freenode/#devuan/ Thursday, 2020-07-09

pablocastellanosHi, every time I disconnect the ethernet cable, the interface loses it's IPv4 address and then I must log on serial console to run ifdown eth0 then it says “RTNETLINK answers: No such process” and “RTNETLINK answers: Cannot assign requested address”02:21
pablocastellanosThen I run ifup eth0 and the IPv4 address is back. What can I do to prevent loosing the IPv4 address? This is a static address configured in /etc/network/interfaces. I was hoping this was a bug of ascii, but yesterday I installed a new server with beowulf and this problem persists02:23
absintheHello. While in TTY with gpm, how could I make it so when I double click on a link, the whole address gets selected ?  For now, only the part after ":" gets selected, and if a few "special chars" (as %) are present, the selection ends before.02:45
absintheif: https://foo.bar/hello%20world.html -> only "//foo.bar/hello"  gets selected02:45
absinthes/if/ie/02:46
absinthepablocastellanos: could you please paste your /etc/network/interfaces  file ?  Or at least the relevant part.02:47
absinthewell, is there "auto <interface>" in that file ?02:47
gnarfacepablocastellanos: if you have avahi-daemon installed that would be my primary suspect.  uninstall it first then reboot and see if the problem persists03:00
gnarfacepablocastellanos: (this is expected behavior for avahi-daemon, some bullshit to preserve compatibility with bonjour protocols on mac os X - it annoys me too and i doubt there's any rational use case for it)03:01
gnarfaceabsinthe: what happens if you triple-click?03:02
gnarfaceabsinthe: (not sure, but i think you might have to do low-level code edits of gpm to change the word boundary characters, and it might have unforseen consequences)03:03
absinthegnarface: the whole line gets selected03:03
gnarfacehmm, yea i think it's probably keying off things it considers word-boundary characters like a regexp would03:04
gnarfacethe behavior was probably not designed to be url aware03:04
pablocastellanosgnarface: This is my current interfaces https://paste.debian.net/1155677/03:04
gnarfacepablocastellanos: it looks normal, but i also wouldn't expect the problem or solution to be in this file.  run this command:   dpkg -l |grep avahi03:05
absinthegnarface: ah, thanks. makes sense then... couldn't find any configuration file for this (like you'd have for xterm or whatever), so code editing might be the solution (unfortunately=03:05
absinthe)03:05
pablocastellanosgnarface: After installation, I commented the «allow hotplug part» https://paste.debian.net/1155678/ but I uncommented trying to debug my problem03:05
absinthethanks for the hint tho :)03:06
gnarfaceabsinthe: the only other idea i have is maybe it's pulling from some regexp library for that behavior - it would be easy to check which libraries it requires, but changing word-boundary characters in there would really cause havoc on your system03:06
pablocastellanosgnarface: https://paste.debian.net/1155679/ The interesting part, is, that with debian wheezy I didn't have this problem, even with debian jessie (with sysvinit-core) nor stretch (also with sysvinit-core)03:07
gnarfacepablocastellanos: well, you probably also want to change "allow-hotplug eth0" to "auto eth0" but that's not the problem here03:07
absinthehah.  ok.. i won't play with that then :x03:07
gnarfacepablocastellanos: no, that's less interesting than you think.  for this to work it also requires a particular bit of hardware support on the ethernet device which is not ubiquitous but becoming more common on more recent hardware - a bit of support that earlier kernels did not include commonly03:08
gnarfacepablocastellanos: right here is your smoking gun.  uninstall this:  avahi-daemon                                    install03:09
gnarfacepablocastellanos: "apt-get --purge remove avahi-daemon"03:09
