freenode/#devuan/ Wednesday, 2019-09-25

BeerbelottHello, are there time requirements for mirrors to be up-to-date?08:26
BeerbelottI see security/main packages list has been updated at "2019-09-25 05:19" on some mirrors but I get some 404 on another08:28
Beerbelott  404  Not Found [IP: 2001:878:346::116 80]08:28
BeerbelottThat is, there is at least 3h time delta between some mirrors08:29
BeerbelottThat kind of defeats the purpose of a DNS pool08:29 is supposed too update every 30 minutes according to the mirror list.  Most of the mirrors list 30 minute updates.  Only a few list 3 hour updates.08:36
onefangHmm, the mirror walkthrough says "no more than once per hour", but we did change to 30 minutes some time ago.08:38
felhasznalohi guys08:43
felhasznalois there a binary non-systemd distro that isn't slackware or devuan?08:43
omnionot all are binary though08:48
felhasznaloseems like devuan is still the only real choice08:53
Beerbelottonefang: Well. There might have bee na hiccup then :)09:25
onefangIt's always possible.09:25
onefangThere's a new kernel out today, I'll have to reboot my mirror later today, if the timing is wrong, might be an hour between mirror updates for me.09:26
Beerbelottall in all, the problem is stil lthere for that mirror09:26
Beerbelott1h later09:27
BeerbelottIf you note, the URL I provided is for that precise kernel update package :p09:27
onefangI just updated by desktop to that kernel, using my own mirror.  Still got some things to do before I can reboot it.09:29
BeerbelottI would like to avoid resorting to manually forcing of a specific repo, but so far the mirror chosen from the consistently sends me over to mirrors.dotsrc.org09:30
Beerbelottfrom the DNS pool*09:30
onefangFrom my desktop I use my own mirror, in an "eating my own dogfood" way.09:31
onefangTime to reboot my desktop into that new kernel.  BRB09:34
onefangIt worked.  B-)09:42
BeerbelottI don't understand what "eating you own dogfood" has anything to do with the DNS pool not being consistent, at least because of
BeerbelottAlright, I switched back to pkgmaster.09:47
onefangI'm eating MY own dog food, using my own mirror.09:51
DRWhiteHowdy folks11:50
chomwittisnt package 'less' in devuan ascii ?13:18
Hurgotronhere it is.13:19
chomwittso maybe i have an issue with my sources.list13:23
chomwitti dont know what to put in my sources.list13:24
chomwittwhat is with the 'merged' word13:24
Hurgotronmine, for example:13:25
Hurgotrondeb ascii main contrib13:25
Hurgotrondeb ascii-security main contrib13:25
Hurgotrondeb ascii-updates main contrib13:25
fsmithreddon't bother with the country codes. They don't do anything now.13:26
onefang"merged" is the merged Devuan and Debian packages.13:28
chomwitti see.13:28
chomwittanyway i've set up a minimal virtual server with an ascii image of theirs and try with : deb ascii  main13:29
fsmithredthat should work13:30
fsmithredyou might not have gotten less in the install, but it should be in the repo13:30
chomwittbut as soon as i give : apt-get update my systems get stack in O% processing for minutes13:30
fsmithredhow did you do the install?13:31
chomwitti used a netint image that i mounted to my vps and then reboot, but i had to edit by self /etc/interfaces13:35
chomwittanyway my vps has internet, dns works ok13:35
chomwittbut my devuan installation since network wasnt congigured was i guess minimal13:36
fsmithredyeah, no connection would cause that problem.13:36
fsmithredI don't know what else would.13:36
chomwittnow apt-get gives  the method driver /usr/lib/apt/methods/https could not be found is package apt-transport-https installed ?13:37
fsmithredand you don't have https in sources.list? Anything in sources.list.d/  ?13:38
chomwittfsmithred: strangely the issue was with the gateway ip in the installation setup. it woudnt be accepted , by the same ip worked ok after i add it to /etc/interfaces13:39
fsmithredah, ok13:39
chomwittno https13:40
fsmithredbut it's working now?13:40
chomwittthe internet yes13:41
chomwittin my virtual server13:41
