 01:36 |
LjL | although i suspect that'd get the bot quickly disconnected | 01:36 |
de-facto | today they will start with vaccinations in UK so thats new i guess | 01:42 |
de-facto | not sure how much impact that will have due to limited availability of vaccine doses, if they have a really smart strategy maybe an effect on deaths may be visible like in January? idk | 01:43 |
LjL | de-facto, with Pfizer, right? | 01:43 |
de-facto | yep BioNTech/Pfizer | 01:43 |
LjL | %vax Pfizer | 01:44 |
Brainstorm | LjL, Researcher: BioNTech + Pfizer, Country: Germany + USA, Trial start: Apr 20, Vaccine type: mRNA BNT162b2 | 01:44 |
de-facto | oh wow thats cool :) | 01:44 |
de-facto | %vax Moderna | 01:44 |
Brainstorm | de-facto, Researcher: Moderna + NIAID, Country: USA, Trial start: Mar 16, Vaccine type: mRNA-1273 | 01:44 |
LjL | heh i made it a few days ago but i think you were sleeping and missed the demo | 01:44 |
de-facto | %vac CureVac | 01:45 |
LjL | but it doesn't fetch much info because it only uses the "list" page | 01:45 |
jacklsw | %vac sputnik | 01:45 |
de-facto | %vax CureVac | 01:45 |
Brainstorm | de-facto, Researcher: CureVac, Country: Germany, Trial start: Jun 18, Vaccine type: mRNA | 01:45 |
LjL | it doesn't use the individual subpages (yet) | 01:45 |
jacklsw | %vax sputnik | 01:45 |
Brainstorm | jacklsw, Researcher: Gamaleya Research Institute, Country: Russia, Trial start: Jun 17, Vaccine type: Sputnik V | 01:45 |
de-facto | LjL really cool stuff thank you :)) | 01:45 |
LjL | you can also use %vaccine or %vaccines but i didn't think of %vac | 01:45 |
jacklsw | %vax sinovac | 01:45 |
Brainstorm | jacklsw, Researcher: Sinovac, Country: China + Brazil, Trial start: Apr 13, Vaccine type: Inactivated — Researcher: Sinovac + Dynavax, Country: China + USA, Trial start: , Vaccine type: Inactivated | 01:45 |
de-facto | this is so cool i love it :) | 01:46 |
jacklsw | chinese confidential heh | 01:46 |
LjL | there are two of these because the trial in brazil uses a different adjuvant from the other one | 01:46 |
LjL | i think the subpages at covidvax have more info on that | 01:46 |
de-facto | Aluminum hydroxide something ? | 01:47 |
LjL | mhm | 01:47 |
de-facto | %vax sinupharm | 01:47 |
LjL | well one is "alum", which is standard shorthand for that thing, apparently | 01:47 |
Brainstorm | de-facto, | 01:47 |
LjL | i don't remember what the other is | 01:47 |
KREYREEN | LjL, yesh please spam me with relevant things! | 01:47 |
de-facto | %vax sinopharm | 01:47 |
Brainstorm | de-facto, Researcher: Beijing Institute of BioProducts (Sinopharm), Country: China, Trial start: Apr 29, Vaccine type: Inactivated — Researcher: Wuhan Institute of BioProducts (Sinopharm), Country: China, Trial start: Apr 12, Vaccine type: Inactivated | 01:47 |
LjL | maybe it should fail more gracefully when it finds no hits :P | 01:47 |
de-facto | i always spell those wrong idk why LOL | 01:48 |
KREYREEN | de-facto, because medical nerds like to bully people with unpronounciable and hard to remember things~ :p | 01:48 |
Brainstorm | New from r/WorldNews: worldnews: Fired Florida scientist and family home raided for COVID-19 data → https://is.gd/oGLnid | 01:49 |
KREYREEN | they keep calling meh stultus >.> | 01:50 |
de-facto | actually i should be able to remember: sino meaning china | 01:50 |
KREYREEN | de-facto, does it O.o | 01:50 |
LjL | well, Sina means China in Latin | 01:50 |
de-facto | yep https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sino | 01:51 |
LjL | sino- is more like... more like a lot of other prefix end up with -o- :P | 01:51 |
Brainstorm | Updates for Cyprus: +416 cases (now 12867), +2 deaths (now 63) since a day ago — France: +6363 cases (now 2.3 million) since a day ago | 01:51 |
LjL | like i dunno, gramophone! gram-o-phone! | 01:51 |
LjL | they even spell the sillier ones that way | 01:51 |
de-facto | LjL, did you do that with scrapy? | 01:52 |
de-facto | or beautifulsoup or such? | 01:52 |
LjL | de-facto, beautifulsoup. scrapy seemed too complex, and more geared towards creating standalone scrapers than making it part of your own program | 01:54 |
LjL | besides it's not like i need to do any magic like run their javascript or store their cookies or anything... it's just html, not of the least annoying variety, but still just html | 01:55 |
LjL | i almost want to say "i will expand it to also scrape the vaccine-specific pages" but if i say it i won't do it, i know me | 01:55 |
LjL | so i won't say it! except i've said it... | 01:55 |
de-facto | LjL, also would be cool to have info about the categories (e.g. lab, animal, human and certified) as well as number of study participants (indicating how soon certification may be available) | 01:55 |
LjL | oh, i don't know why it doesn't say the number of study participants, i probably just forgot to add that entry | 01:56 |
LjL | the other thing... i probably can do that somewhat easily, too | 01:56 |
de-facto | %vax Germany | 01:57 |
Brainstorm | de-facto, Researcher: BioNTech + Pfizer, Country: Germany + USA, Trial start: Apr 20, Vaccine type: mRNA BNT162b2 — Researcher: CureVac, Country: Germany, Trial start: Jun 18, Vaccine type: mRNA — Researcher: ReiThera + Leukocare, Country: Italy + Germany + Belgium, Trial start: Aug 10, Vaccine type: GRAd-COV2 [... want %more?] | 01:57 |
de-facto | oh yeah thats cool :) | 01:57 |
de-facto | %vax mRNA | 01:58 |
Brainstorm | de-facto, Researcher: BioNTech + Pfizer, Country: Germany + USA, Trial start: Apr 20, Vaccine type: mRNA BNT162b2 — Researcher: Moderna + NIAID, Country: USA, Trial start: Mar 16, Vaccine type: mRNA-1273 — Researcher: CureVac, Country: Germany, Trial start: Jun 18, Vaccine type: mRNA [... want %more?] | 01:58 |
tinwhiskers | oh... nice. that solves the problem I was wondering about | 01:58 |
LjL | maybe the bold is a bit spammy, i'll try changing to italics | 01:58 |
tinwhiskers | any other features? | 01:58 |
de-facto | its very very cool i love it :)) | 01:58 |
tinwhiskers | %vax china | 01:58 |
Brainstorm | tinwhiskers, Researcher: CanSino Biologics + Beijing Institute of BioTech, Country: China + Canada, Trial start: Mar 16, Vaccine type: Ad5-nCoV — Researcher: Anhui Zhifei Longcom Biopharma + Institute of Microbiology Chinese Academy of Sciences, Country: China, Trial start: Jun 22, Vaccine type: RBD-Dimer [... want %more?] | 01:58 |
LjL | tinwhiskers, well, it's an old feature, but always worth rehashing, you can do %more and it will partly spam you with something irrelevant (because i broke it in strange ways) but also give you a pastebin with the full list of those you inquired on | 01:59 |
LjL | %more | 01:59 |
tinwhiskers | %more | 01:59 |
Brainstorm | LjL, [...] continue to be important in curbing its spread. We therefore investigated their perceived usefulness, adherence and their predictors in representative online samples in eight countries (France, Germany, Poland, Russia, Spain, Sweden, U.K., U.S.). Of the 7,658 participants, 77.4% rated governmental measures (highest: Germany, lowest: France) as useful and [...] → https://paste.ee/p/MohhG | 01:59 |
Brainstorm | LjL, [...] Researcher: Sinovac, Country: China + Brazil, Trial start: Apr 13, Vaccine type: Inactivated — Researcher: Beijing Institute of BioProducts (Sinopharm), Country: China, Trial start: Apr 29, Vaccine type: Inactivated [...] → https://paste.ee/p/gkigD | 01:59 |
Brainstorm | tinwhiskers, [...] continue to be important in curbing its spread. We therefore investigated their perceived usefulness, adherence and their predictors in representative online samples in eight countries (France, Germany, Poland, Russia, Spain, Sweden, U.K., U.S.). Of the 7,658 participants, 77.4% rated governmental measures (highest: Germany, lowest: France) as [...] → https://paste.ee/p/zQDWA | 01:59 |
Brainstorm | tinwhiskers, [...] Researcher: Sinovac, Country: China + Brazil, Trial start: Apr 13, Vaccine type: Inactivated — Researcher: Beijing Institute of BioProducts (Sinopharm), Country: China, Trial start: Apr 29, Vaccine type: Inactivated [...] → https://paste.ee/p/bBfGa | 01:59 |
LjL | urgh :P | 01:59 |
LjL | but yeah... that | 01:59 |
tinwhiskers | heh | 01:59 |
LjL | the pastebin is somewhat readable although spacing would help | 01:59 |
tinwhiskers | sweet mother of God, that's a lot. | 02:00 |
tinwhiskers | spacing is fine | 02:00 |
LjL | and we're ignoring 'em all | 02:00 |
de-facto | why not format it as Tab Separated Values? readable and even loadable in to Excel et al | 02:00 |
LjL | i bet at some point we'll be desperate enough with few enough of "our" vaccines that we'll ask for some chinese ones | 02:00 |
tinwhiskers | I wonder | 02:01 |
LjL | de-facto, because it's not separate functionality, it just posts to the pastebin the same thing it would post to IRC, except with \n separating them instead of — | 02:01 |
tinwhiskers | yeah, TSV might be nice. | 02:01 |
tinwhiskers | ah | 02:01 |
LjL | but i guess i could change the core functionality so that \t is converted to space on IRC but not on the pastebin, would need to have a look at that code, it's old | 02:02 |
tinwhiskers | I think tabs are ignored on irc? | 02:02 |
LjL | i am not sure | 02:02 |
tinwhiskers | I'm not sure either | 02:02 |
LjL | %py print("a\ta") | 02:02 |
Brainstorm | aa | 02:02 |
LjL | well that shows as a space for me, but i'm not entirely sure what %py does behind the scenes so i'll have to check better | 02:03 |
tinwhiskers | yeah | 02:03 |
LjL | Brainstorm, reload covid | 02:03 |
Brainstorm | LjL: <module 'covid' from '/home/brainstorm/brainstorm/bot/modules/covid.py'> (version: 2020-12-08 01:03:19) | 02:03 |
LjL | %vac sdfsdf | 02:03 |
Brainstorm | LjL, no such vaccine found. Try checking https://covidvax.org | 02:03 |
Brainstorm | LjL, | 02:03 |
Brainstorm | LjL: An error occurred while searching. | 02:03 |
Brainstorm | LjL: An error occurred while searching. | 02:03 |
LjL | eeeeeh okay | 02:03 |
tinwhiskers | %vax usa | 02:03 |
de-facto | ah makes sense | 02:03 |
LjL | it's restarting, give it a sec | 02:04 |
tinwhiskers | oh | 02:04 |
LjL | unfortunately i cannot test it in realtime without causing... well, you saw :P | 02:04 |
LjL | %vax usa | 02:04 |
Brainstorm | LjL, Researcher: Janssen (Johnson & Johnson),Country: Belgium + USA,Participants: 91845,Trial start: Aug 11,Vaccine type: Ad26 — Researcher: BioNTech + Pfizer,Country: Germany + USA,Participants: 44866,Trial start: Apr 20,Vaccine type: mRNA BNT162b2 [... want %more?] | 02:04 |
LjL | %more | 02:04 |