gnarfacepablocastellanos: i have a feeling you're going to want to remember to "apt-get --purge pulseaudio" too, but don't think about that until you're ready to debug your audio03:10
gnarface"apt-get --purge remove pulseaudio" sorry03:10
pablocastellanosgnarface: Do you suspect is a avahi-daemon bug? Because I do use avahi in my network03:10
gnarfacepablocastellanos: a bug?  no that's expected behavior03:10
pablocastellanosgnarface: Ha ha ha ha, a «feature»03:11
gnarfacepablocastellanos: afaik it's expected behavior for avahi-daemon and your complaint about it strongly implies to me your use case does not require avahi-daemon03:11
gnarfacepablocastellanos: avahi-daemon is for people who don't know how to even find /etc/network/interfaces, much less populate it with a static network configuration03:12
gnarfacepablocastellanos: it is for dynamic auto-configuring "think for me" hot-plug-and-go type of network setups where security and reliability aren't a concern, the primary concern is being able to assemble and disassemble the entire network quickly without being literate03:13
pablocastellanosgnarface: OK, goodbye avahi03:14
pablocastellanosgnarface: I use avahi publish to other PCs auto detect services provided by this and other servers03:15
gnarfacepablocastellanos: i can't claim i've ever bothered trying to figure out how to make it play nice, i always just uninstall it.  i predate this kid stuff.03:15
pablocastellanosgnarface: Nope, avahi-daemon is not the culprit03:17
gnarfacepablocastellanos: i think if you had a whole network of entirely stock Mac computers setup with bonjour, and you plugged in the one only linux box running avahi-daemon, maybe then it would "do the right thing" but i wouldn't gamble my lunch money on it03:17
gnarfacepablocastellanos: like i said, also change "allow-hotplug eth0" to "auto eth0" (might not matter but sometimes does)03:17
gnarfacepablocastellanos: oh, and make sure you're not running any dhcp clients (ps aux |grep dhc -i)03:18
gnarfacepablocastellanos: you might still have a stray dhcp client running, especially if you had configured wireless at some point03:18
pablocastellanosgnarface: This installation is 15 hours old03:19
gnarfacepablocastellanos: just do my entire checklist and reboot it once03:19
pablocastellanosgnarface: Rebooting03:20
gnarfacepablocastellanos: if you have a power management issue it might be a separate bug looking the same, downing the interface at similar times, but it wouldn't cause you to lose your IP address too.  there's very few things that can cause your network device to lose a static ip configuration03:20
pablocastellanosgnarface: Nope, nor pulsaudio, nor avahi made the trick03:21
gnarfaceso you're saying it still loses it's actual ip address when you unplug the ethernet device?03:22
pablocastellanosgnarface: But pulseaudio hasn't been running, only installed03:22
gnarfaceignore that, it's about audio03:22
pablocastellanosgnarface: Yes03:22
gnarfacelet's focus on the network issue03:22
gnarfacewhich kernel are you using?03:23
pablocastellanosgnarface: 4.19.0-9-amd64 #1 SMP Debian 4.19.118-2+deb10u1 (2020-06-07)03:23
gnarfacei haven't seen this behavior you've described here03:23
gnarfacenot without avahi-daemon anyway03:23
gnarfaceare you sure it's really uninstalled and not running?03:24
pablocastellanosgnarface: I have seen this behavior in every devuan release03:24
gnarfacecould you have unattended upgrades reinstalling it?03:24
gnarfacehmmm03:24
pablocastellanosgnarface: unattanded upgrades disabled at install time03:24
gnarfacethis is very weird but you do understand that purely statistically, the empirical evidence is that this is self-inflicted somehow.  something weird you've done must be the culprit, unless it's failing hardware, but i've never seen hardware fail in this particular way.  it would be weird.  not impossible but very weird.  it's far more likely you've done something wrong elsewhere, but i'm running out of ideas about what03:25