chomwittin the network config phase of the instalation , after giving the gateway ip i was getting an error about default route not configured13:43
chomwittso i bypassed that and after the minimum install i edit /etc/interfaces13:43
onefangDo you have anything in /etc/apt/sources.list.d?13:46
fsmithredand check /etc/resolv.conf13:48
chomwitta devuan,list with commented entris13:48
chomwittnameservers look ok13:49
onefangYour sources.lst has http, but apt is trying to use https, which says apt-transport-https installed, but is missing bits.  Seems that system is a bit confused.13:49
fsmithredthat's a service, isn't it?13:50
fsmithredI thnk you can turn it off13:50
onefangIt's a transport for apt, not installed by default, usually.13:50
fsmithredlook for /etc/init.d/https or something like that13:50
onefangNot a service.13:51
fsmithrednope. Maybe I'm thinking of tor13:52
fsmithredand having apt-transport-https installed doesn't cause a problem. I just tried it.13:53
onefangApt has a tor transport as well.  Devuan has a tor package mirror.  Apt transports are not services.13:53
chomwittmaybe clear the aptget cache, cause some hours ago i made a mispelling https but i corrected13:53
onefangYes, I have it installed to.  But it shouldn't be causing trouble at all if there's no https sources.13:53
fsmithredyeah, update the cache again13:54
fsmithredapt update13:54
fsmithredsorry, I'm not awake13:56
onefangFire alarm in the next room just went off.  I'M AWAKE!13:57
onefangNeighbour was burning her chops.  No panic.13:57
Hurgotronbetter than coffee13:57
fsmithrednot as enjoyable13:58
onefangI told her to turn on her ceiling fan and open her windows.  Fire alarm has stopped.  Nothing to see here.  Move along.13:59
chomwitti think the merged line triggers the https14:12
chomwittremoving it the https error  goes14:12
onefangHmmm, maybe you are being redirected to a HTTPS server for the Debian packages?  Most mirrors only have the Devuan packages, and redirect you to Debians mirrors for the Debian packages.14:15
chomwittisnt that the meaning of the merged keyword ?14:16
chomwittto redirect ?14:17
chomwittok so ill try to change the mirror14:17
onefangIt's up to the specific mirror whether or not to redirect.  If it's a Devuan mirror that also mirrors Debian, then it'll handle all packages by itself.14:18
onefangWhere is your server?14:18
hans_sooo, any thoughts on adopting systemd in devuan ?15:16
telst4rumm.. why?15:17
hans_well plenty of arguments here
hans_nvm just kidding,15:18
hans_that comma was a typo btw15:18
yetiError 1066 (a.k.a. 400+666) - off topic :-P15:20
glatshi everyone! theres a repo equivalent for deb-multimedia for devuan?16:18
onefangNot that I know of.  I just use deb-multimedia directly, though others will say that's a bad idea.  It works fine for me.16:21
glatsonefang: yeah. actually i found this saying that what you said16:21
onefangThat's somewhat out of date.16:24
onefangLots of it is wrong to, but that's likely coz it seemed to have been written back when Devuan was fairly new.16:26
fsmithredI think one of the jessie beta isos had deb-multimedia enabled by default. We undid that in a hurry.16:44
fsmithredif you use that repo, be selective16:44
buZzhmmm, it seems hibernation on my x230 breaks my wifi :(17:01
buZzon beowulf17:01
glatsfsmithred: aah17:10
glatsgood to know17:10
glatswhere can i find that iso17:11
onefangSince it was a beta, I suspect it's no longer available.17:11
onefangThere's no Jessie beta ISOs on my ISO server.17:13
james1138Question about the Devuan Beowulf ISO. Whenever it is finished - could we get some notification that it shall be on the Devuan website to download??17:20
buZzjames1138: it'll be in /topic here17:21
onefangEvery one keeps asking when Beowulf will get released, I suspect it'll be announced here.17:21
james1138Okay. Thanx. I just did not want to keep asking like some 6-yr old "it is here yet... "   8-)17:22
buZzfeel free to hilight me if ppl havent added it yet17:22
buZz(after release)17:22
fsmithredwe'll be screaming the news from rooftops17:25