Brainstorm | LjL, [...] Researcher: Novavax,Country: USA,Participants: 42035,Trial start: May 6,Vaccine type: NVX-CoV2373 — Researcher: Moderna + NIAID,Country: USA,Participants: 30755,Trial start: Mar 16,Vaccine type: mRNA-1273 [...] → https://paste.ee/p/XSUjh | 02:04 |
tinwhiskers | ah. bummer | 02:04 |
LjL | well this has \t's now | 02:04 |
LjL | (in the pastebin) | 02:04 |
LjL | (and maybe on IRC too but i see spaces!) | 02:05 |
tinwhiskers | yeah, but it also still has the commas | 02:05 |
tinwhiskers | not a good plan as-is | 02:05 |
LjL | oh yeah | 02:05 |
LjL | well just sed them away! :P | 02:05 |
tinwhiskers | it actually wouldn't work very well with "country", etc. in each one either | 02:06 |
tinwhiskers | how you had it was fine | 02:06 |
LjL | okay let me do something | 02:07 |
de-facto[m] | its loadable from TSV like that though | 02:08 |
de-facto[m] | well CSV also would work i guess | 02:08 |
de-facto[m] | is there are no commas in the text that is of course | 02:08 |
de-facto[m] | btw LjL did you make a safety copy before editing? | 02:09 |
LjL | hahah good joke | 02:10 |
tinwhiskers | lol | 02:10 |
LjL | wow this is hacky | 02:11 |
LjL | %tsvax China | 02:11 |
Brainstorm | LjL, ResearcherCountryParticipantsTrial startVaccine type — CanSino Biologics + Beijing Institute of BioTechChina + Canada41678Mar 16Ad5-nCoV — Anhui Zhifei Longcom Biopharma + Institute of Microbiology Chinese Academy of SciencesChina30216Jun 22RBD-Dimer — SinovacChina + Brazil26248Apr 13Inactivated [... want %more?] | 02:11 |
LjL | %more | 02:11 |
Brainstorm | LjL, [...] Beijing Institute of BioProducts (Sinopharm)China24448Apr 29Inactivated — Wuhan Institute of BioProducts (Sinopharm)China23056Apr 12Inactivated — Inovio PharmaUSA + China7498Apr 3DNA INO-4800 — Institute of Medical Biology + Chinese Academy of Medical SciencesSingapore + China1413May 15Inactivated [...] → https://paste.ee/p/6FWXQ | 02:11 |
LjL | i mean, i'm relying on dict() keeping the same (unspecified) order between different loops through it | 02:12 |
LjL | but... it works? | 02:12 |
tinwhiskers | oh. yeah | 02:12 |
LjL | i'm not sure about the other thing de-facto[m] asked me, the vaccine type, i said it would be easy before actually checking, it's not that easy with the currently pretty naive code | 02:13 |
de-facto | how do they derive their colors per CSS? they have classes like td.devBox tr.devEven tr.devOdd td.preBox tr.preEven tr.preOdd td.cliBox tr.cliEven tr.cliOdd td.disBox tr.disEven tr.disOdd | 02:17 |
de-facto | maybe that can be used for XPath in BS4? | 02:17 |
de-facto | e.g. [@class="..."] or such? | 02:17 |
LjL | i am completely ignorant of CSS | 02:18 |
de-facto | at some point the links in the onclick="..." attributes could be used to access the details pages | 02:19 |
de-facto | so maybe a solution would target both of those then? | 02:19 |
tinwhiskers | css has it's own alternating colour statement without needing to manually do odd/even classes but you can do it that. | 02:19 |
LjL | question: does "invalid syntax in line 404" imply i have no invalid syntax? | 02:19 |
de-facto | lol | 02:19 |
tinwhiskers | ha ha | 02:19 |
de-facto | is it HTTP code? :D | 02:19 |
LjL | well... no. good point | 02:22 |
LjL | %vax Moderna | 02:22 |
LjL | Brainstorm, restart faster | 02:22 |
LjL | spot-checking with rapid tests? | 02:23 |
LjL | %vax Moderna | 02:23 |
Brainstorm | LjL, Trial start: Mar 16, Researcher: Moderna + NIAID, Country: USA, Vaccine type: mRNA-1273, Participants: 30755, Clinical stage: Testing on humans | 02:23 |
de-facto | lol | 02:23 |
de-facto | wow that was fast :)) | 02:23 |
LjL | %vax abvision | 02:23 |
Brainstorm | LjL, Trial start: , Researcher: AbVision, Country: USA, Vaccine type: AVI-205, Participants: , Clinical stage: Testing on animals | 02:23 |
de-facto | thats awesome :))) | 02:23 |
de-facto | six minutes, LjL must be a Python god :) | 02:24 |
LjL | you say that because you haven't seen the code | 02:25 |
de-facto | probably Brainstorm needs longer to restart than you coding it :P | 02:25 |
LjL | that is sometimes an issue ;( | 02:25 |
LjL | especially with the other Brainstorm, the one doing earthquakes | 02:25 |
LjL | that one takes several minutes to be "up and running" | 02:25 |
LjL | sometimes i forget i was even testing a change | 02:25 |
LjL | my memory span doesn't really pass 60 seconds | 02:25 |
de-facto | I am running an instance of Limnoria on my router, it takes minutes until it fetched all RSS again and is up and running at the same state more or less | 02:28 |
LjL | %vax abvision | 02:28 |
Brainstorm | LjL, Researcher: AbVision, Country: USA, Vaccine: AVI-205, Stage: Testing on animals | 02:28 |
LjL | de-facto, Limnoria isn't very lightweight, i can imagine on a router it might struggle a bit | 02:29 |
de-facto | once it runs its fine but restarting is very slow | 02:29 |
de-facto | %vax AJ Vaccines | 02:29 |
Brainstorm | de-facto, Researcher: Emergex Vaccines + George Mason University's National Center for Biodefense and Infectious Diseases (NCIBD), Country: UK + Canada, Vaccine: Unknown, Stage: Testing on animals — Trial start: Jun, Researcher: Meissa Vaccines INC, Country: USA, Vaccine: Attenuated, Stage: Testing on animals [... want %more?] | 02:29 |
de-facto | %vax "AJ Vaccines" | 02:30 |
Brainstorm | de-facto, no such vaccine found. Try checking https://covidvax.org | 02:30 |
Brainstorm | de-facto, | 02:30 |
LjL | oh i forgot a return | 02:30 |
de-facto | %vax AJ | 02:30 |
Brainstorm | de-facto, Researcher: AJ Vaccines, Country: Denmark, Vaccine: S protein, Stage: Still in development | 02:30 |
LjL | uhm | 02:30 |
LjL | oh, yeah right | 02:31 |
LjL | each keyword is treated individually | 02:31 |
LjL | i just did that without thinking, maybe it's not good for this command | 02:31 |
LjL | %vax china mrna | 02:31 |
Brainstorm | LjL, Trial start: Apr 20, Researcher: BioNTech + Pfizer, Country: Germany + USA, Participants: 44866, Vaccine: mRNA BNT162b2, Stage: Testing on humans — Trial start: Mar 16, Researcher: CanSino Biologics + Beijing Institute of BioTech, Country: China + Canada, Participants: 41678, Vaccine: Ad5-nCoV, Stage: Testing on humans [... want %more?] | 02:31 |
LjL | but you can do this | 02:31 |
de-facto | %vax China AND mRNA | 02:31 |
Brainstorm | de-facto, Trial start: Apr 20, Researcher: BioNTech + Pfizer, Country: Germany + USA, Participants: 44866, Vaccine: mRNA BNT162b2, Stage: Testing on humans — Trial start: Mar 16, Researcher: CanSino Biologics + Beijing Institute of BioTech, Country: China + Canada, Participants: 41678, Vaccine: Ad5-nCoV, Stage: Testing on humans [... want %more?] | 02:31 |
LjL | the AND is implied, and i'm not going to add full search logic :P | 02:32 |
de-facto | right now its an OR right? | 02:33 |
de-facto | e.g. mMRA from Germany + USA OR inactivated from China | 02:33 |
de-facto | %vax stats | 02:36 |
Brainstorm | de-facto, no such vaccine found. Try checking https://covidvax.org | 02:36 |
de-facto | btw is that "by Category" page new? https://covidvax.org/covid19-vaccines-category/protein-based/protein-subunits-and-virus-like-particles | 02:38 |
LjL | oh you're right it's an "or", but that's easily fixed | 02:54 |
LjL | ("and" makes more sense to me) | 02:54 |
LjL | err i don't know. i didn't see it before, but i might have missed the presence of those three buttons entirely | 02:55 |
de-facto | i just remembered we talking about the Distribution button being new at some point | 02:55 |
LjL | https://covidvax.org/covid19-vaccines-category/other/ is probably a nice rabbit hole to dive into | 02:56 |
de-facto | interesting what are those? | 02:59 |
bigbertha[m]1 | > e.g. mMRA from Germany + USA OR inactivated from China | 03:02 |
bigbertha[m]1 | why was i pinged | 03:02 |
Brainstorm | New from r/WorldNews: worldnews: Man in Taiwan fined $3,500 for breaking COVID-19 quarantine for eight seconds → https://is.gd/09OjN8 | 03:02 |
de-facto | huh? didnt intend to ping you | 03:04 |
de-facto | was a typo btw i meant mRNA of course | 03:04 |
Brainstorm | Updates for New Zealand: +6 cases (now 2085) since a day ago | 03:05 |
tinwhiskers | ouch. six new cases | 03:23 |
tinwhiskers | all at the border at least | 03:25 |
Brainstorm | New from r/WorldNews: worldnews: China conducting biological tests to create super soldiers, US spy chief says | China → https://is.gd/g2ks2u | 03:27 |
tinwhiskers | still no community cases since Nov 18, but the nagging question is always whether there is an unknown background of cases | 03:27 |
Brainstorm | Updates for United Kingdom: +141 deaths (now 61435) since 19 hours ago | 03:37 |
xrogaan | Apparently, school have a pretty important role in transmitting SARS-COV2 | 03:50 |
xrogaan | https://tu-dresden.de/tu-dresden/newsportal/news/schulen-sind-keine-silent-hotspots | 03:51 |
de-facto | hmm interesting is that published somewhere? | 04:00 |
de-facto | i distrust schools studies, i have seen many fraudulent papers on that topic | 04:00 |
de-facto | hence i want to see the data itself with all associated info | 04:01 |
xrogaan | I'm not aware. You could try contacting the author, info are at the bottom. | 04:06 |
xrogaan | Probably not enough data to make any reliable conclusion. | 04:07 |
xrogaan | https://www.ndr.de/nachrichten/info/66-Coronavirus-Update-Die-Stunde-der-Antigen-Tests,podcastcoronavirus266.html | 04:09 |
xrogaan | IIUC kids somehow lost their antigen, and test reported the same number which induced an error in how it was reported. | 04:13 |
xrogaan | Right, under a long period of time of several months. | 04:14 |
Brainstorm | New from The Indian Express: World: The Kremlin is offering Russians free vaccines, but will they take them? → https://is.gd/gJcs34 | 04:29 |
Brainstorm | New from The Indian Express: World: Nobel ceremonies go low-key this year because of coronavirus → https://is.gd/8za4Lb | 04:41 |
LjL-Matrix | e: nobody actively pinged you in the backscroll that i can see (except me now), but maybe having "e" as a screenname is somewhat prone to mishighlights | 04:52 |
LjL | <de-facto> interesting what are those? ← just vaccines that don't fit into any of the big categories. so, probably the more exotic ones | 04:54 |
de-facto | xrogaan, btw found another about schools https://www.eurosurveillance.org/content/10.2807/1560-7917.ES.2020.25.38.2001645 | 04:55 |
de-facto | %title | 04:55 |
Brainstorm | de-facto: From www.eurosurveillance.org: Eurosurveillance | Surveillance of COVID-19 school outbreaks, Germany, March to August 2020 | 04:56 |