gnarfacethat could even possibly be03:25
pablocastellanosgnarface: Uninstalling it's associated libraries https://paste.debian.net/1155680/03:25
gnarfacethose are harmless03:26
gnarfaceso the only other thing that comes to mind is to check the module options for the ethernet driver, disable stuff like power management, just to see if that helps03:27
pablocastellanosgnarface: This happened to me the firs time I installed devuan two year ago, in new dell hardware03:27
gnarfacethis happens with every machine?  have you got another ethernet device to try?03:27
pablocastellanosgnarface: This is another server, not new03:27
pablocastellanosgnarface: Even with usb ethernet adapters03:27
gnarfacefascinating03:27
pablocastellanosgnarface: But not with virtual machines03:27
gnarfacehmmm03:27
gnarfaceis it managed switching hardware?  i'm wondering if maybe you have a red herring, and it's not actually losing the ip, but just the link...03:28
pablocastellanosgnarface: Today, I was thinking in writing a eudev rule to restart the interface if it detects a cable disconnection03:28
gnarfacehow do you check for the ip address after you determine it has lost it?03:28
gnarfaceyea, that's what i'm suggesting you check the module options for the ethernet driver for; ways to disable stuff like cable plug detection and power management states03:29
pablocastellanosgnarface: From the serial console, it's instantly03:29
gnarfaceserial console shouldn't even use an IP address...03:29
gnarfacethat shouldn't even be related to this03:29
gnarfaceanything else weird you can think of about the hardware or the setup that you should tell me?03:30
pablocastellanosgnarface: Exactly, inside the serial console I execute ip addr show dev eth003:30
pablocastellanosgnarface: When the cable disconnects, the interface loses its ipv4 addres03:30
gnarfaceand you said this is only happening on devuan but not debian?03:31
pablocastellanosgnarface: Exactly03:31
gnarfaceand it's been happening for every release since ascii03:32
gnarfaceto all your computers03:32
pablocastellanosgnarface: As far as I remember03:32
pablocastellanosgnarface: yes03:32
gnarfaceit just doesn't seem possible for me to have never seen this bug under those circumstances03:32
gnarfacei've got nothing, sorry03:32
pablocastellanosgnarface: I can install ascii to try to reproduce this bug03:33
gnarfaceif you think of anything else pertinent maybe it will give me a clue, but at the moment i'm out of ideas03:33
gnarfaceyou mentioned udev rule customizations - do you have a lot of non-stock udev rules?  maybe one of them could be interfering somehow?03:33
gnarfaceit might be time to file a bug report against eudev but like i said, this really seems too obvious of a glitch for it to have existed this long without my notice... not impossible but very unlikely03:34
gnarfaceit's more likely something weird you've done that you think is the last possible thing that could be wrong is the actual culprit03:35
gnarfacestray dhcp client still running maybe, overriding your static config from a cron script you forgot... something like that03:35
gnarfaceit would have to be pretty far out of the box03:36
pablocastellanosgnarface: As I mentioned before, this is only a 15 hours installation, but a VM server have only one rule to change permissions of /dev/vhost-net https://paste.debian.net/1155682/03:36
pablocastellanosgnarface: No other customization apart of adding a line in inittab to have serial console03:37
gnarfacehmm03:37
gnarfacewhat about with one of the live cds?03:37
gnarfacecould you see if this behavior persists on one of the beowulf live images?03:38
gnarfacei'm out of ideas, it's just a shot in the dark03:38
pablocastellanosgnarface: I'm not sure, but with beowulf-desktop I think it didn't happenned03:38
gnarfacemake sure, that could narrow it down to a possible configuration or package list difference03:38