* yeti . o O ( < Aaare we there yet? >---- _@o _@o _@o )17:33
yetiarchive org doesnt have jessie bata neither...17:34
fsmithredI'm glad to hear that.17:35
yetinew myths: the internet never forgets...17:37
yetithe internet only forgets exacly what YOU are looking for17:38
fsmithredand remembers what you hope it forgot17:44
avboxWhat themes do you use in your desktop? Does anybody know simple svg based themes?19:34
yetixterm: black background. desktop: IDK.20:02
yetiand IDC.20:02
jonadabAll foreground colors are #FFE6BC; all background colors are #294D4A; you can look at this for hours and not go snowblind.20:04
buZzjonadab: in coolretroterm? :D20:14
buZznot in devuan it seems , boo :)20:15
jonadabbuZz: No, I am trying to make things _easier_ on my eyes.  So I _don't_ get headaches.20:29
gnarfacei just use enlightenment defaults and dark gtk themes.  nintendo sends me fresh wallpapers.20:31
Akulithe ubuntu 14.04 packages might work on devuan, but i would first try it out in a virtual machine in case everything blows up20:45
Hurgotrondpkg package management is usually sufficiently stable.20:48
Akulicompiling from source should also work on devuan20:48
Akulilol this terminal emulator20:49
tom_workHow can I control /proc/acpi/ibm/led from a non-superuser? Is there a way to persistently assign a group and group rw permissions to this file?21:28
tom_workIs there aready a group for this purpose or do I need to create a 'indicators' group?21:29
specingtom_work: udev21:36
specingah no, not udev21:36
specingset up sudo to allow access to it from non-superuser accounts21:36
gnarfacetom_work: there seems to be a few ways to do it.  from what i am finding, it looks like polkit is an option if you're using it.  some people just suggest running chmod from /etc/rc.local though21:45
gnarfacesudo would work too21:46
gnarfaceit kinda depends on how much vulnerability you're willing to add21:46
gnarfacethere might be some kernel module option or command-line parameter that you can use to override the default permissions on this file too, i don't know21:47
tom_workgnarface, what about eudev?21:51
tom_workgnarface, I just want to allow users in the 'indicator' group to write to /proc/acpi/ibm/led21:52
gnarfacetom_work: normally udev or eudev would be the place you'd look to set default permissions on stuff in /dev/ i just don't think it will also apply to stuff in /sys/ or /proc/ but it is worth looking there too i suppose21:53
free_rabbithello people21:54
gnarfacetom_work: but if you can figure out what kernel module creates it, run /sbin/modinfo on that and see if any of the params look like they're about defining permissions - there is some precedent for that21:55
free_rabbitsct isnt working for me, i have used it under debian before where it has worked. got no error or something.. any suggestions?21:56
free_rabbitthis sct if anyone not knowing it:
gnarfacefree_rabbit: no errors at all?  not even in dmesg or the Xorg log?22:11
golinuxYou will know when Beowulf is released because the website will go to the default desktop colors . . . very dark and reddish22:12
gnarfacefree_rabbit: dunno but odds generally are on some permissions issue.  systemd grants blanket read+write+execute on everything for locally logged-in users.22:12
free_rabbitgnarface: yes no errors, no messages...22:14
gnarfacefree_rabbit: sorry i don't use it, that's my only advice.  check the permissions and ownership on it and stuff it needs.22:14
free_rabbitok but i used it on debian without systemd, or removed systemd22:14
gnarfacehmmm. dunno then22:15
gnarfacei'd still suggest to double-check the permissions22:15
free_rabbitgnarface: how 2 do that?22:16
free_rabbitls it?22:17
gnarfacels -l22:17
gnarfaceyou can see what it is running as with "ps aux --forest"22:17
free_rabbityeah ive done that it is rwx rx rx22:17
gnarfaceyou can "ls -l" the files to check who they're owned by22:17
gnarfacedoes it run?22:17
gnarfaceso it exits when you run it?22:17
free_rabbitwait i CAN run it but it doesn nothing...22:18