de-facto | LjL, yeah those are the interesting new concepts that dont fit into the common scheme | 04:56 |
xrogaan | thanks | 04:56 |
de-facto | xrogaan, another would be this | 04:59 |
de-facto | %title https://www.helmholtz-muenchen.de/aktuelles/uebersicht/pressemitteilungnews/article/48939/index.html | 04:59 |
Brainstorm | de-facto: From www.helmholtz-muenchen.de: Mehr Infektionen als bekannt: Neue Studie zeigt Relevanz bevölkerungsweiter SARS-CoV-2-Antikörpertests auf – Helmholtz Zentrum München | 04:59 |
de-facto | %title https://www.cell.com/med/fulltext/S2666-6340%2820%2930020-9 | 04:59 |
Brainstorm | de-facto: From www.cell.com: A Public Health Antibody Screening Indicates a 6-Fold Higher SARS-CoV-2 Exposure Rate than Reported Cases in Children: Med | 05:00 |
xrogaan | so the disease breathe through the kids without affecting them too much? | 05:00 |
KREYREEN | Are the IR thermometers harmful to ya? | 05:19 |
KREYREEN | I can feel warmth each time i measure with it and then me head hurts~ | 05:19 |
tinwhiskers | no | 05:20 |
KREYREEN | well i can feel warmth going through my head from the side where i measured~ | 05:20 |
xrogaan | Infrared is a light that we cannot see. | 05:21 |
tinwhiskers | psychosomatic I suspect. They use a very low powered infrared laser. | 05:22 |
KREYREEN | i can't see it, but i can feel it | 05:22 |
xrogaan | You emit IR right now. | 05:22 |
KREYREEN | tinwhiskers, nope tried to blindfold myself and for my room mate to measure it.. i was able to tell from where it came | 05:22 |
KREYREEN | and so did he | 05:22 |
tinwhiskers | ok | 05:22 |
xrogaan | if IR was harmful to you, you wouldn't be alive. | 05:22 |
KREYREEN | maybe broken somehow? it seems to be only with this thermometer | 05:23 |
LjL | tinwhiskers, they don't use an infrared laser. they use a visible light laser as an "aim", then the actual temperature measurement is passive afaik | 05:24 |
tinwhiskers | oh. ok | 05:24 |
tinwhiskers | you shouldn't be able to feel them anyway | 05:24 |
tinwhiskers | unless, it's broken, as you say | 05:24 |
KREYREEN | LjL, this one seems to be using IR based on the packaging though | 05:25 |
tinwhiskers | yes, it's measuring the IR emitted from your body | 05:25 |
LjL | yes they use IR, in that they are based on sensing IR radiation coming *from* your body | 05:25 |
KREYREEN | tinwhiskers, ye i have two and i can only feel this one | 05:25 |
xrogaan | KREYREEN: the thermometer measure the amount of light it receive. It's not emitting infrared towards your skull. | 05:25 |
LjL | the laser is completely separate to that though | 05:25 |
KREYREEN | xrogaan, weird O.o | 05:25 |
xrogaan | It's measuring the amount of radiation you emit, to know how hot you are. | 05:26 |
KREYREEN | why can i feel it and makes my head hurt then? | 05:26 |
KREYREEN | o.o | 05:26 |
LjL | i don't know | 05:26 |
xrogaan | > psychosomatic | 05:26 |
KREYREEN | xrogaan, possible i guess | 05:27 |
tinwhiskers | I think you should do another test with your room mate of when it is on and off, not where it is coming from. | 05:27 |
KREYREEN | tinwhiskers, will try | 05:27 |
tinwhiskers | cool | 05:27 |
LjL | yeah, even with your eyes closed, there's a ton of ways you could know where your roommate is | 05:27 |
LjL | subconsciously | 05:27 |
LjL | so just make it a random number of "am i turning it on or not?" | 05:27 |
LjL | in a fixed position | 05:28 |
LjL | you shouldn't be able to answer with >50% accuracy | 05:28 |
KREYREEN | oke | 05:28 |
LjL | unless they shoot the laser in your eye which is not a good idea | 05:28 |
xrogaan | that would be pointless if the thermometer makes a noise when turned on | 05:28 |
KREYREEN | they sleep atm so i will try that when they wake up | 05:28 |
KREYREEN | xrogaan, doesn't make a noise | 05:28 |
LjL | but also... why use infrared thermometers? they're good when you need to make a quick and dirty measurements, so stores, airports, etc | 05:29 |
LjL | but for measuring your own temperature i recommend a good old thermometer you put under your armpit or in your mouth (preferably not in this order without washing it in between) | 05:29 |
KREYREEN | LjL, i monitor my temperature alike 14 times a day and using the good old takes time~ | 05:30 |
KREYREEN | and is kinda uncomfy | 05:30 |
LjL | is there a reasy why you'd monitor it that often? | 05:30 |
tinwhiskers | you don't need to take an anal reading every time :-/ | 05:30 |
KREYREEN | fwiw when i have the batteries in i can even feel it on my hands when turned off.. but removing the batteries feeling nothing O.o | 05:30 |
tinwhiskers | I mean, rectal | 05:30 |
KREYREEN | LjL, comfort as i prefer to be at 36.7C and that changes during the day for me to know when it heat up and when to cool down as the natural reaction of the body is too slow and uncomfy when overheated~ | 05:31 |
gigasu_shida | heh | 05:31 |
KREYREEN | also health monitoring~ | 05:31 |
KREYREEN | tinwhiskers, i put that under armpit uwu | 05:32 |
xrogaan | That's ... absurd. | 05:32 |
LjL | i second that assessment | 05:32 |
KREYREEN | even though i am bisex nothing comes near my cute ass~ | 05:32 |
LjL | your body changes its temperature during the day for reasons | 05:32 |
LjL | let it do that | 05:32 |
KREYREEN | LjL, i know i adjust it based on feel | 05:32 |
tinwhiskers | let your body do it's own thing. It will do a better job of it. | 05:33 |
tinwhiskers | *its | 05:33 |
KREYREEN | as i live in a cold room and sleep in 16C | 05:33 |
KREYREEN | so letting it do it's own thing would be me with hypothermia x.x | 05:33 |
tinwhiskers | if you *feel* cold, warm up. If you *feel* hot cool down. Don't use a thermometer to tell you that. You body knows better. | 05:34 |
KREYREEN | tinwhiskers, i may feel fine and have 35.2C while being confused to why am i shaking | 05:34 |
tinwhiskers | if you feel fine then you are fine | 05:34 |
LjL | then you have some kind of medical condition, i think | 05:34 |
LjL | tinwhiskers, if he has 35°C and he's shaking he's no fine, tbf | 05:34 |
KREYREEN | tinwhiskers, not really~ I may feel fine and not realize that i am cold to the point when i am shaking from it~ | 05:35 |
xrogaan | tinwhiskers: unless subject to hypoxemia, that is. | 05:35 |
tinwhiskers | o.O | 05:35 |
LjL | KREYREEN, the shaking should probably be a clue, though | 05:35 |
KREYREEN | LjL, well i have dry skin so i assume that the dead skin blocks the pores and holds more heat O.o | 05:35 |
LjL | nah | 05:35 |
xrogaan | no. | 05:35 |
KREYREEN | O.o | 05:36 |
LjL | it's not *normal* to have abnormally low body temperature and be shaking from it, while also feeling "fine" at the same time | 05:36 |
LjL | see a doctor | 05:36 |
KREYREEN | LjL, like i may have 35C on forehead but i could have lower temperature on other parts of the body which is usually the case when i notice being too cold | 05:37 |
tinwhiskers | other parts can get quite a lot cooler without any problem | 05:37 |
KREYREEN | doctors didn't find anything x.x | 05:37 |
LjL | going into hypothermia without realizing is... i don't know the name of this medical condition or if it even has a name, but it's most definitely not normal, and could be dangerous | 05:37 |
xrogaan | Aren't there medications to reduce your body temperature? | 05:37 |
KREYREEN | was told to be weird for getting used to sleeping at such temps and drinking 5L of water daily~ | 05:38 |
LjL | sleeping at 16°C is nothing unusual from what i hear, just not common in my culture | 05:38 |
gigasu_shida | haha | 05:38 |
LjL | but i've been told off by foreigners a few times for using heating at 21°C or so | 05:38 |
KREYREEN | like i am in central europe so it's warm here but i use AC to bring the temperature down bcs it's comfier to sleep in | 05:38 |
LjL | you actually... | 05:39 |
LjL | say it ain't so | 05:39 |
tinwhiskers | back home I often sleep at around 5C inside | 05:39 |
KREYREEN | o.o | 05:39 |
gigasu_shida | ljl have you ever had a swoll lymph node in your pectoral muscle area? | 05:39 |
KREYREEN | 5C is too low for me~ i want to be in a warn blanket heated by my body temperature | 05:39 |
LjL | gigasu_shida, i assume you mean a swollen one... no, i've had swollen neck lymph nodes | 05:39 |
tinwhiskers | yeah, it's too cold for me too :-) | 05:39 |
KREYREEN | o.o | 05:39 |
gigasu_shida | has anyone ever noticed a swollen lymph node in their pectoral muscle area? | 05:40 |
KREYREEN | aldo i don't mind down to -4C outside with tshirt~ | 05:40 |
euod[m] | LjL: milan fucking killed me with the heat. I couldn't believe anybody would be willing to sleep in the country at all. | 05:40 |
KREYREEN | beyond that i wear me isolated thin jacket~ | 05:40 |
LjL | tinwhiskers, i don't know about NZ but when my sister went to Australia she was kinda freezing because they just didn't have heating there, and sure, it's a warmer climate than here, but still, when it's 14°C outside for prolonged periods of time, at some point it will be 14°C inside too, and we're really not used to having temperatures that low indoor. | 05:40 |
tinwhiskers | yeah, well I have poor insulation and heating my bedroom is a lost cause so it pretty much sits at outside temperatures - I use a lot of blankets. | 05:41 |
LjL | euod[m], nobody *wants* to be in Milan in the summer, that's why anyone who can afford it has a place in the alps to hide away during summer holidays | 05:41 |
tinwhiskers | yeah, our older houses suck | 05:41 |
KREYREEN | i made a hole in my wall today and then isolated it~ | 05:41 |
LjL | euod[m], there's actually a problem with Milan becoming devoid of open shops in August, because everything just closed down. less so in recent years, but... kinda still to some extent. | 05:41 |
KREYREEN | damn worked made it to mold there uwu | 05:42 |
KREYREEN | *workers | 05:42 |
tinwhiskers | My house is over 100 years old so has no wall insulation. When it's windy outside heating the bedroom is futile for any reasonable cost. | 05:42 |
tinwhiskers | but blankets are cheap | 05:42 |
LjL | blankets don't really do it for me when it's *that* cold | 05:42 |
KREYREEN | tinwhiskers, why no coak and the membrane put on the outside of the house~ | 05:42 |
tinwhiskers | I don't know what that is | 05:42 |
KREYREEN | basically a membrane used to isolate the house from wind and water that you wrap your house with | 05:43 |
Brainstorm | New from The Indian Express: World: After botched Covid-19 response, UK tackles giant vaccine rollout → https://is.gd/cARMKl | 05:43 |
tinwhiskers | My house has six fireplaces but keeping them all running is a mission. | 05:43 |