pablocastellanosgnarface: beowulf-desktop live cd, I mean03:38
gnarfaceyea, that would be the one to try03:39
pablocastellanosgnarface: I will, this bug is making me crazy, ha ha ha ha03:39
gnarfacehttps://files.devuan.org/devuan_beowulf/desktop-live/03:39
pablocastellanosgnarface: I overwrite the live-cd (on a memory stick) today to make a netinstall, LOL03:42
rrqpablocastellanos: sounds like there is some network manager daemon running03:46
rrqor mayeb it's demon in this case03:46
pablocastellanosrrq: wicd is running03:50
rrqso tell it to leave eth0 alone03:50
gnarfacepablocastellanos: why would you be running wicd without wireless devices?03:51
gnarfacepablocastellanos: why even have that installed?03:52
gnarfacepablocastellanos: also, doesn't it require a dhcp client to work, a dhcp client i explicitly asked you to check for?03:52
gnarfacepablocastellanos: amputate03:53
pablocastellanosgnarface: wicd was installed without asking for it03:54
pablocastellanosrrq: gnarface: Disabling wicd (at /etc/default/wicd ) solves the issue03:55
pablocastellanosrrq: gnarface: Thank you very much03:55
gnarfacepablocastellanos: no problem.  try --no-install-recommends for future upgrades03:56
gnarfacepablocastellanos: but if the issue persists, you can pin packages out so they can't be reinstalled03:56
pablocastellanosgnarface: I don't understand why wicd was installed by default03:56
gnarfacepablocastellanos: choices you made during the install03:56
gnarfacepablocastellanos: it probably got pulled in with the window manager/desktop suite you chose03:57
pablocastellanosgnarface: seems xfce depends on it03:57
gnarfacepablocastellanos: at the tasksel step of the installer, you can just uncheck all the boxes, then you get a minimal install without the cruft and you can just install only the parts you want03:57
pablocastellanosgnarface: Users need at least xfce to use tsvnc03:58
gnarfacepablocastellanos: well you can always pin it out if it's a problem but there should be an easy way to disable it too04:02
pablocastellanosgnarface: Thanks for your time and ideas04:02
gnarfaceno problem04:05
gnarfacepablocastellanos: the xfce meta-package requires wicd, but i am pretty sure that without it, you can get the xfce components ala-carte04:06
gnarfacepablocastellanos: lots of people use xfce here, i'm not one of them, but lots of them are here, so you should be able to get advice on it easily04:08
pablocastellanosgnarface: Thank you.04:08
striveHi. I'm attempting to install beowulf from a netinstall iso. This laptop does not have an ethernet port but does have wifi built-in - how do I get Devuan to detect it?05:08
rrqwhich iso? sha256sum05:16
strivedevuan_beowulf_3.0.0_amd64-netinstall.iso05:36
striverrq: My apologies on the delay.05:36
striveIs there another ISO file I need to copy to usb drive?05:40
rrqsupposedly it should find network interfaces automagically; it contains all available firmware.05:41
rrqis a live installer an option for you?05:41
striveDarn.05:41
striveIs that the minimal installer?05:41
strivedevuan_beowulf_3.0.0_amd64_minimal-live.iso ?05:42
plasma41strive: Do you know what wifi chipset the laptop is using?05:42
striveNo. But I could probably find out.05:43
rrqstrive: yes, "minimal live" should be fine05:44
plasma41The first thing to determine with any wifi connectivity during install issue is whether the wifi chipset is even supported.05:44
striveASUS VivoBook F510QA05:45
striveplasma41: You're absolutely right. I should've done that.05:45
striveAll I see is "Network controller: Realtek Semiconductor Co., Ltd. Device b822"05:46
striveUsing lspci05:47
striveOh. "Subsystem: AzureWave Device 2950"05:47
plasma41Ok, that looks to be a Realtek RTL8822BE05:49
striveNow how do I go about checking to see if that piece of hardware is supported?05:50
plasma41Given that it supports 802.11ac I can guarantee you that it will not work without a firmware blob.05:52
