djph | mason: or both | 00:04 |
---|---|---|
mason | djph: That too. | 00:04 |
agris | Does Devuan ASCII support 802.11w management frame protection? | 04:11 |
xrogaan | does debian supports it? | 04:12 |
xrogaan | If so, devuan does. | 04:12 |
xrogaan | Devuan is simply debian without systemd | 04:12 |
agris | I have no diea | 04:15 |
gnarface | for x86 and amd64 the kernels are the same, agris | 04:16 |
agris | what about the kkkkkkkkernels? | 04:16 |
gnarface | if you can find out what build option enables that, you just need to get your hands on the kernel config shipped with the debian package for it | 04:16 |
gnarface | then you can search that file | 04:17 |
gnarface | all the arm images' kernels are custom built by volunteers, so all bets are off there | 04:17 |
agris | oh | 04:22 |
agris | gnarface, where did kernels come up? | 04:23 |
gnarface | agris: i'm assuming 802.11w support is in the kernel | 04:37 |
gnarface | (if it is anywhere) | 04:37 |
tuxd3v | agris for MPF your AP needs to also support it | 05:36 |
tuxd3v | its not only your computer driver, that nees to support 80211w | 05:37 |
tuxd3v | you can check that with | 05:37 |
tuxd3v | 'iw dev wlan0 station dump' | 05:37 |
tuxd3v | MPF: {yes|no} | 05:38 |
tuxd3v | if MPF is yes its mandatory by the AP | 05:38 |
tuxd3v | if its no, I don't know if there are any form of know for sure if its not Mandatory or if its not supported.. | 05:39 |
agris | tuxd3v, my AP supports it, but when i try to connect my devuan machine it says bad password | 05:39 |
agris | when MPF is set to required | 05:40 |
tuxd3v | it could be disabled | 05:41 |
tuxd3v | it makes part of 80211mac driver, since 2009 I believe | 05:41 |
agris | in Devuan? | 05:41 |
tuxd3v | but then each card has its own driver on top of that.. | 05:41 |
agris | atheros | 05:41 |
tuxd3v | there are hardware that doesn not support it.. | 05:42 |
tuxd3v | ath9k should support it.. | 05:46 |
tuxd3v | but I already experienced several problems with this functionality | 05:47 |
tuxd3v | like severe loss of signal that forced me to disable it | 05:47 |
tuxd3v | but that goes to some 6-8 years or so.. | 05:47 |
tuxd3v | I believe what you are talking about is encryption of Managment frames | 05:48 |
agris | gnarface, you were right about the arm stuff | 05:52 |
tuxd3v | I don't really know, how to enable it, I believe that you need to specify that in the config file.. | 05:52 |
agris | I've recently switched my arm server to NetBSD from Devuan | 05:52 |
agris | works a LOT better | 05:52 |
agris | not constant blaring warnings on vtty from openRC and scary messages in dmesg | 05:52 |
tuxd3v | email 'linux-wireless@vger.kernel.org', and ask how to activate the feature | 05:52 |
tuxd3v | its what comes now to my mind.. | 05:53 |
agris | tuxd3v, well it could be it's an older atheros card | 05:53 |
agris | it's 2.4Ghz only to give you an idea of the age | 05:53 |
agris | but it works without blobs and is 'fast enough' and pretty stable even in non-common operation modes like 802.11s so i've kept it | 05:54 |
agris | is there a way to check if it's activated or not first before I mail the list? | 05:54 |
fsmithred | lspci | 05:55 |
fsmithred | ip a | 05:55 |
fsmithred | iwconfig | 05:55 |
fsmithred | ifconfig | 05:55 |
zatumil | wmii window manager uses 9p filesystem for inter-process communication, do you think it should be used in contrast to dbus? see also https://lists.debian.org/debian-user/2014/12/msg00336.html | 13:04 |
MinceR | interesting | 13:07 |
mason | zatumil: Anything can be used instead of dbus. IPC is old. dbus is recent. | 15:01 |
mason | I'm told the systemd developers are moving towards https://github.com/varlink | 15:02 |
zatumil | varlinks combines service metadata. I would like to avoid any metadata. A virtual filesystems seems to be a suitable interface. What do you mean IPC is old? | 15:15 |
mason | zatumil: IPC has been around for ages and still works | 15:15 |
mason | zatumil: These new things are convoluted and unnecessary. | 15:15 |
zatumil | there is a difference in communication done by kernel developers or some third party devs | 15:35 |
