freenode/#devuan/ Tuesday, 2019-02-12

specinggnarface: Actually, my problem with that is that I'd like to make a proxy on an existing Gentoo proxy server (which does not have apt-*)00:00
specingFedora has a document https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Infrastructure/Mirroring/ProxyMirror00:00
specingIs there something similar for Devuan?00:01
KatolaZspecing: why do you need apt on the proxy at all?00:01
gnarfaceoh, i don't know, but there is probably one for debian, which should work00:01
KatolaZapt works via http00:01
specingwell, it basically just amounts to picking a mirror and getting the directory paths right00:01
specingKatolaZ: I'm data limited00:01
KatolaZso...00:01
gnarfacespecing: (installing devuan in a chroot on the gentoo server is always an option)00:01
KatolaZhow is this related to having or not having apt on the proxy?00:01
specingKatolaZ: not having apt-cacher-ng means that there is no shortcut to setting up the mirror00:03
KatolaZspecing: if you have a proxy server already configured, you can just use it00:04
KatolaZthis is what I meant00:04
specingOkay, direct question: if I have a beowulf amd64 Devuan, what path on the mirrors does apt download packages from?00:05
KatolaZspecing: it depends00:05
KatolaZbecause you have both packages and metadata00:05
specingKatolaZ: it is not that simple, there are always things you want to cache long-term (packages), things you want to cache short term(metadata) and things you do not want to cache at all00:05
KatolaZspecing: on a testing release like Beowulf, you don't want to cache anything, until it's frozen00:07
KatolaZthe Debian upstream will enter freeze in a few weeks00:07
KatolaZthen Beowulf will need some work, so you will have packages updated00:08
KatolaZalso, caching does not work very well for metadata, since the repository files are timestamped, and get re-signed periodically00:08
KatolaZbbl00:10
KatolaZo/00:10
specingfreeze in a few weeks? This means devuan beowulf will also be frozen at that time?00:10
fsmithredspecing, the packages that are unchanged from debian will be frozen, and the packages that we change will be changed as we change them.00:21
fsmithredand any maintainers who are modifying debian packages will know that they won't get hit with a new version after they start working on it.00:21
fsmithredI did an upgrade of ascii to beowulf last week, and xfce seems to be working well. I've noticed a couple of minor glitches only.00:23
specingCan I manually specify the mirror URL in the installer?01:03
specingoh, asked too soon01:03
gnarfacei'm sure that if you're in expert mode you can populate the apt proxy field, too01:05
specinggnarface: there was an "enter manually" entry in the mirror list01:06
specingexcellent, proxy is working01:07
specingI'm not sure why distros are not describing this setup with nginx, it is so ridiculously easy to do01:07
specingno squid or apache beheamoths required01:08
gnarfaceit's just an economics issue.  nginx is the new one, and people tend to get around to writing such howto documentation last01:08
specingI just hope 1 GB of btrfs / with compression will be enough to hold a basic devuan install01:08
gnarfaceprobably, if you're not too ambitious.  2GB would be better.01:09
gnarfaceavoid desktop environments with huge dependency chains like kde/gnome01:10
specinggnarface: it did not ask me to install any desktop environments at this stage01:10
specingFedora installer however... it runs very laggy with less than 3 GB *RAM*01:10
gnarfaceif you don't pick anything at tasksel, the minimal install is about 400-500MB last i checked01:11
MinceRwell, it's "modern"01:11
gnarface(a little less for i386, a little more for amd64)01:11
specingI guess the tasksel step is yet to come01:11
gnarfacei usually only select "standard system utilities" because it only adds a few extra MB or so and most that stuff is stuff i add right away anyway.01:13
gnarface(then i usually install some WM not in the tasksel list)01:13
specinggnarface: I can document the nginx proxy setup if you give me a place to do so01:14
specingand by documenting I mean pasting the config, ha ha01:14
gnarfacespecing: i don't think there's a devuan wiki yet.  i think such things are directed to the forum for now.01:14
gnarface(https://dev1galaxy.org/)01:15
gnarfaceas long as it's up there, someone could pull it into a wiki page at some future date01:16
specingthe installer is just as slow as I remember it from debian days01:47
specingused to run both that and apt in eatmydata environment01:48
gnarfacespecing: slow as in download speeds?  because that is a bandwidth thing.  or slow as in formatting time?  because that's an ext3/4 thing.01:52
gnarfacei understand that bandwidth might not be fixable without changing buildings, but you can fix the formatting speed by just picking a different filesystem01:53
gnarfaceunless you're talking about exhaustive badblocks checking during formatting - nothing will make that fast.  nothing.01:54
specinggnarface: neither, it is just slow01:56
specingI'm installing to tmpfs and my pipe is 2.5MB/s01:57