gigasu_shida | is it like a membrane used for termite fumigation? | 05:43 |
KREYREEN | pretty cheap too and can be done by one person within 3 hours | 05:43 |
gigasu_shida | that would really keep the wind out | 05:43 |
KREYREEN | for a big house O.o | 05:43 |
tinwhiskers | and they don't last the night. | 05:43 |
gigasu_shida | wood fires pollute anyways | 05:44 |
gigasu_shida | i'd hate to live in a small town where everyone's burning wood | 05:44 |
tinwhiskers | meh. they're carbon neutral and I live in the country so air quality is not a problem. | 05:44 |
euod[m] | try living somewhere upperclass. | 05:44 |
euod[m] | same issue. | 05:44 |
KREYREEN | gigasu_shida, nah it's thin usually made out of plastic and then nailed on the outside of the house and the holes insulated with a tape | 05:44 |
gigasu_shida | oh i see those membranes on houses that are being built | 05:44 |
gigasu_shida | it keeps the water out i guess | 05:44 |
KREYREEN | gigasu_shida, ye these~ pretty common practice | 05:45 |
euod[m] | modern houses are mostly a lot more air tight. | 05:45 |
KREYREEN | gigasu_shida, water and wind | 05:45 |
tinwhiskers | No, I wouldn't cover my house in a plastic sheet. It's an old iconic farm house. I don't even want to strip the lathe and plaster interior to insulate it. | 05:45 |
KREYREEN | but the house should be designed to not keep any water so you usually want to have a space for airflow in front of that | 05:45 |
KREYREEN | tinwhiskers, it doesn't affect the look of the house mostly.. | 05:45 |
KREYREEN | only exterior | 05:45 |
tinwhiskers | I don't mind the cold tbh. I'm just saying. | 05:46 |
LjL | well it sounds like he cares about the exterior | 05:46 |
KREYREEN | also for the interior you might want to take a look for the air-applied insulation.. basically you clean out your house tape windows and doors and release it inside and where it leaks it will insulate | 05:46 |
tinwhiskers | yeah, I have considered that option. | 05:47 |
tinwhiskers | But, as I say, I really don't mind my bedroom being that cold. A couple of blankets and a couple of duvets and I'm fine. The worst part is getting out of bed in the morning. | 05:47 |
KREYREEN | I see O.o | 05:48 |
tinwhiskers | My lounge I have upgraded and it's lovely and warm and remains that way over night. Bedrooms are just a place to sleep then leave over winter :-) | 05:48 |
KREYREEN | i just have king-size bed that i mostly sleep alone in and with two blankets each for one leg and keeping chest open~ | 05:48 |
de-facto | https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Human_body_temperature#/media/File:Body_Temp_Variation.png | 05:48 |
LjL | i was reading something, i don't even remember where or what the main subject was, that claimed the more we regulate ambient factors like temperature to make it stable and "comfortable", the more our body forgets about its abilities to live in a wider range of environments | 05:48 |
de-facto | daily periodic variation of almost one degree a bit like a sine wave or such | 05:49 |
LjL | so if that's true, it's perfectly possible i'd totally freeze and be unable to sleep while tinwhiskers is snoring in 5°C | 05:49 |
tinwhiskers | I have ducted heating that comes out the ceiling roses and that takes the edge off the bedrooms for a few hours at night, but come morning there is ice on the inside of the windows over winter. | 05:49 |
KREYREEN | LjL, o.o | 05:49 |
LjL | just because he's gotten used to that over the years and i haven't | 05:49 |
tinwhiskers | yeah | 05:50 |
KREYREEN | LjL, fwiw i mostly noticed similar behavior on people living in a cold climate~ seems that the bodies get used to the temperature and create more heat to balance that and like dogs get more hairs growing~ | 05:50 |
LjL | 5°C just seems like an unfathomable temperature for me to sleep in, unless i'm in a pretty expensive sleeping bag | 05:50 |
KREYREEN | i can for sure notice my hair being more dense o.o | 05:50 |
LjL | well Milan has some extremes, if you don't have heating and A/C | 05:51 |
KREYREEN | LjL, fwiw the idea i see is to be very warm under a warm blanket with the ability for body to throw cool itself down during the sleep | 05:51 |
LjL | we can almost touch 40°C in the summer, while i think our lowest point in recent decades was -12°C | 05:51 |
KREYREEN | sometimes i also wake up bcs i am too cold snuggle in the blanket and immediatelly fall asleep~ | 05:51 |
KREYREEN | LjL, o.o | 05:52 |
tinwhiskers | LjL: wow. We go to about 34 and down to -6 | 05:52 |
KREYREEN | i hate warm weather~ makes me overheat mostly unless i get a shower to normalize the temperature~ | 05:52 |
KREYREEN | but 36C and i feel like dieing anyway | 05:52 |
KREYREEN | well even 32C i g | 05:53 |
LjL | tinwhiskers, doesn't sound so different... 34°C is already torrid weather in my book, when we almost touch 40°C i'm generally just not here | 05:53 |
LjL | the difference is | 05:53 |
LjL | in the winter, the apartment doesn't really go below 19°C | 05:53 |
tinwhiskers | right. What's you latitude? | 05:53 |
LjL | and in the summer, well... we didn't always have air conditioning here but we do now, so | 05:53 |
LjL | tinwhiskers, around 45 north | 05:54 |
LjL | but if you compare that to american latitudes, the climate are completely different | 05:54 |
tinwhiskers | I'm 43 | 05:54 |
LjL | i determined with someone that we have similar climate to Washington DC | 05:54 |
LjL | well, similar temperatures | 05:54 |
KREYREEN | o.o | 05:54 |
LjL | they have a lot more bad storms | 05:54 |
LjL | %geo washington, dc | 05:55 |
Brainstorm | LjL, Location not found for washington, dc. | 05:55 |
KREYREEN | LjL, do you have any medical explanation to why i feel like dieing in zlin~ | 05:55 |
LjL | KREYREEN, you what? | 05:55 |
KREYREEN | i literally struggle breathing there and have to leave asap | 05:55 |
LjL | zlin? | 05:55 |
KREYREEN | LjL, ye Zlin, Czech republic | 05:55 |
LjL | uuuh i don't know | 05:55 |
KREYREEN | o.o | 05:55 |
tinwhiskers | it almost seems like you have some thermoregulation issues. | 05:56 |
KREYREEN | tinwhiskers, in zlin it doesn't seem to be related to the temperature.. rather the air O.o | 05:56 |
tinwhiskers | oh | 05:56 |
LjL | the worst about milan air is that it sometimes smells like manure. like a lot. | 05:57 |
tinwhiskers | well, then my guess is far less charitable | 05:57 |
LjL | i remember getting out of a plane once and being like - oh yeah, i'm definitely in Milan. | 05:57 |
KREYREEN | aldo the air is based on the stations measuring it average yet it makes me feel terrible | 05:57 |
KREYREEN | LjL, lol | 05:57 |
LjL | it's quite shocking, when you're in a plane with controlled air circulation, then suddenly you smell what it's like outside | 05:58 |
gigasu_shida | lol manure | 05:58 |
LjL | i don't know if it's manure or some chemicals from some factory somewhere or what | 05:58 |
LjL | but it smells like pungent... crap | 05:58 |
KREYREEN | LjL, the best smell! | 05:59 |
LjL | i beg to differ | 05:59 |
KREYREEN | unless it's too intense~ | 05:59 |
KREYREEN | x.x | 05:59 |
KREYREEN | sometimes calms me down e.g. being on a farm~ | 05:59 |
LjL | you wake up, bring up the shutters, you're like oooh what a nice day, let's open the window, and then eeewww | 05:59 |
xrogaan | If the room temperature goes above 25°C, I get naked. The heat is unbearable. | 05:59 |
KREYREEN | probably mostly bcs i am overwhelmed by the animals there~ | 05:59 |
KREYREEN | LjL, lol | 05:59 |
LjL | 25°C is normal A/C setting in most places that use A/C routinely | 06:00 |
KREYREEN | xrogaan, simmilar | 06:00 |
xrogaan | no A/C here. | 06:00 |
de-facto | LjL, heh at least you know 1) you are in Milan 2) everything is like it was before 3) your sense of smell works just fine :) | 06:00 |
KREYREEN | around 23.5C is uncomfortable for me and 32C is unberable | 06:00 |
LjL | de-facto, well 3 is more important/meaningful than it used to be, but on the other hand, chances i'd be getting off a plane nowadays are *really slim* | 06:01 |
de-facto | indeed | 06:01 |
KREYREEN | unless you have your own plane ^-^ | 06:01 |
LjL | i wish | 06:01 |
KREYREEN | like cessna is cheap~ | 06:01 |
LjL | for some definition of cheap | 06:01 |
KREYREEN | and you can recover from a spin in that so i see that as win~ | 06:01 |
KREYREEN | LjL, last time i checked it was around 800K CZK | 06:02 |
LjL | i'd much rather not get into a spin in the first place thank you very much | 06:02 |
KREYREEN | and 250K CZK for broken | 06:02 |
LjL | KREYREEN, it's not just the cost of the airplane. fuel, maintenance, storage | 06:02 |
KREYREEN | LjL, yes, but it's a good practice to be trained to handle that situation | 06:02 |
LjL | oh, and getting a license | 06:02 |
LjL | that's not particularly cheap either | 06:03 |
LjL | also i'd make the worst pilot ever | 06:03 |
KREYREEN | LjL, true the fuel gets price-y, maintainance is basically get certified and learn maintainance or pay someone and storage is 30K CZK last time i checked~ | 06:03 |
KREYREEN | o.o | 06:03 |
KREYREEN | also they have the hydrogen-powered aircrafts now that are waaaaay cheaper to pay for fuel | 06:03 |
KREYREEN | basically one-time 60K payment for small rafinery ofair | 06:04 |
LjL | i have a better plan, i'll get rich by selling Brainstorm and buy a private jet and hire a pilot | 06:05 |
tinwhiskers | \o/ | 06:05 |
KREYREEN | LjL, private jet is expensive af lol | 06:05 |
LjL | well then i better sell Brainstorm for good money | 06:05 |
KREYREEN | hmm O.o | 06:06 |
LjL | but now, sleep | 06:06 |
KREYREEN | but i slept already! | 06:06 |
LjL | i mean me! | 06:06 |
KREYREEN | LjL, ah o.o | 06:06 |
LjL | one of these days i'll enable the Markov | 06:07 |
de-facto | LOL :) | 06:07 |
KREYREEN | lol brainstorm so cute~ | 06:07 |
Brainstorm | New from The Indian Express: World: Hong Kong returns to tightest COVID-19 restrictions as cases spike → https://is.gd/G253mN | 06:08 |
KREYREEN | LjL, can you make Brainstorm to give me virtual headpats 3x a day~ | 06:08 |
gigasu_shida | lol | 06:11 |
LjL | KREYREEN, no, but i can do this | 06:11 |
LjL | %compliment KREYREEN | 06:12 |
Brainstorm | KREYREEN, Never pet your dog when it is on fire. | 06:12 |
LjL | Brainstorm, that's not even a compliment ffs | 06:12 |
LjL | not even close | 06:12 |
KREYREEN | LjL, but i wanted headpats uwu | 06:12 |
KREYREEN | and i would pat my dog so hard if it was on fire~ | 06:12 |
LjL | you can't always get what you want~ | 06:13 |