free_rabbit*as normal user22:18
gnarfacewell run it as root and make sure it stays in the output of "ps aux"22:18
free_rabbitoh no.. i will not startx as root...22:18
gnarfacesct is not a stand-alone daemon?22:19
free_rabbitwhat do u mean by that?22:19
gnarfacekeep in mind that with systemd you were effectively running everything as root anyway22:19
free_rabbitreally? o_0 what a mess...22:19
gnarfacekeep in mind i don't use sct22:20
free_rabbityeah =)22:20
gnarfaceis there a /usr/share/doc/sct/ directory?22:20
free_rabbityes and the readme is the same as on the github site22:20
free_rabbitit is of course a very tiny program and pretty easy to use, u just have 2 run "sct TEMPERATURE" where TEMPERATUR is something between 1000 and 1000022:22
gnarfacehmmm, it says it uses xrandr22:22
free_rabbityes and xrandr is installed22:22
gnarfaceso it should have access to everything xrandr does22:22
gnarfaceare you able to make xrandr change stuff about the screen layout?22:23
gnarfacethis could still be ultimately a permissions issue22:23
free_rabbityes i need to, because im using a laptop with an external screen22:23
free_rabbiti only need xrand for that ^^22:23
fsmithredI just installed sct on ascii, and it appears to work. 5800 is a little redder than the default22:30
free_rabbithu.. o_022:30
fsmithredwhat are you running for desktop?22:30
free_rabbiterr you mean desktop enviroment?22:31
free_rabbitnone iam using a mionimal xserver with dwm tilling22:31
free_rabbitiam running startx to run xserver22:31
free_rabbitfrom tty22:32
free_rabbithi fsmithred btw ^^22:32
free_rabbitthis is dwm:
fsmithredI wouldn't expect that you need any more then an xserver for it to work, but I could be wrong.22:33
gnarfaceis it possible you might have added some 3rd party packages to your install, or accidentally pulled in some debian ones?22:33
fsmithredanyway, gotta go22:33
gnarfacecould be a trivial version mis-match or something22:33
free_rabbitgnarface: the only tpp are tor browser bundle, firefox and youtube-dl (direct downloads)22:35
free_rabbitand libdvdcss222:36
gnarfaceso, if you downloaded them from a 3rd party repo like debian's though, you might have accidentally pulled in the wrong dependencies along with them22:36
free_rabbitbut i got them all like this on debian too22:36
free_rabbitgnarface: what do you mean?22:36
free_rabbitno not a repo in sources list22:37
free_rabbiti download and compilied or just saves them22:37
free_rabbitsources list is only devuan main22:37
free_rabbit(and linux-libre but thats only kernels)22:38
gnarfacethis is ascii you said, or beowulf?22:39
free_rabbitor stable22:39
gnarfacein your sources.list are you calling it "ascii" or "stable" ?22:40
gnarfaceit matters right now, because devuan is out of sync with debian, so stable/testing/unstable are mislabeled22:40
free_rabbitfisrt ascii but a few days ago i changed it to stable so it will be automatically change to beowulf when beowulf becomes stable, but i have tried sct before, with the same result...22:41
gnarfaceif you didn't know that you might have accidentally mixed packages from different release versions22:41
gnarfacethat could be what is causing this22:41
gnarfaceyou could have half ascii stuff and half beowulf stuff22:42
free_rabbitno like i said i have tried it before with ascii22:42
free_rabbitwhat do you mena ascii = stable22:42
gnarfaceok, but just to be clear, changing it to stable would probably have immediately started it upgrading to beowulf22:42
free_rabbityeah i know22:42
gnarfaceascii is currently devuan stable but debian is in charge of which release "stable" points to, and they're already past the release ascii corresponded to22:43
gnarfacethis happened as soon as debian buster or bullseye or whatever it is now went stable (whichever one corresponds to beowulf)22:44
free_rabbiter.. sorry could say that again in simply english please ^^22:44
free_rabbitthe translation doenst make sense...22:44
gnarfacedebian hosed us.  you used "stable" too early.22:46
gnarfacedebian had already pointed it to beowulf22:47