gnarfaceheh01:57
gnarfacei'm not sure that's the installer's fault01:57
gnarfaceand that's 25% faster than my max throughput here01:58
gnarfaceso you do not have my sympathy01:58
gnarfacebut if you know you have more bandwidth than that, try a different mirror01:58
specingnah, dstat is showing solid 2.5MB/s when downloadind01:59
gnarfacefrom where i am, pkgmaster drags really slow (way slower than that) but most the mirrors in the round-robin get me 1-2MB/s reliably01:59
gnarfacebut like i said, my max is only 2MB to begin with01:59
gnarfacepkgmaster gives me about 11kb/s02:00
gnarfacei think someone upstream of me is throttling it artificially though02:01
fsmithredlot of the installer time is unpacking and configuring packages02:08
specing414 MB says btrfs before tasksel02:11
specingyou think xfce will fit in 600MB?02:11
specingor should I stick to console? :)02:11
fsmithredtry icewm02:12
specingfsmithred: I use AwesomeWM in Gentoo, but there is no option for it02:12
specingand neither is there option for icewm02:12
fsmithredoh, add whatever wm you want later, after you reboot into the new system02:13
fsmithredthen you can see how much space it will take before you install it02:13
fsmithredand you can be much more selective02:13
golinux<gnarface> specing: i don't think there's a devuan wiki yet.02:14
gnarfacespecing: stick to console until after the install is completed02:14
fsmithredif you choose xfce from tasksel (in the installer) you'll need around 4G02:14
golinuxof course there is02:14
gnarfacegolinux: oh, i'm sorry02:14
golinuxhttps://friendsofdevuan.org/doku.php02:14
gnarfaceah ha!02:15
golinuxNot much  happens there though02:15
gnarfacespecing: did you see this?  ^ wiki link, if you prefer to post the config there instead02:15
fsmithredawesome is in the repo02:16
golinuxYou will need to contact an admin to get permissions02:16
fsmithredjust leave standard system utilities checked as gnarface suggested. un-check everything else02:17
specinggnarface: I saw it, but I already posted to forum :D02:19
* golinux goes to check it out02:19
specinghmm, secure connection failed to forums?02:21
golinuxWe have a lot of spam filters in place.  You have registered02:22
golinuxIf the exit node it tainted you will get slapped during registration02:23
golinuxBut you are already in, it seems.02:24
specingI was told no-gui will be only 400-500MB02:26
specingit is 800MB right now02:26
specingrip02:26
specingseems to be installing some gui after all02:26
specingI don't recall selecting any02:26
specingand it is at 45%. This won't work out02:27
fsmithredspecing, maybe you should just do a debootstrap install02:36
golinuxYou have to do an expert install to avoid bloat02:36
specingnooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo02:37
specingwell, yeah >_>02:37
gnarfacespecing: you do know you can just uninstall anything you installed accidentally, right?02:42
va7lnxgnarface: thank God for "apt-get --purge"06:15
golinuxLOL!06:22
furrywolfnow I want a "Who would Jesus apt-get --purge?" bumper sticker.06:23
se7enThere are better bumperstickers06:28
se7enLike "Carbomb"06:28
se7en(If you don't get it, it's a bumpersticker made by Negativland for their song of the same name: https://invidio.us/watch?v=mX9cvvezZhY )06:33
furrywolfI had one that said "A girl's place is on top" with a picture of a strapon harness next to it...  mostly as a joke to annoy someone.  only had it on for a couple days.06:35
furrywolfhttps://www.picclickimg.com/d/l400/pict/302588524965_/Strap-On-Funny-Car-Sticker-Decal-Tool-Box.jpg  I also have one of those in bumper-sticker form, but have never stuck it to anything.  :)06:37
se7en"My Child is an Honor's Student at Lakhurst Elementry"06:37
furrywolfI don't need to announce to the world that I'm a snob.06:38
se7en"I left my other bumpersticker at home"06:38
se7en"Think women can't drive? Well, you're behind one" on a crashed car06:38
va7lnx"I won't lower my standards, so up yours!"06:52
va7lnxwell, I'm going to get ready for bed and do my physics pre-reading for class tomorrow.... and probably fall asleep in the recliner while doing it.06:54
ejrwhy does lsb_release -a still say that I am running devuan jessie even though I am running ceres?08:07
BeerbelottHello09:53
BeerbelottWhy is the snapd package banned from Debian upstream?09:53
KatolaZBeerbelott: https://packages.debian.org/unstable/snapd09:54
KatolaZlook among "Depends"09:54
KatolaZand answer yourself :)09:54
Beerbelotta build w/o this dependency is absolutely out of the question?09:55
KatolaZBeerbelott: are you volunteering?09:56
BeerbelottSimply wondering, I have no experience w/ packaging09:56
BeerbelottIs it a lack of resource of technically impossible09:56
KatolaZI guess lack of interested people who are also interested in doing the work?09:57
Beerbelottresource then09:57
BeerbelottThx09:57
KatolaZnp09:58
cosurgiKatolaZ: what are udeb files?12:28
cosurgihttps://wiki.debian.org/udeb12:29
cosurgiok, thanks :)12:29
roo^yI'm on my first full install of refacta/devuan :) ..on my 1st 64bit PC :P adding a efi boot partition helped13:06
