freenode/#devuan/ Friday, 2019-03-29

Bjornnis there a particular DE that Ascii works best with?00:07
golinuxBjornn: The default is Xfce00:12
golinuxBut there are other choices00:12
plasma41Impressive. Gentoo now has GNOME 3.30 working with OpenRC init by means of elogind. https://blogs.gentoo.org/leio/2019/03/26/gnome-3-30/00:17
XenguyBjornn: I like MATE, which is like Gnome200:17
plasma41Not that I plan to switch from Xfce, but could this allow Devuan to start supporting GNOME 3?00:19
watchcatseems like more trouble than it's worth.00:22
djphi think gnome would need to be compile-able systemd-free00:22
golinuxgnome is more trouble than it's worth and a dead end of complexity00:40
XenguyI recall having a brief look at GNOME3, and thinking it was just awful00:45
jonadabGnome has been getting worse with each new version since 1.000:49
jonadabAt this point, it's not worth messing with at all.00:49
jonadabI think a lot of young people today would be astonished if they got a look at how flexible Gnome 0.x was, though.  It could do stuff that most desktop environments today cannot.00:51
jonadabJust for example, I used to have a small clock applet on a floating, always-on-top panel positioned so that it would be to the left of the minimize button on a maximized window, covering up an otherwise completely unused portion of the titlebar.00:51
MinceRindeed00:52
MinceRgnome used to be nice, then it jumped the shark and became absolute trash00:52
jonadabThey got somebody in their leadership who bought into the "options confuse users so don't give them any options" nonsense.00:53
MinceRindeed00:53
XenguyYeah, exactly.  We know better than the users, etc.00:53
MinceRand also into the rest of the apple ideas about UI00:53
MinceRthey even adopted the apple HIG00:53
jonadabMy own view is that the *defaults* should be designed for the sorts of users who are confused by options.00:54
jonadabSo they don't have to look at them.00:54
XenguyYep, sane defaults, and then options behind the scenes, for the tinkers01:39
tuxd3vHello all11:18
tuxd3vGood Morning11:18
tuxd3vFreedom Lovers11:18
KatolaZhi tuxd3v11:19
tuxd3vhi KatolaZ11:36
jordilahi #devuan ers , i've just installed pandoc package on my Ascii ... then, run ' $ pandoc ', the cursor stays blinking, and nothing happens. Uh... what could i be missing ?12:17
KatolaZjordila: have you used pandoc before?12:32
KatolaZit's a CLI filter12:32
KatolaZjordila: man pandoc12:32
ejrhi. i am running devuan ceres. when I try to upgrade the system I get an unmet dependency error for libxtst6. however i do not want to remove that package as that would also uninstall many base packages such as X12:40
ejris there anything i can do?12:40
KatolaZdo not upgrade?12:41
KatolaZejr: which is the unmet dep?12:41
ejrx11-common12:42
ejrKatolaZ: i could not upgrade ofc, but won't the problem persist forever then?12:42
xinomilorunning ceres prefer safe-upgrade or apt upgrade. dependency might take days to fix, don't rush it.12:43
ejrsafe-upgrade?12:43
xinomilodon't dist-upgrade12:43
ejrthen it says that dpkg has been kept back (if i run apt-get upgrade)12:44
xinomilonice, keep it that way12:46
xinomilohmm, don't know way. i run apt upgrade usually and dpkg is in the latest version12:47
xinomilo*why12:47
KatolaZejr: which is the broken dependency?12:47
ejrok, i will just wait a few weeks :)12:48
ejrKatolaZ: libxtst6 : Depends: x11-common but it is not going to be installed12:48
KatolaZx11-common?12:48
KatolaZcan you please post the full error message somewhere?12:48
KatolaZ(not directly here, pls)12:48
ejrhttps://pastebin.com/tDCBdQ7C12:48
ejrbrb12:49
KatolaZejr: it must be some package which is transitioning to unstable12:49
xinomilogot all these installed at latest versions.12:50
KatolaZwhat is the missing dep on x11-common?12:50
xinomilolibxtst6:12:50
xinomilo  Installed: 2:1.2.3-112:50
xinomilox11-common:12:50
xinomilo  Installed: 1:7.7+1912:50
xinomilodpkg:12:50
xinomilo  Installed: 1.19.612:50
ejrok, well, i will wait :)13:07
icariousSo there is no way to convince Debian to at least make the system friendly towards alternate inits like Gentoo, ridding the Devuan team off this task?23:17
golinuxicarious: This conversation is probably better on #debianfork23:19
MinceRi'm sure there's a way, but it probably involves fighting IBM people and their thralls23:19
* icarious takes it there23:19
icariousMinceR: IBM? Cause of Redhat purchase?23:20
icariousOk i am in that channel. Taking it there henceforth23:20

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