KREYREEN | said who! | 06:13 |
KREYREEN | UwU | 06:14 |
tinwhiskers | :-) | 06:14 |
LjL | boo, the Markov chopper isn't chopping :( | 06:17 |
Brainstorm | New from CNBC Health: Bill Gates says six Covid vaccines could be available by spring 2021: Bill Gates has predicted there could be as many as half a dozen Covid-19 vaccines approved and ready for distribution by the first quarter next year. → https://is.gd/aQ7Oxi | 06:20 |
KREYREEN | LjL, chop meh senpai~ | 06:20 |
de-facto | "Pfizer, Moderna, AstraZeneca, Johnson & Johnson and Novavax" | 06:23 |
LjL | Johnson AND Johnson, duh | 06:24 |
de-facto | "He did not name a sixth vaccine source." <-- ah ok | 06:24 |
KREYREEN | which vaccine seems to be the most promising in terms of side effects and the immune response btw? | 06:25 |
LjL | maybe it's his own | 06:25 |
LjL | i'm going to say Moderna | 06:25 |
euod[m] | moderna, probably. | 06:25 |
LjL | but we only have press releases, not hard data | 06:25 |
euod[m] | they did well not to go to the whitehouse uh, vaccine summit? | 06:26 |
de-facto | Novavax Q4 2020, Inovio Pharma Q4 2020, BioNTech + Pfizer Q4 2020, Janssen (Johnson & Johnson) Q2 2021, Sanofi Pasteur + GSK H2 2021?, Jenner Institute (University of Oxford) H2 2021? source: https://covidvax.org/covid19-vaccines-distribution | 06:28 |
tinwhiskers | yeah, Oxford is using an adenovirus, which might work well the first time so it could save the day, but the mRNA vaccines seem to have better long-term prospects. Of those Moderna seems more practical to store/deliver. | 06:28 |
KREYREEN | LjL, why moderna? i though they are both RNA-based vaccines where i would think something like Novavax would be more safe to let the body get the immune response by exposing it to the dead rotavirus with spike protein of a SARS-CoV-2 ? | 06:28 |
tinwhiskers | KREYREEN: yeah, well that's the traditional approach.... err rotavirus? | 06:29 |
tinwhiskers | %vax novavax | 06:30 |
Brainstorm | tinwhiskers, Trial start: May 6, Researcher: Novavax, Country: USA, Participants: 42035, Vaccine: NVX-CoV2373, Stage: Testing on humans | 06:30 |
KREYREEN | tinwhiskers, sounded like rotavirus from what ppl explained to me O.o | 06:30 |
tinwhiskers | "Novavax is developing a “subunit” vaccine - which sends copies of the virus’s spike protein directly into the body to stimulate an immune response." | 06:31 |
tinwhiskers | erm. ok | 06:31 |
euod[m] | .. oh fuck off. | 06:31 |
KREYREEN | whaaaat~ | 06:31 |
KREYREEN | that's my actual concern >.> probably very stupid though~ | 06:32 |
tinwhiskers | rotavirus is not related here afaik | 06:32 |
KREYREEN | as when that happened i was 5 yo~ | 06:32 |
KREYREEN | and my friend has this ugly creater on his arm from a vaccine~ | 06:33 |
KREYREEN | tinwhiskers, i see O.o | 06:33 |
de-facto | about the novax NVX-CoV2373 https://www.nejm.org/doi/full/10.1056/NEJMoa2026920 | 06:33 |
de-facto | %title | 06:33 |
Brainstorm | de-facto: From www.nejm.org: Phase 1–2 Trial of a SARS-CoV-2 Recombinant Spike Protein Nanoparticle Vaccine | NEJM | 06:33 |
de-facto | "NVX-CoV2373 is a recombinant severe acute respiratory syndrome coronavirus 2 (rSARS-CoV-2) nanoparticle vaccine composed of trimeric full-length SARS-CoV-2 spike glycoproteins and Matrix-M1 adjuvant." | 06:33 |
KREYREEN | tinwhiskers, maybe renevirus or something alike? ppl told me that over the phone x.x | 06:33 |
KREYREEN | recombinant! | 06:33 |
KREYREEN | close enough~ | 06:33 |
tinwhiskers | err. no | 06:34 |
KREYREEN | ... yes forget i said rotavirus and renewhatever | 06:34 |
tinwhiskers | recombinant? no. | 06:34 |
KREYREEN | o.o | 06:34 |
KREYREEN | sounds the same! | 06:34 |
KREYREEN | almost | 06:34 |
de-facto | so basically its the S-protein from SARS-CoV-2 exposed to the immune system by their Matrix-M1 adjuvant (thats like a body that is "spiked" with the s-protein afaik) | 06:34 |
KREYREEN | what's matrix-m1 | 06:35 |
tinwhiskers | if your friend got a scar from a vaccine it may have been the BCG vaccine, which gives about 15% of people a scar, iirc. | 06:35 |
tinwhiskers | other vaccines can cause scars in more rare cases. | 06:35 |
de-facto | that ensures the correct orientation of the s-protein exposing the immunologic surfaces so that the antibodies can be developed against the epitopes that also are exposed when the s-protein is on the surface of sars-cov-2 | 06:36 |
de-facto | https://www.novavax.com/our-unique-technology | 06:37 |
de-facto | "At 35 days, NVX-CoV2373 appeared to be safe, and it elicited immune responses that exceeded levels in Covid-19 convalescent serum. The Matrix-M1 adjuvant induced CD4+ T-cell responses that were biased toward a Th1 phenotype." | 06:39 |
de-facto | "Matrix-M1, a saponin-based adjuvant,12 was manufactured by Novavax." | 06:42 |
de-facto | %title https://journals.plos.org/plosone/article?id=10.1371/journal.pone.0041451 | 06:43 |
Brainstorm | de-facto: From journals.plos.org: Matrix-M™ Adjuvant Induces Local Recruitment, Activation and Maturation of Central Immune Cells in Absence of Antigen | 06:43 |
de-facto | "rSARS-CoV-2, developed by Novavax and manufactured at Emergent Biosolutions, is a recombinant nanoparticle vaccine constructed from the full-length (i.e., including the transmembrane domain), wild-type SARS-CoV-2 spike glycoprotein (GenBank accession number, MN908947; nucleotides 21563–25384) optimized in the established baculovirus Spodoptera frugiperda (Sf9) insect cell-expression system" | 06:45 |
de-facto | "rSARS-CoV-2 and Matrix-M1 were mixed just before use. Each participant received two intramuscular injections of trial vaccine or placebo (injection volume, 0.6 ml) in the deltoid muscle, one injection on day 0 and one on day 21." | 06:45 |
KREYREEN | So i tried the thermometer | 06:45 |
KREYREEN | she doesn't feel anything~ | 06:45 |
KREYREEN | so i think i am a psychopath | 06:46 |
KREYREEN | tinwhiskers, that was a vaccine for a desease that causes bumps all over the body afaik.. it's 2cm in diameter crater 2mm deep | 06:47 |
KREYREEN | noted definition of Matrix-M1, no idea what saponin is x.x | 06:47 |
KREYREEN | de-facto, ^ | 06:47 |
de-facto | https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Saponin | 06:49 |
de-facto | "Adjuvant Matrix-M (TM) is comprised of 40 nm nanoparticles composed of Quillaja saponins, cholesterol and phospholipid. " | 06:50 |
de-facto | see my link above https://journals.plos.org/plosone/article?id=10.1371/journal.pone.0041451 | 06:51 |
de-facto | https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Quillaja | 06:52 |
de-facto | %title https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC6337100/ | 06:52 |
Brainstorm | de-facto: From www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov: Saponins from Quillaja saponaria and Quillaja brasiliensis: Particular Chemical Characteristics and Biological Activities | 06:52 |
xrogaan | psychopath what? | 06:54 |
xrogaan | psychosomatic has nothing to do with psychopath | 06:54 |
de-facto | %title https://ir.novavax.com/news-releases/news-release-details/novavax-provides-phase-3-covid-19-vaccine-clinical-development | 06:56 |
Brainstorm | de-facto: From ir.novavax.com: Novavax Provides Phase 3 COVID-19 Vaccine Clinical Development Update | Novavax Inc. - IR Site | 06:56 |
xrogaan | psychosomatic means that a disorder is being generated amd/or driven by your mind. That it is not a mechanical issue, like a broken bone. | 06:56 |
de-facto | placebo effect | 06:58 |
de-facto | oh there are even more press releases https://ir.novavax.com/press-releases | 07:00 |
de-facto | newest https://ir.novavax.com/news-releases/news-release-details/novavax-announces-covid-19-vaccine-clinical-development-progress | 07:00 |
de-facto | why dont all the vaccine manufacturers provide RSS or ATOM feeds about their press releases? | 07:02 |
Brainstorm | Updates for Bermuda, United Kingdom: +18 cases (now 306) since 2 days ago — Belgium: +859 cases (now 592615), +66 deaths (now 17386) since a day ago — Anguilla, United Kingdom: +3 cases (now 10) since 3 days ago | 07:05 |
xrogaan | de-facto: it's reportedly "old tech" and "modern" people dislike whatever is old. That's what I've read. | 07:29 |
xrogaan | I could go deeper, but it's not covid related. | 07:29 |
Brainstorm | Updates for US: +208557 cases (now 15.4 million), +1512 deaths (now 290474) since 17 hours ago | 07:37 |
euod[m] | 4.7%. | 07:38 |
de-facto | well yeah its RSS and ATOM are old but standardized, so since the vaccine manufacturers dont provide something with the same functionality (i wont subscribe to their email spamming exposing my mail address) i guess i wont read all their press releases. their loss. | 07:50 |
Brainstorm | Updates for Wales, United Kingdom: +2021 cases (now 91013), +2 deaths (now 2711) since a day ago — Moscow Oblast, Russia: +1315 cases (now 119550), +31 deaths (now 2283) since a day ago — Samara, Russia: +274 cases (now 24213), +4 deaths (now 455) since a day ago — Crimea Republic, Ukraine: +271 cases (now 17109), +6 deaths (now 332) since a day ago | 08:05 |
xrogaan | de-facto: there are smartphone apps probably, designed to spy on you. | 08:06 |
Brainstorm | New from BBC Health: First person receives Covid-19 vaccine in UK: Margaret Keenan, 90, says she feels "so privileged" to receive the jab as the UK begins the biggest vaccination programme in NHS history. → https://is.gd/48MboF | 08:22 |
Brainstorm | New from CNBC Health: A 90-year-old woman gets first Covid vaccine in UK, as massive rollout begins: Margaret Keenan, a 90 year-old grandmother, made history as she became the first person to receive the Pfizer-BioNTech vaccine outside of trial conditions. → https://is.gd/iQ9QGO | 08:34 |
Brainstorm | New from BBC Health: First person receives Covid-19 vaccine in UK: Margaret Keenan, 90, says she feels "so privileged" to receive the jab as the UK begins the biggest vaccination programme in NHS history. → https://is.gd/48MboF | 08:47 |
de-facto[m] | Neat so hopefully this is the start of the end to the pandemic | 08:58 |
euod[m] | it's going to be more than a year before there's a substantial portion of any population vaccinated. | 08:59 |
de-facto[m] | Yes it will take quite some time and effort until we see substantial decline in fatalities and hopefully also infections | 09:05 |
Brainstorm | New from COVID-19 Vaccine News: 90-Year-Old Receives First Coronavirus Vaccine: Margaret Keenan, 90, is the first person in the world to receive a clinically authorized, fully tested coronavirus vaccine. She was given the shot at a hospital in Coventry, in central England → https://is.gd/K5ZbLL | 09:11 |