free_rabbit... so i have beowulf packages now?22:48
gnarfaceprobably a few at least.  that is my new hypothesis for why yours isn't working and fsmithered's is, anyway.22:48
free_rabbitwtf debian!?!22:48
free_rabbitbut wait as i said two times before: i have tried sct BEFORE i changed ascii to stable in my sources list22:49
free_rabbiti first tested it when i was changing from debian to devuan over a year ago22:50
free_rabbitthen i forgot to figure out why it wasnt working22:51
free_rabbiti have now changed stable back to ascii is that ok or will it make problems now?22:52
free_rabbitapt update;apt upgrade doesnt say that anything is wrong...22:52
gnarfaceit depends on how much of a mess it has already made22:52
free_rabbithow to figure that out?22:53
gnarfaceyou could start checking some package versions22:53
gnarfacefigure out if you have beowulf stuff22:53
free_rabbiti only remember i devuan package was upgraded since ive done that22:53
free_rabbitand some new kernels whre installed, but they are comming from linux-libre only22:54
gnarfaceyou're sure it was only one beowulf package?  you should be able to change your sources.list back to ascii then and remove then reinstall that package22:54
gnarfacemaybe it didn't work previously because when you upgraded from debian you either forgot to also "apt-get dist-upgrade" or maybe you had used some debian stretch-backports packages that held back devuan patched ones?22:55
gnarfacehad you tested this with a stock kernel or only ever the linux-libre one?22:56
free_rabbitall packages are from stable22:57
free_rabbitform ascii22:57
free_rabbit^^ sorry22:57
hightower2Hey if I have UEFI system partition, do I still need unencrypted /boot if I want to encrypt other partitions or not?22:58
free_rabbiti did not upgraded from debian22:58
hightower2(talking about netinst installer, not refracta)22:58
free_rabbitmy systems are alwways fresh new installs ;)22:58
free_rabbitgnarface: yes it wasnt running with the stock kernel too - ive changed to linux-libre a few months ago22:59
gnarfacefree_rabbit: what about your video driver?  could you have been using a different video card driver in debian before?23:00
gnarfacevideo drivers don't all have equal support for xrandr commands23:00
gnarfaceand some hardware is supported by multiple drivers23:00
free_rabbitgnarface: ive checked by the packages with the last apt upgrades listed in /var/log/apt/history.log they are all ascii23:00
free_rabbitgnarface: no other videodriver it is the same hardware and the same minimal xserver23:01
gnarfacehightower2: i don't know much about this but someone the other day was saying it is possible with libreboot23:01
gnarfacehightower2: (to also encrypt /boot)23:02
free_rabbitgnarface: yeah that was me ;)23:02
gnarfaceah, right23:03
free_rabbithightower2: you can fde (full disk encryption) with librebotted devices23:03
hightower2Also, is something wonky with current ascii netinst installer? I noticed 3 things: 1) it didn't ask me to select region, 2) "configure clock" just returned me to the menu without offering timezone selection, and 3) in the partitioning, when I created encrypted volumes upon exit from that menu it didn't ask me to set password for encryption; I had to re-enter and exit the menu to trigger the prompt to appear and encrypted device to become ac23:04
free_rabbithightower2: but only if the storage the os is running on is connected via sata (so a hdd or ssd)23:04
free_rabbithightower2: alternatively you can set the boot partition to another device (4ex. a portable usb stick, u dont need libreboot for that)23:05
free_rabbithightower2: about your netinstaller: sounds scary... o_023:06
gnarfacehightower2: there's all kinds of weird shit wrong with it and most of it is inherited from Debian, but the first two issues might be just because you forgot to select expert mode23:07
hightower2also near the end it asked me something about charset to use on the console, with first prompt being UTF8 and the second was about "guess something"23:07