roo^yiwlwifi firmware deb package got me connected to my phone's hotspot13:08
va7lnxroo^y: nice13:22
va7lnxwell, I guess I should go back to bed.13:24
roo^yhexchat doesn't point to here. sends to debian on OFTC (which is ok, hexchat is a bit simple. i'll mainly stick to my client with more features)13:25
specinggnarface: yes, but the machine is toast and I'm just going to re-do the install. This time probably ascii13:26
fsmithredroo^y, glad to hear you got it going13:27
roo^yi couldn't take a hint with gparted's slider, when choosing partitions sizes a day ago, but eventually i clued on the 2nd time around (not that i haven't used it on & off for years)13:30
fsmithredspecing, get a refracta iso, boot into live system, do debootstrap install. Simple instructions are in the user's home.13:35
fsmithred(you'd be installing devuan, not refracta)13:36
specingfsmithred: I don't need live systems, I do my installs through VMs13:36
specingand if I use debootstrap I can do that just fine from Gentoo host13:36
fsmithredgentoo has debootstrap?13:37
specingyes13:37
specingthese currently debootstrap-1.0.111.ebuild  debootstrap-1.0.114.ebuild  debootstrap-1.0.89.ebuild13:37
fsmithredguess I shouldn't be surprised. They have everything else.13:38
fsmithredand it works ok with devuan?13:38
specinggentoo doesen't have an Ada toolchain13:38
fsmithredanyway, I think that's the only way you'll get the install as small as you want it13:38
specingand now that grsec is closed, no security policy to speak of13:38
* roo^y welcomes abuse for your amusement, as he made a 1GB FAT32 Boot partition on his 480GB SSD (then a unallocated 32MB gap before the main ext4 partition, for no particular reason)13:42
specingroo^y: partitions are passe13:45
specingmy bios can read LVM, so ... :)13:46
va7lnxspecing: oh?13:49
va7lnxthat's interesting.13:49
roo^y"A Beginner's Guide To LVM" sums up that i haven't kept up with modern computing13:49
specingva7lnx: GRUB2 in bios13:50
specingva7lnx: it does LUKS and btrfs as well (and ZFS, iirc)13:50
va7lnxnice13:51
fsmithredit's annoyingly slow about asking for the password13:51
fsmithredbut that's about the only bad thing I can say about full-disk encryption13:51
roo^y..the grass is always greener on the other side of the fence13:51
fsmithrednot about asking - it's after you tell it the password that it's slow13:52
heavenspecing: do you write-protect the flash area?13:56
heavenassuming its coreboot13:56
heaventhough you could use grub on an usb pl13:56
va7lnxbut really, how often do you boot?13:56
heavenus a regular bios instead13:56
va7lnxugh. 5am. I really need to get to bed for a couple of hours.13:57
roo^ygo for a 8hr nap13:58
specingva7lnx: these days daily as xorg is broken13:59
specingcan't make the screen wake up13:59
specingheaven: it is Libreboot and no, no yet13:59
nemoroo^y: could be useful for a shared space for windows and OSX I guess, if you have to remove the drive14:51
nemoroo^y: there's these nice little usb3/sata adapters that can make it handy to turn something like that into a portable boot14:51
nemobut. hm. boot partition?14:52
* nemo shrugs14:52
roo^yi almost ordered a smaller ssd as well, & a enclosure, which i'm pretty sure i could install a distro to, to use it like a USB flash drive. from the USB3 port14:52
roo^yi am getting a hint that i may not need a separate boot partition, but mixed msgs. my mele pcg35 opo is UEFI. it boots, which is all that really matters14:55
nemoroo^y: oh you mean EFI boot partition14:57
nemoroo^y: not /boot ☺14:57
nemothen the FAT32 makes sense I guess14:57
nemoI do try to avoid EFI when I can, personally.14:57
roo^ythe mutible boot terms gets a tad confusing. i noticed rEFInd put FAT12 when it installed itself on a flash drive14:59
james1138_Question. I see that "cgproxy" is configured to startup at each system boot. Is cgproxy needed?18:32
sxpertgood evening21:00
sxpertanyone knows about uwsgi ?21:00
sxpertI have 2 questions21:00
sxpert1) why does it work when I lauch it manually from the command line with a particular config file, and starting it as a daemon fails miserably21:01
sxpert2) how do you get it to explain why the daemon fails to start (couln't find logs anywhere)21:01
djphsxpert: calling the same config with the daemon?21:08
sxpertyeah21:08
ezcapehi. is it as easy to install 4.20 in Devuan as with Gentoo?21:09
ezcapeand compile it21:09
ezcapebrb21:10
sxpertdjph: I couln't find how to get uwsgi to log stuff, or where to look for21:10
sxpertdjph: also, is there a way to get it to be verbose about what it's doing ?21:12
djph-v?21:13
djphnever used usgwi :/21:13
sixwheeledbeastseems to be well documented https://uwsgi-docs.readthedocs.io/en/latest/21:18
sxpertdjph: ok, got it to work thanks to the fine people on #uwsgi ;-)21:35
sxpertback to playing on my fpga now ;)21:36
sxpert(stuff for work is advanced enough)21:36
djphyay21:37
specingDid someone delete my forum post?23:58
gnarfacewas this it? https://dev1galaxy.org/viewtopic.php?id=260523:59

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