Brainstorm | New from BBC Health: First person receives Covid-19 vaccine in UK: Margaret Keenan, 90, says she feels "so privileged" to receive the jab as the UK begins the biggest vaccination programme in NHS history. → https://is.gd/48MboF | 09:23 |
CoronaBot | 04/r/covid19: British grandma is first in world to get Pfizer vaccine outside trial (87 votes) | https://reut.rs/2JWR7rI | https://redd.it/k9003s | 09:32 |
Brainstorm | New from Medical Xpress: What are schools doing to feed students during COVID-19-related closures?: As schools across the United States are grappling with remote and hybrid learning due to the COVID-19 pandemic, a new study in the Journal of Nutrition Education and Behavior, investigates the initial responses of child nutrition administrative agencies [... want %more?] → https://is.gd/ErXH0c | 09:48 |
Brainstorm | New from Medical Xpress: Travel restrictions must be used in a targeted way to be effective at controlling local COVID-19 transmission: study: The measures may have limited impact on the epidemic within individual countries except those with low levels of the virus or that have strong travel links with countries experiencing high rates of infection. → https://is.gd/FPnBfy | 10:00 |
Brainstorm | New from Medical Xpress: Researchers study the effects of parental job loss on families during the pandemic: A team of UTSA researchers has discovered that economic implications because of COVID-19 can have a devastating ripple effect on children. Monica Lawson, assistant professor of psychology, Megan Piel, assistant professor of social work and [... want %more?] → https://is.gd/0zTCDE | 10:13 |
Brainstorm | New from Medical Xpress: Indonesia expects halal certificate for experimental vaccine: Indonesia's highest Muslim clerical body is expected to issue a halal certification for the experimental COVID-19 vaccine developed by China-based Sinovac Biotech, officials said Monday. → https://is.gd/bATaLA | 10:25 |
Brainstorm | New from BBC Health: First person receives Covid-19 vaccine in UK: Margaret Keenan, who turns 91 next week, said it was the "best early birthday present" to receive the jab as the UK begins the biggest vaccination programme in NHS history. → https://is.gd/48MboF | 10:37 |
Brainstorm | New from Medical Xpress: Diseases, Conditions, Syndromes: Should I wipe down groceries during the pandemic? → https://is.gd/Dm4eV9 | 10:50 |
Brainstorm | New from Medical Xpress: Hong Kong to impose new virus restrictions to battle fourth wave: Hong Kong will ban evening dining at restaurants and close fitness centres, the city's leader said Tuesday, as part of new measures aimed at stemming a fourth wave of coronavirus infections. → https://is.gd/WRBVYP | 11:02 |
Brainstorm | New from NPR: In NYC, Christmas Without Tourists Is Not Merry For Businesses: Holiday tourism is off sharply in New York. Businesses are looking for other ways to break even this holiday season because they usually count on a big bump in tourist revenue this time of year. → https://is.gd/x5e7CW | 11:14 |
Brainstorm | New from BBC Health: First person receives Covid-19 vaccine in UK: Margaret Keenan, who turns 91 next week, said it was the "best early birthday present" to receive the jab as the UK begins the biggest vaccination programme in NHS history. → https://is.gd/48MboF | 11:27 |
Brainstorm | Updates for Switzerland: +4262 cases (now 358568), +120 deaths (now 5527) since 23 hours ago | 11:51 |
Brainstorm | New from Medical Xpress: Mystery illness frays India's coronavirus nerves: Hundreds of people have been treated for mystery illness in a southern Indian town, with one doctor ruling out "mass hysteria" at a time nerves are already frayed because of the coronavirus. → https://is.gd/3FNKjo | 11:51 |
Brainstorm | New from NPR: U.K. Begins Nationwide Coronavirus Immunization, Largest In Nation's History: A 90-year-old woman from Coventry received the first vaccine shot as part of the United Kingdom's nationwide immunization campaign launched Tuesday. → https://is.gd/ug2nRe | 12:04 |
Brainstorm | New from The Indian Express (Health): Health: Voluntary blood donations back to pre-COVID levels: National Blood Transfusion Council → https://is.gd/mlFlhW | 12:29 |
Brainstorm | New from BBC Health: First person receives Covid-19 vaccine in UK: Margaret Keenan, who turns 91 next week, said it was the "best early birthday present" to receive the jab as the UK begins the biggest vaccination programme in NHS history. → https://is.gd/48MboF | 12:40 |
Brainstorm | New from BBC Health: When will you be eligible for the Covid vaccine?: The Pfizer/BioNtech vaccine is being given to people across the UK from Tuesday - when will it be available for you? → https://is.gd/VYjcP8 | 13:05 |
Brainstorm | Updates for US: +209486 cases (now 15.4 million), +1687 deaths (now 290649) since 23 hours ago | 13:36 |
Brainstorm | New from Medical Xpress: Researchers share database for studying individual differences in language skills: Why do people differ in their ability to use language? As part of a larger study into this question, researchers from the Max Planck Institute for Psycholinguistics (MPI) and Radboud University tested 122 adult native speakers of Dutch on [... want %more?] → https://is.gd/kqhIT8 | 13:42 |
Brainstorm | New from BBC Health: First person receives Covid-19 vaccine in UK: Margaret Keenan, who turns 91 next week, becomes the first person in the world to get the jab as part of a mass vaccination programme, calling it the "best early birthday present". → https://is.gd/48MboF | 13:55 |
Brainstorm | New from CNBC Health: (news): FDA says Pfizer Covid vaccine data did not raise safety concerns → https://is.gd/eVbRtY | 14:19 |
Brainstorm | Updates for Sweden: +18820 cases (now 297732), +133 deaths (now 7200) since 3 days ago — Denmark: +2150 cases (now 94799), +7 deaths (now 901) since a day ago | 14:22 |
Brainstorm | Updates for Netherlands: +5366 cases (now 570437), +47 deaths (now 9775) since 21 hours ago | 14:50 |
CoronaBot | 04/r/coronavirus: BBC News - First patient receives Pfizer Covid-19 vaccine (10300 votes) | https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-55227325 | https://redd.it/k8zl3d | 15:04 |
Brainstorm | Updates for Germany: +5647 cases (now 1.2 million), +343 deaths (now 19540) since 23 hours ago | 15:08 |
Brainstorm | New from CNBC Health: (news): U.S. declined to buy more Pfizer Covid vaccine doses, even after interim data, board member Gottlieb says → https://is.gd/DvWYsN | 15:09 |
Brainstorm | New from The Indian Express: World: Pfizer’s coronavirus vaccine offers strong protection after first dose → https://is.gd/ghglPi | 15:22 |
Brainstorm | New from StatNews: Pharma: STAT+: Pharmalittle: FDA staff backs Pfizer Covid-19 vaccine; Trump administration failed to lock in larger vaccine supply → https://is.gd/172WK0 | 15:35 |
Brainstorm | New from StatNews: FDA scientists endorse ‘highly effective’ Pfizer/BioNTech Covid-19 vaccine ahead of key panel: Scientists at the FDA endorsed the efficacy and safety of the Covid-19 vaccine from Pfizer and BioNTech in detailed documents, setting the stage for an emergency authorization as early as… → https://is.gd/KdiWhF | 15:48 |
Brainstorm | New from Medical Xpress: German region to close schools, some shops as virus cases soar: The eastern German state of Saxony will from Monday impose drastic measures shuttering schools, kindergartens and most shops to curb transmission, after it became the worst-hit coronavirus hotspot in the country. → https://is.gd/DX5PCF | 16:00 |
Brainstorm | New from Medical Xpress: Development of high-speed nanoPCR technology for point-of-care diagnosis of COVID-19: A nanoPCR technology was developed for the point-of-care (POC) diagnosis of coronavirus disease-19 (COVID-19). This new technology can diagnose the infection within ~20 minutes while retaining the accuracy of conventional reverse transcription [... want %more?] → https://is.gd/fl0Ufp | 16:13 |
IndoAnon | PFIZER CEO BOURLA SAYS WORKING ON A NEW FORMULATION TO AVOID HAVING TO STORE COVID-19 VACCINE AT MINUS 70 DEGREES CELSIUS, SAYS HAS CONFIDENCE IN UK REGULATOR AFTER ITS DECISION TO APPROVE VACCINE | 16:19 |
IndoAnon | BREAKING - Switzerland’s medical regulator stalls Swiss authorization of #COVID19 vaccines: "Important data on safety, efficacy, and quality are still missing." | 16:19 |
Brainstorm | New from BBC Health: Safety data on Pfizer jab released by US: American regulators are yet to approve the vaccine, despite the UK pushing ahead with mass rollout. → https://is.gd/SkcRBi | 16:26 |
Brainstorm | Updates for Sri Lanka: +798 cases (now 29378) since 23 hours ago | 16:36 |
Brainstorm | New from Medical Xpress: Saint Petersburg eyes virus lockdown amid record deaths: Russia's second city Saint Petersburg registered a record number of virus deaths on Tuesday as authorities warned of an imminent lockdown and shuttered restaurants for the New Year's holidays. → https://is.gd/FuiyVX | 16:38 |
Brainstorm | Updates for St. Martin: +84 cases (now 801) since 7 days ago — Netherlands: +6472 cases (now 571543), +51 deaths (now 9779) since 23 hours ago — St. Barthelemy: +15 cases (now 162) since 7 days ago | 16:50 |
Brainstorm | New from CNBC Health: UK begins rollout of Pfizer's coronavirus vaccine: Here's what you need to know: Ninety-year-old Margaret Keenan on Tuesday became the first person in the world to receive the Pfizer-BioNTech vaccine outside of trial conditions. → https://is.gd/OHyaEO | 16:50 |
Brainstorm | New from ClinicalTrials.gov: (news): Expanded Access Protocol on Bone Marrow Mesenchymal Stem Cell Derived Extracellular Vesicle Infusion Treatment for Patients With COVID-19 Associated ARDS → https://is.gd/rkNiYd | 17:03 |
Brainstorm | Updates for Italy: +14837 cases (now 1.8 million), +634 deaths (now 61240) since 23 hours ago | 17:08 |
DocScrutinizer05 | corona-virus-update 1:57:44 WTF?! | 17:08 |
DocScrutinizer05 | de-facto: ^^^ | 17:09 |
DocScrutinizer05 | %paper leopoldina | 17:15 |
Brainstorm | DocScrutinizer05: An error occurred while searching. | 17:15 |
DocScrutinizer05 | https://www.politico.eu/article/germany-experts-christmas-lockdown-december-coronavirus-deaths/ | 17:16 |
DocScrutinizer05 | https://www.icis.com/explore/resources/news/2020/12/08/10583911/german-science-academy-calls-for-hard-lockdown-as-coronavirus-cases-keep-surging | 17:18 |