striveSo the I've got Devuan up and running and when I ran "ip a" it's listing "wlan0" as down.05:53
striveAh, ok.05:53
gnarfacestrive: got a spare usb ethernet adapter to try?  a non-wireless one?05:53
plasma41No free/libre firmware exists for any currently extant 802.11ac chipsets, unfortunately.05:54
strivegnarface: I wish.05:54
striveplasma41: So I can forget about trying out Devuan?05:54
striveI was looking forward to a non-systemd distro :(05:54
gnarfacestrive: just use the full-size cd/dvd installer sets until you can get your hands on a supported network device05:55
gnarfacestrive: you can find supported ones as cheap as $905:55
strivegnarface: Good idea but I won't be getting any new hardware.05:56
striveWelp, I appreciate the assistance :)05:56
gnarfacestrive: well the full cd/dvd sets are for the offline installation paradigm you're stuck in.  it's not optimal, but it will still work05:57
striveOh, I'm sure.05:57
striveBut I need access to the interwebs :/05:58
gnarfaceyour choices are limited then05:58
striveYeah. I'll move on to researching other non-systemd distros.05:58
striveThanks peeps :)05:58
* gnarface facepalms05:58
plasma41All post-802.11n wifi hardware is exclusively proprietary. I do hope this changes in the future. Until then, I'm sticking to 802.11n equipment.06:00
plasma41And.. he's gone06:00
gnarfacehe just replied to my /msg and claims it works on ubuntu06:00
plasma41but only because of a firmware blob.06:01
search_socialmy wireless didn't work until i updated the kernel (which i did via usb)07:08
ham5urgIs syslinux supported by devuan? Is it as well supported as grub? I would like sto switch to syslinux as grub does not support md-raids with metadata-ver.>0.9.16:09
gnarfaceit's a good question, but i would assume the answer is that it isn't different from debian16:12
gnarfaceit doesn't rely on systemd and it's not in the banned packages list, right?16:12
gnarfaceif it doesn't have a systemd dependency i wouldn't expect any different behavior from debian16:12
Guest88947hi16:14
Guest88947pablocastellanos: regarding your issue related with ifupdown eth0: install ifplugd, developed by Poettering, but nothing to do with systemd, dbus, etc16:14
Guest88947it works fine16:15
Guest88947easy to use: have a look at the manpages16:15
Guest88947you can find the script run after after every plug/unplug event in /etc/ifplugd/actions.d/ifupdown16:16
ham5urgIs there any performance-gain in usage of md-raid-metadata 1.2 vs. 1.0?16:16
Guest88947in this script $1 will be eth0 and $2 will be "up" or "down", depending on the event16:17
Guest88947you can customize it, bringing up again your network interface16:18
Guest88947there is also another one: netplugd, but i never used it, and it's also developed by him, i seem to remember...16:19
pablocastellanosGuest88947: OK, I'll check that16:48
Guest88947ok, good luck :)16:51
Guest88947need to go16:52
HackphiLhello18:47
HackphiLavez-vous quelques conseils pour un newbie svp ?18:47
stiltrHackphiL: You'll probably have better luck with English. Do you have a specific question or are you just looking for general information?18:58
HackphiLstiltr ~~> thx for answering19:18
HackphiLI'd like test devuan so debian without systemd and would like to know if they are some difficulties about.19:19
HackphiLI'm a newbie ;)19:19
HackphiLIt should be nice for me to find a tuto in french if possible.19:21
stiltrI'm not aware of any issues, but other may have a better idea. If you're familar with debian, you shouldn't have any issues.19:22
stiltr*others19:22
HackphiLNO PUBKEY BB23C00C61FC752C19:54
HackphiLkesaco?19:54
HackphiLstiltr ~~> an idea?19:55
fsmithredHackphiL, here are install, upgrade or migration docs  https://devuan.org/os/install19:55
fsmithredapt install devuan-keyring19:55
fsmithredwhere are you? (what are you doing?)19:55
HackphiLI'm migrate from debian buster to beowulf19:56