GyrosGeier | the whole thing is a reimplementation of COM | 16:05 |
GyrosGeier | which is not a bad idea in itself, you can do awesome things on the Desktop with COM | 16:05 |
l53vr | I can't figure out how to install evolution-ews from beowulf-backports. It seems like installing it is mutually exclusive from all the evolution packages it's intended for which makes no sense. My system is using everything from beowulf. | 16:14 |
buZz | hmm not sure, but some recent update on beowulf seems to have broken my Fn+backlight intensity buttons on thinkpad x230 :D | 18:02 |
mason | buZz: Not that this helps, but this morning's install on my T420, it still works. | 18:05 |
mason | buZz: FWIW, I still need to manually specify the backlight device for X, popping this into xorg.conf: https://bpaste.net/JJWQ | 18:06 |
buZz | k | 18:08 |
buZz | i'll just dig around | 18:08 |
buZz | didnt need to add it to xorg before | 18:08 |
buZz | and worked without any config in fluxbox on both ascii and beowulf | 18:08 |
buZz | just recently it broke | 18:08 |
mason | buZz: Let me clarify, sorry - function keys Just Work, but I need that in xorg.conf for xbacklight to work. | 18:09 |
mason | FWIW, with OpenBox here because I haven't had a chance to migrate to fluxbox yet. | 18:09 |
debdog | buZz: what if you hold the keys for ten seconds or more? | 18:09 |
buZz | lets see | 18:10 |
buZz | debdog: nothing happens | 18:10 |
debdog | ok | 18:10 |
mason | buZz: I'd be interested in knowing if xbacklight works out of the box for you. | 18:10 |
buZz | ah | 18:10 |
buZz | buzz@bz-x230:~$ xbacklight | 18:10 |
buZz | No outputs have backlight property | 18:10 |
buZz | nice | 18:10 |
mason | buZz: Or after adding that xorg.conf bit | 18:10 |
buZz | thats probably related :D | 18:10 |
mason | buZz: That's what I get without the snippet. | 18:10 |
buZz | weird that it worked without config prior then | 18:10 |
_abc_ | Hi. Is Manjaro / Arch not systemd free? I think it is not? Also, there is no cross-way to add packages from another distribution to the package pool used by devuan, right? Arch uses pacman, with tar.gz/bz2 files. | 18:58 |
_abc_ | I mean tar.xz | 19:00 |
debdog | there's package alien available for this. dunno whetther it works for arch, though, or even in general | 19:01 |
_abc_ | It appears Arch->Manjaro had a splinter called Artix which was systemd less. In 2018. ref: https://forum.manjaro.org/t/manjaro-version-without-systemd/51690 | 19:02 |
_abc_ | If I'd try to pull alien packages, I'd try to pull them from something also systemd-less, just in case the virus is active in the package. | 19:02 |
_abc_ | Devuan and others are mentioned in that thread | 19:03 |
_abc_ | Is LXQt an option on devuan at all? | 19:05 |
debdog | yes | 19:06 |
debdog | at least on Beowulf. IIRC there were issues on ASCII | 19:07 |
fsmithred | lxqt installs just fine in beowulf. There were issues with lxde in ascii, and it looks like in beowulf, too. | 19:27 |
onefang | What issues? I've been using lxde fine on ASCII. | 19:33 |
fsmithred | well, I'm trying to install on a beowulf with standard system utils only | 19:37 |
fsmithred | apt install lxde fails because lxde-core is required and not going to be installed | 19:37 |
fsmithred | and lxpolkit | 19:38 |
debdog | IIRC one was that the dialogue to change background was not working properly | 19:38 |
fsmithred | when I add those to the command, it tells me it needs libpolkit-backened-1-0 | 19:38 |
fsmithred | when I add that, it needs policykit-1 and synaptic | 19:38 |
fsmithred | when I add those it wants lxde-session or some other shit. | 19:38 |
onefang | I use a fixed black background, so that isn't a problem for me. | 19:38 |
fsmithred | if I install consolekit first and then try lxde it fails | 19:39 |
fsmithred | task-lxde-desktop fails for the same reasons | 19:39 |
onefang | lxde-session I do use. | 19:39 |
fsmithred | if I install elogind first, then it looks like it will install the whole system, which includes replacing elogind with consolekit | 19:39 |
fsmithred | that's the screen I'm looking at now. | 19:39 |
onefang | lxde-session is useful for me, it starts all my other apps, including the one that installs the black background. | 19:41 |