DocScrutinizer05 | LjL: toot https://www.leopoldina.org/uploads/tx_leopublication/2020_12_08_Stellungnahme_Corona_Feiertage_final.pdf | 17:19 |
DocScrutinizer05 | root* | 17:19 |
IndoAnon | what is that | 17:32 |
Brainstorm | Updates for United Kingdom: +12281 cases (now 1.8 million), +598 deaths (now 62033) since 14 hours ago | 17:36 |
DocScrutinizer05 | this is a "the hell do a hard lockdown NOW!" call of all leading german scientists | 17:36 |
DocScrutinizer05 | [6 Dec 2020 06:49:54] * DocScrutinizer05 affords the luxury to maintain faint hope for a hard lockdown starting in a week or so | 17:45 |
LjL | DocScrutinizer05: if you think that's bad, consider that here they have compromised on tightening restrictions (but no hard lockdown, just cannot move out of your municipality, and curfew at 22:00 continues) for the days just around Christmas and New Year's, but at the same time, shops opening times will be *extended* to 21:00 and they've agreed that all schools (including the ones currently closed) will reopen after January 7 | 17:51 |
LjL | Meanwhile more and more regions are leaving the "red" and "orange" states, which also means fewer restrictions | 17:52 |
CoronaBot | 04/r/covid19: Pfizer-Biontech covid-19 vaccine (bnt162, pf-07302048) vaccines and related biological products advisory committee briefing document (80 votes) | https://www.fda.gov/media/144246/download | https://redd.it/k9498k | 17:53 |
LjL-Matrix | <IndoAnon "BREAKING - Switzerland’s medical"> Can't say I blame them... The UK is already starting rollout but... Where is the paper?! Hopefully their regulatory agency *has* the paper (hopefully!), but I don't see how that's supposed to inspire public confidence, rolling out a vaccine with the only publicly known information about it being a stinking press release | 17:58 |
LjL | okay then, i'll have to amend what i just said: a stinking press release, and a pretty detailed FDA PDF | 18:02 |
LjL | de-facto, ↑ you probably want to read that | 18:03 |
DocScrutinizer05 | LjL: I don't think that's bad, I think it's about time the ignorant suckers that govern us finally grow a brain and get a grip on what's needed | 18:03 |
IndoAnon | LjL-Matrix: It still stinks | 18:05 |
Brainstorm | New from ClinicalTrials.gov: Expanded Access to ZofinTM (OrganicellTM Flow) for Patients With COVID-19: Conditions : Covid19; Corona Virus Infection; SARS (Severe Acute Respiratory Syndrome); Acute Respiratory Distress Syndrome → https://is.gd/dhGg0I | 18:06 |
Brainstorm | New from ClinicalTrials.gov: (news): Expanded Access Protocol on Bone Marrow Mesenchymal Stem Cell Derived Extracellular Vesicle Infusion Treatment for Patients With COVID-19 Associated ARDS → https://is.gd/rkNiYd | 18:18 |
DocScrutinizer05 | LjL: I'm sure de-facto also will do a sigh of relief reading this paper (and the other news in same mindset, like Saxony doing full shutdown now, Bavaria going into much stricter lockdown tomorrow, etc) | 18:20 |
Brainstorm | Updates for Arizona, US: +12314 cases (now 378157), +23 deaths (now 6973) since a day ago | 18:22 |
Jigsy | %cases UK | 18:29 |
Brainstorm | Jigsy: In United Kingdom, there have been 1.8 million confirmed cases (2.6% of the population) and 62033 deaths (3.5% of cases) as of 55 minutes ago. 46.0 million tests were performed (3.8% positive). See https://offloop.net/covid19/?default=United%20Kingdom for time series data. | 18:29 |
Brainstorm | New from CNBC Health: Oxford-AstraZeneca vaccine is safe and effective, researchers confirm in peer-reviewed study: The coronavirus vaccine developed by British pharmaceuticals giant AstraZeneca, in collaboration with the University of Oxford, is the first to have its late-stage trial results independently reviewed and published in a medical journal. → https://is.gd/fCbW2f | 18:31 |
Brainstorm | Updates for Canada: +6845 cases (now 426298), +110 deaths (now 12823) since 22 hours ago | 18:36 |
Brainstorm | New from CNBC Health: FDA says Pfizer Covid vaccine provides some protection after first dose, meets success criteria: The FDA said data from Pfizer's coronavirus vaccine trials was "consistent" with recommendations put forth by the agency for an emergency use authorization. → https://is.gd/eVbRtY | 18:43 |
Brainstorm | New from Medical Xpress: Caregivers feeling the strain this tough holiday season: (HealthDay)—The coronavirus pandemic makes the holidays even more difficult for caregivers of loved ones with Alzheimer's disease and other types of dementia, an expert says. → https://is.gd/bXI7N6 | 18:56 |
tinwhiskers | That's good news | 18:58 |
tinwhiskers | Heh | 18:59 |
Arsanerit | except maybe when trying to buy groceries at a quiet hour | 18:59 |
tinwhiskers | Any other restrictions? | 18:59 |
Arsanerit | apart from the ones already in place? | 18:59 |
Arsanerit | not sure if full details have been announced yet | 19:00 |
tinwhiskers | Any meaningful restrictions? | 19:00 |
LjL | uhm are they going to use this weak study to push through with AstraZeneca approval even though they're still busy "re-doing" phase 3? | 19:01 |
Arsanerit | no public alcohol consumption and no alcohol sales for immediate consumption; there apply to hotspots such as where I live, on top of the restrictions already in place (max 5 people gathering, bars and restauranst closed, ban on tourists) | 19:01 |
LjL | i mean this one, i was scrolled up a bit: <Brainstorm> New from CNBC Health: Oxford-AstraZeneca vaccine is safe and effective, researchers confirm in peer-reviewed study: The coronavirus vaccine developed by British pharmaceuticals giant AstraZeneca, in collaboration with the University of Oxford, is the first to have its late-stage trial results independently reviewed and published in a medical journal. → https://is.gd/fCbW2f | 19:01 |
Arsanerit | the restrictions apply to counties with more than 200 cases per 100k inhabitants per week, ours is at 199,3 today according to one calculation but it seems we're still included | 19:02 |
tinwhiskers | Arsanerit: ok. Do you think the restrictions go far enough? | 19:03 |
tinwhiskers | LjL: well they kind of had a serendipitous success so while it's not ideal it's not terrible. | 19:05 |
Arsanerit | tinwhiskers: no | 19:06 |
LjL | tinwhiskers, the worst case of 62% (and that's not even the actual worst case since i don't know the confidence interval) is pretty bad if you ask me. yeah i know it's >50% but still | 19:06 |
Arsanerit | I think schools need to go into Wechselunterricht at the very least (alternating in-class and remote education by day such that pupils can distance) | 19:06 |
LjL | also for a change CNBC doesn't link to the actual study, pfft | 19:06 |
LjL | the study should have no new data but it may give us some of the data that the press release didn't have | 19:07 |
Arsanerit | 62% what? | 19:07 |
tinwhiskers | Effectiveness | 19:07 |
LjL | also i'm trying to figure out why the bot doesn't post from The Lancet, it *does* have it as an RSS source :( but they have a number of RSS feeds https://www.thelancet.com/content/rss and i don't know which one is the one i want to have | 19:07 |
tinwhiskers | Ah. It was posting from lancet for a while wasn't it? | 19:08 |
LjL | Arsanerit, they had two dose regimens, "half dose" and "full dose". it happened kind of by mistake. the efficacy in the "half dose" group was 90% or so, but in the "full dose" it was 62%, and in total it was around 70% | 19:08 |
LjL | there are other details such as that the "half dose" group didn't include people over 55 | 19:08 |
Brainstorm | New from BBC Health: Oxford Covid vaccine 'safe and effective' study shows: The peer-reviewed work in the Lancet medical journal confirms the vaccine is 'safe and protects'. → https://is.gd/A7F7Px | 19:09 |
LjL | tinwhiskers, it did post some things, but it was rarely on the ball with the new studies that came out | 19:09 |
tinwhiskers | Ah | 19:09 |
tinwhiskers | Yeah, there's certainly good reason to be sceptical | 19:09 |
LjL | tinwhiskers, actually no, i take it back, it never posted from the lancet ;( | 19:11 |
tinwhiskers | Oh | 19:11 |
LjL | but i had https://www.thelancet.com/rssfeed/lancet_current.xml | 19:12 |
LjL | that's probably the articles from the print edition | 19:12 |
LjL | i should probably have the "online first" feed | 19:12 |
LjL | tinwhiskers, also you know what, i'm inept, when i grep my logs i can't actually find all the "New from" Brainstorm posts because it uses italic and the IRC codes for that end up in the logs and i'm not sure how to make grep ignore them, and also it shows *some* entries and not others so that's extra confusing | 19:15 |
LjL | i am tempted to just yank it and use another off-the-shelf bot for the RSS feeds, my module is... bad | 19:16 |
LjL | i don't think it's salvageable | 19:16 |
Arsanerit | LjL: ok | 19:19 |
DocScrutinizer05 | Arsanerit: seems Saxony goes full shutdown. There's a lot in the pipeline for this week I guess | 19:29 |
DocScrutinizer05 | Arsanerit: Bavaria already does more strict lockdown starting tomorrow | 19:29 |
LjL | oh nice, BBC was nice enough to actually link to the study | 19:32 |
Arsanerit | full is relative | 19:32 |
Arsanerit | bbl | 19:32 |
LjL | In participants who received two standard doses, vaccine efficacy was 62·1% (95% CI 41·0–75·7; 27 [0·6%] of 4440 in the ChAdOx1 nCoV-19 group vs 71 [1·6%] of 4455 in the control group) and in participants who received a low dose followed by a standard dose, efficacy was 90·0% (67·4–97·0; three [0·2%] of 1367 vs 30 [2·2%] of 1374; pinteraction=0·010). Overall vaccine efficacy across both groups was 7 | 19:33 |
LjL | 0·4% (95·8% CI 54·8–80·6; 30 [0·5%] of 5807 vs 101 [1·7%] of 5829). | 19:33 |
LjL | it's baaaaaarely above 50% overall at the lower end of the confidence interval | 19:33 |
LjL | tinwhiskers, DocScrutinizer05, de-facto ↑ (figures from AstraZeneca's new study) | 19:33 |
LjL | the confidence intervals are honestly worse than i feared | 19:34 |
Brainstorm | New from Medical Xpress: J&J readies 500 mn vaccine doses for poor countries: US pharmaceutical giant Johnson & Johnson said Tuesday it plans to provide 500 million doses of its vaccine for poor countries once results of clinical trials are announced by the end of January. → https://is.gd/jR7u7Y | 19:40 |
LjL | this is my opinion, but longer: https://np.reddit.com/r/COVID19/comments/k971ti/safety_and_efficacy_of_the_chadox1_ncov19_vaccine/gf2w5cq/ | 19:46 |
tinwhiskers | LjL: yipes | 19:48 |
LjL | tinwhiskers, what i'm really concerned about is... what would this one study be for exactly, if not for the purpose of nudging regulatory authorities to give approval despite the pending additional trial? | 19:48 |