hightower2gnarface, no I always use expert mode, and did so now too23:07
gnarfacehmmm. that is weird23:08
hightower2also the archive mirror chooser menu is different23:08
hightower2everything is unusual23:08
gnarfacehightower2: perhaps it sees a previous partial install it is trying to resume?23:08
free_rabbithightower2: ... sounds like a fake netinstaller X)23:08
hightower2no it's a clean disk23:08
free_rabbithightower2: did you verified the download?23:09
gnarfaceheh hightower2 yea uh, you checksummed it right?23:09
hightower2well,... I downloaded
free_rabbithightower2: ok but did you verified it using the checksums?23:10
hightower2no I will now23:10
free_rabbithightower2: ok... you will need to import the devuan key to your keyring first23:11
hightower2sum is OK23:11
free_rabbitand check the cheksum before checking the iso with the cheksum23:11
free_rabbit(chekedy checkedy ceck)23:11
hightower2the sum I am comparing to is23:11
hightower2lol now I rebooted the installer, went into expert, the first option was "Choose language" and when I chose it it offered language choice list and then it just disappeared and got me back to the main menu23:13
gnarface?? is it possible you are experiencing keyboard failure??23:14
hightower2I am getting some segfaults23:14
hightower2as visible in console 423:14
free_rabbithightower2: wich netinstaller are u using 32 or 6423:14
gnarfaceuh oh23:14
gnarfacecould be bad RAM23:14
gnarfacehightower2: better run memtest on it.  there should be a copy on that installer...23:14
hightower2well, it's a laptop that worked just fine for years, I just wanted to reinstall it23:14
gnarfacewell memtest will only check the system ram23:15
hightower2but well... end of the day so, gonna make another attempt tomorrow. Thanks for the discussion/help folks23:15
gnarfacevideo ram goes bad in laptops a lot too23:15
gnarfacegood luck hightower223:15
free_rabbitive checked the iso too it is ok23:16
free_rabbitoh bad ram?23:16
free_rabbithightower2: yw =)23:17
gnarfacesegfaults can mean bad ram yea23:17
free_rabbitgnarface: so hightower2 need to change it?23:17
gnarfacewell, maybe.  he needs to run some tests first.23:17
free_rabbitgnarface: thx btw. for the wink with that stable thing. so it is always better to write the name of the devuan version in sources list istead of stable or something?23:23
gnarfacefree_rabbit: yes, and that has always been Debian's advice as well, from before Devuan existed23:29
free_rabbitok ive heard the first time ^^23:30
free_rabbitgot another problem: on anotehr devuan device the screen turns off when idle 15 minutes or so. it is a different setup then mine (beginner system with several gui programs). is there a possibilitz to handle this? ive tried to use mate-power-manager but it does nothing to the system, no matter what i do in it...23:47
free_rabbitthe most problem is when watching videos in vlc with it. vlc has an option to disable screensaver, but first there is no screensaver and second it also does not affect the system...23:48
buZzfree_rabbit: whats the question?23:50
buZzyou want the screen to turn off? or not?23:50
gnarfacefree_rabbit: you can control the screen blanking at a low level with xset23:50
gnarfacefree_rabbit: this will turn it off for example:  xset dpms 0 0 023:51
gnarfacefree_rabbit: (turn off screen blanking, not turn off the display)23:51
buZzmaybe 'xset s off'  or 'xset -dpms'23:51
buZz'xset q' for current config23:51
gnarfacethere's a few different syntax formats according to the man page but i've had isolated parsing bugs over the years with every format except the one that goes "xset dpms [suspend] [standby] [off]"23:52
buZzheh yeah23:52
buZzi typically just use 'xset dpms force off' from a shellscript when i'm going to bed ;)23:52
gnarfacefree_rabbit: check the xset man page for details23:53
free_rabbityes i think i have tried that with xset and it doesnt worked.. but i will try it again to be sure of that. need to boot that system first...23:54

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