fsmithred | onefang, does everything work? (desktop reboot/shutdown, mounting external media as user, synatpic or gparted) | 19:41 |
onefang | Synaptic does (I use it all the time), gparted does (just tried it now). I'm too used to using the shutdown command on all the servers I have looked after to bother with GUI tools for that, and I rarely shutdown / reboot most things anyway. | 19:45 |
deva | A few years ago I tried installing devuan on a Ryzen 1800 system but was forced to use the debian unstable kernel in order to get it to use the threads. Does anybody know if this line of CPUs are directly supported by devuan sources nowaways? | 19:46 |
deva | It appears to be added to the 4.10 kernel, but I'm not sure if it has been backported to 4.9 which (IIRC) is the one shipping with devuan? | 19:47 |
fsmithred | deva, you can get 4.19 from ascii-backports | 19:47 |
onefang | Removeable media just worked fine to. | 19:47 |
fsmithred | or you can upgrade to beowulf and get 4.19 | 19:47 |
fsmithred | if you want to try a live-iso that has ascii-bacports kernel, I've got one | 19:48 |
onefang | I'm not about to test shutting down right now. lol | 19:48 |
deva | fsmithred, I would love to try the ascii-backports solution | 19:48 |
fsmithred | https://get.refracta.org/files/experimental/unofficial_devuan_ascii_2.1_bpo_amd64-20191105_1512.iso | 19:48 |
deva | My primary goal is to have it "pure" devuan if possible | 19:49 |
deva | fsmithred, Aweseom - thanks :-) | 19:49 |
fsmithred | that iso is pure devuan - it's the desktop-live with bpo kernel | 19:49 |
fsmithred | made by the same person who makes the official devuan desktop-live isos | 19:49 |
fsmithred | me | 19:49 |
deva | :-) | 19:50 |
fsmithred | it does not have the debian-installer, but it does have refractainstaller | 19:50 |
fsmithred | if you want raid or lvm, you have to do some stuff manually | 19:50 |
deva | Does it allow to install a minimalistic server, without X etc... ? | 19:51 |
fsmithred | no | 19:51 |
fsmithred | you get what's in the live session | 19:51 |
fsmithred | I do have no-X beowulf isos | 19:51 |
deva | oh, ok | 19:51 |
fsmithred | which are devuan with standard system utils plus extra command-line utils | 19:52 |
fsmithred | refracta in name but only devuan in sources.list | 19:52 |
deva | I'm confused. Isn't beowolf the debian distro? | 19:52 |
fsmithred | no | 19:52 |
fsmithred | buster is debian, beowulf is devuan | 19:52 |
fsmithred | ascii=stretch | 19:53 |
deva | no wonder I'm confused :p | 19:53 |
fsmithred | come around more often | 19:53 |
* deva look back at the happy days where things had version numbers | 19:53 | |
fsmithred | 3 | 19:53 |
deva | ok, so beowulf might be the right choice for me then | 19:53 |
fsmithred | you can try the desktop-live I posted to test it - it does include wireless firmware | 19:55 |
fsmithred | actually, you could test with the beowulf isos - you just need to make sure the kernel works | 19:55 |
fsmithred | and I'm pretty sure it will | 19:55 |
deva | I am running the system on 4.14 today I think, so 4.19 shoudl work fine as well | 19:56 |
fsmithred | people with ryzens that have higher numbers than yours are using devuan | 19:56 |
deva | ... but not devuan stable I guess? | 19:56 |
fsmithred | probably not | 19:56 |
deva | fsmithred, I think I have a clear path now. Thank you very much for your answers :-) | 19:57 |
fsmithred | yw | 19:57 |
AntoFox | o/ | 22:16 |
AntoFox | can you give me feedback on how my latest version of MATE runs? | 22:16 |
AntoFox | also cinnamon | 22:17 |
buZz | AntoFox: what? | 22:22 |
buZz | is MATE a window manager? | 22:22 |
AntoFox | http://hezeh.org/mate-desktop-1.22 | 22:22 |
AntoFox | this | 22:22 |
buZz | aha | 22:24 |
buZz | i dont really want to install anything from random repos :P | 22:24 |
buZz | last time i tried cinnamon it still required gpu acceleration, not something i want in a WM :P | 22:25 |
golinux | buZz: AntoFox provides Cinnamon for Devuan | 22:55 |
golinux | His repo is OK | 22:55 |
buZz | hehe alright | 23:05 |
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