LjL | i mean, i suspect they didn't publish this just to appease *our* want for knowledge of the CIs | 19:49 |
DocScrutinizer05 | LjL: well, 50% would be pretty poor efficiency but still no argument to NOT use the vaccine, right? | 19:49 |
tinwhiskers | Yes, it seems entirely unsatisfactory to get approval | 19:50 |
LjL | considering the adenovirus vector, DocScrutinizer05, i'd say it's a good argument NOT to use the vaccine | 19:50 |
LjL | make a better vaccine on that adenovirus vector | 19:50 |
LjL | don't "waste" it on this thing that's possibly worse than a flu vaccine | 19:50 |
tinwhiskers | People thinking they have been vaccinated but in fact have a vaccine that doesn't work is worse than not having the vaccine. | 19:50 |
LjL | the fact that they put 50% as a minimum bar for approval doesn't mean we HAVE to use a very poor vaccine when there are much better ones | 19:51 |
DocScrutinizer05 | ooh, that's indeed a valid point | 19:51 |
LjL | yes, what tinwhiskers says too | 19:51 |
LjL | right now, if i were offered this vaccine, i would decline | 19:51 |
DocScrutinizer05 | I hope for the mRNA vaccine | 19:52 |
tinwhiskers | Yes, wasting the one-shot potential of the adenovirus on an ineffective vaccine would be a bad choice. | 19:52 |
Brainstorm | New from Medical Xpress: COVID-19: Persistent symptoms in one third of cases: Since its appearance in early 2020, COVID-19 has been unpredictable for both physicians and affected individuals given the variety and duration of its symptoms. Notably, it appears to have the potential to cause an unusually long-lasting illness, and the term "long COVID" [... want %more?] → https://is.gd/qHiKVa | 19:53 |
de-facto | LjL, any new data on their study? | 19:57 |
de-facto | btw what does their efficiency tell? protection from severe progression or protection from early replication (hence sterilizing immunity) | 19:59 |
de-facto | i guess the former since the later would be headlines all over the media | 19:59 |
DocScrutinizer05 | help m e out, which vaccine they start shooting in GB now? | 19:59 |
de-facto | Pfizer/BioNTech from Mainz | 20:00 |
DocScrutinizer05 | aah so the mRNA | 20:00 |
de-facto | yup | 20:00 |
DocScrutinizer05 | don't know if anybody already plans to use the supposedly flawed AZ vaccine | 20:01 |
tinwhiskers | Not only is it awesome to see an mRNA vaccine actually in use, it's great to have the UK as our guinea pigs :-/ | 20:01 |
de-facto | Why dont vaccine manufacturers include screening for asymptomatic infections in their phase III studies to determine the degree of sterilizing immunity (preventing transmission hence the ONE relevant parameter for the pandemic)? | 20:01 |
DocScrutinizer05 | hehehehe indeed | 20:01 |
DocScrutinizer05 | de-facto: lack of test capacity, both in lab and in personal to pester a 40k guinea pigs twice a week | 20:02 |
tinwhiskers | de-facto: yes, a clearly neglected aspect. I suspect it comes down to speed because those tests are still on their way. | 20:03 |
de-facto | they could do that 1) by regular nasal swab tests doing a RT-PCR every few days for all their participants 2) they could test for N-protein antibodies with an ELISA test since those would not be generated by vaccines that only target the S-protein, hence presence of N-protein antibodies in the blood serum would indicate that there was some virus replication with the wild type going in in the participants cells | 20:03 |
tinwhiskers | I personally don't see why that would slow it down, but if it was about money surely they would have done that in the first trial. | 20:03 |
DocScrutinizer05 | de-facto: ( 2) ) nice catch. Indeed possible approach | 20:04 |
tinwhiskers | Maybe, if they knew that would be doing a second trial anyway it may have been about money. | 20:04 |
tinwhiskers | Do the minimum to get regulatory approval first. | 20:05 |
de-facto | the N-protein antibody test they could even do after the study finished its a one time test, so really not that challenging to do for 30k participants | 20:05 |
DocScrutinizer05 | however, "some replication" still doesn't exactly translate to asymptomatic fully contagious infection | 20:05 |
tinwhiskers | Perhaps that's what they'll do | 20:06 |
Brainstorm | New from Medical Xpress: 'Route out' of pandemic: UK gives 1st COVID-19 vaccine doses: A retired British shop clerk received the first shot in the country's COVID-19 vaccination program Tuesday, the start of an unprecedented global immunization effort intended to offer a route out of a pandemic that has killed 1.5 million. → https://is.gd/cf150q | 20:06 |
de-facto | i think they are afraid that bad numbers might give their opponent an advantage on the market | 20:06 |
tinwhiskers | Yeah, maybe | 20:06 |
tinwhiskers | If we could get the vaccine out to everyone quickly it wouldn't really matter if asymptomatic infections still occurred, but we can't. | 20:07 |
LjL | seems like some people in r/covid19 take the "only medical sources" thing as a way to avoid thinking with their own head: https://np.reddit.com/r/COVID19/comments/k971ti/safety_and_efficacy_of_the_chadox1_ncov19_vaccine/gf2xiys/ what the hell does it mean it's "comfortably over" their requirements? it sucks, look at the data, it sucks | 20:08 |
de-facto | DocScrutinizer05, yeah but probably the degree to N-protein antibodies would be somewhat proportional to the amount of wild type viral replication, if it only happened very few times probably there would not be many antibodies against that then, but if it really replicated for a short time to an infectious amount the immune system probably would get alarmed and build antibodies against that presence of big amounts of alien N-protein | 20:08 |
DocScrutinizer05 | it's unlikely we get sufficient number of vaccinations done next 11 months, and then we will encounter a really challenging situation which nobody willing to comply with ANY NPI anymore but still a 50% or more fully susceptible to covid | 20:09 |
DocScrutinizer05 | dang, 9 minutes beyond "daily WTF" aka ARD news | 20:09 |
de-facto | try tagesschau.de | 20:10 |
de-facto | it can delay back on live stream with arrow left | 20:10 |
genera | lol | 20:10 |
DocScrutinizer05 | BBL | 20:10 |
DocScrutinizer05 | got a VDR so I got "my own back arrow key" ;-D | 20:11 |
de-facto | hehe nice | 20:11 |
DocScrutinizer05 | in 4 minutes another "Brennbunkt" special regarding covid | 20:11 |
DocScrutinizer05 | brennpunkt even | 20:12 |
CoronaBot | 04/r/covid19: Safety and efficacy of the ChAdOx1 nCoV-19 vaccine (AZD1222) against SARS-CoV-2: an interim analysis of four randomised controlled trials in Brazil, South Africa, and the UK (82 votes) | https://marlin-prod.literatumonline.com/pb-assets/Lancet/pdfs/S0140673620326611.pdf | https://redd.it/k971ti | 20:12 |
de-facto | yeah hopefully they will criticize the government and push for a lockdown in Germany | 20:12 |
de-facto | we really need that | 20:12 |
tinwhiskers | Yeah | 20:12 |
tinwhiskers | A lot of countries need to bite the bullet on that and stop pussyfooting around | 20:13 |
de-facto | nice there is the paper ^^ CoronaBot | 20:15 |
DocScrutinizer05 | particularly they need to understand it need an "integral regulation" approach, so far all they do is "proportional" which guarantees incidences staying at same high level, not going down | 20:15 |
de-facto | i think last week we broke all time records with both daily new infections and daily fatalities | 20:16 |
de-facto | that really cant be called "lockdown" | 20:16 |
de-facto | that looks like a really good paper at first sight | 20:17 |
de-facto | "Safety and efficacy of the ChAdOx1 nCoV-19 vaccine (AZD1222) against SARS-CoV-2: an interim analysis of four randomised controlled trials in Brazil, South Africa, and the UK " https://marlin-prod.literatumonline.com/pb-assets/Lancet/pdfs/S0140673620326611.pdf | 20:18 |
Brainstorm | New from https://covid19.specops.network : ljl-covid: Add FDA Prizer-BioNTech release with preliminary approval of this vac… → https://is.gd/D3Y2Fr | 20:18 |
LjL | de-facto, what makes you say that? the confidence interval numbers look rather appalling to me... | 20:19 |
LjL | (despite being barely over 50% so yes, it can probably be approved, although they had to squeeze out a new statistical analysis to make sure of that, and there are lies, damn lies, and statistics) | 20:19 |
de-facto | the 90% half-dose/full-dose numbers are there: 3/1367 (0·2%) in the vaccinated group and 30/1374 (2·2%) | 20:20 |
Brainstorm | Updates for Mauritania: +197 cases (now 9876), +3 deaths (now 197) since a day ago | 20:22 |
LjL | de-facto, that makes for a lower end of the confidence interval at 67.4%, and that's when looking at that subgroup but we still don't really know what makes that subgroup so different from the full-dose group | 20:22 |
de-facto | and even Asymptomatic or symptoms unknown (COV002) LD/SD recipients 7/1120 (0·6%) vaccinated vs 17/1127 (1·5%) in control | 20:22 |
LjL | that looks barely significant to me | 20:23 |
de-facto | so that could mean 58·9% protection from asymptomatic disease hence also transmission | 20:23 |
de-facto | right? | 20:23 |
LjL | "could" yeah, but what confidence interval would come out of those very small numbers? | 20:24 |
de-facto | (i havent read any test yet only looked at that table 2) | 20:24 |
LjL | de-facto, the lower end of the confidence interval for people who took two full doses is below 50% (45%ish). that's the number that worries me, unless and until we figure out what makes the half-dose+full-dose group better, for which they *admitted* they need another trial | 20:25 |
de-facto | i dont care for the two full dose numbers at all | 20:26 |
de-facto | obviously its not going to be used like that | 20:26 |
LjL | yeah okay let's forget the half-dose regimen exists by mistake in the first place | 20:27 |
LjL | let's forget there are no people over 55 in that group | 20:27 |
LjL | let's say the full dose numbers are completely unimportant | 20:27 |
LjL | let's... not | 20:27 |
DocScrutinizer05 | LjL: you sound a little bit upset and biased | 20:28 |
de-facto | that point with no people over 55 in the half dose/full dose branch is very important | 20:28 |
tinwhiskers | Getting favorable results from something you didn't intend to do is very suspicious to use for approval. | 20:28 |
Generated by irclog2html.py 2.17.0 by Marius Gedminas - find it at https://mg.pov.lt/irclog2html/!