HackphiLI changed my source-list19:57
fsmithredread the migration guide19:57
fsmithredthere are some tricky points19:57
HackphiLI did19:57
HackphiLoh yes!19:57
HackphiLjust the following line ;)19:57
fsmithreddid you get the kerying alright?19:59
HackphiLI think so fsmithred20:00
fsmithredit should have warned you about trusting it and asked for confirmation20:00
HackphiLupgrade is on the road... ;)20:01
fsmithredcool20:01
HackphiLafter the NO PUBKEY problem, I made : # apt-get install devuan-keyring --allow-unauthentificated20:03
HackphiLthen, again : # apt-get update --allow-insecure-repositeries20:05
HackphiLtrhen : # apt-get update20:05
fsmithredshouldn't need to allow insecure after the keyring is installed20:05
HackphiLthen : # apt-get install wicd-gtk  (I use it on my others pc)20:06
fsmithredok20:06
HackphiLthen : # apt-get upgrade20:07
absinthei do not mean to troll, but why apt-get instead of apt ?  Out of habbit ?20:08
HackphiLI got an error line at the end : GDBus.Error:org.freedesktop.systemd1.NoSuchUnit: Unit packagekit.service not found.20:08
fsmithredprobably habit, yes20:09
HackphiLplease later absinthe thx20:09
fsmithredat what point does sysvinit get installed? I haven't used this procedure.20:10
HackphiLnow : # apt-get install eudev20:10
fsmithredyeah, try that20:10
HackphiLI wonder if I should not have to reboot before ?20:12
HackphiLso...20:13
HackphiL# apt-get -f install20:13
HackphiLreboot !20:14
HackphiLFAILED to start avahi mDNS/DNS-SD Stack20:15
HackphiLFAILED to start Raise network interfaces20:16
HackphiLFAILED to start WPA Supplicant20:16
fsmithredyou're doing this over wireless?20:17
HackphiLstill debian 1020:18
fsmithredsystemd is running?20:18
HackphiLblack screen20:18
fsmithredboot to rescue mode and then disble your display manager20:19
fsmithredthen you should be able to boot to console to finish and fix it20:19
HackphiLI wrote login and password then... black screen20:20
HackphiLa few seconds later.20:20
fsmithredcould try ctrl-alt-F220:20
HackphiLreset sorry20:20
HackphiLwell...20:22
HackphiLlogin20:23
HackphiLpassword20:23
fsmithredgraphical login?20:23
HackphiLyes20:23
HackphiLwindow:20:24
fsmithredprobably will do the same. Try dropping to console.20:24
HackphiLIpossible DBus20:24
HackphiLsh*** black screen20:24
fsmithredctrl-alt-F2 ?20:24
HackphiLctrl-alt-F220:24
fsmithreddoes it get you to a console login?20:25
HackphiLloin then password ok20:25
HackphiLhackphil@heden: ~$20:26
fsmithredok20:26
fsmithredgood20:26
fsmithredso you could become root and continue with the upgrade20:26
fsmithredand/or turn off display manager so you don't get the graphical login screen20:26
HackphiLI'm root20:27
HackphiLroot@heden: ~#20:27
fsmithredcat /proc/1/comm20:27
fsmithredwill tell if you're running systemd or sysvinit20:28
HackphiLok I try...20:28
HackphiL;(20:28
fsmithredd?20:28
fsmithredit's ok20:29
HackphiLcat /proc/1/comm ---> systemd20:29
fsmithreda different migration guide kept systemd until the end20:29
HackphiLapt-get dist-upgrade ?20:29
fsmithredapt-get -f install20:30
fsmithredsee if it adds anything20:30
fsmithredthen dist-upgrade20:30
fsmithredI need coffee. Back in 10 minutes.20:31
HackphiLok ;)20:32
HackphiLcan't resolve http://deb.devuan.org/merged beowulf InRelease20:37
HackphiLcan't resolve http://deb.devuan.org/merged beowulf-updates InRelease20:38
HackphiLcan't resolve http://deb.devuan.org/merged beowulf-security InRelease20:38
HackphiLcan't resolve http://deb.devuan.org/merged beowulf-backports InRelease20:38
HackphiLcan't resolve http://deb.devuan.org20:38
yetimääääääään!20:38
stiltrCheck /etc/resolv.conf20:39
HackphiLcat /etc/resolv.conf ---> :20:40
HackphiLdomain home20:41
HackphiLsearch home20:41
ham5urgWill a kernel-upgrade also upgrade a syslinux.cfg if I use syslinux instead grub?20:41
HackphiLnameserver 192.168.1.120:41
yetihttps://termbin.com/lc7j20:42
yetimay be useful some day... :-P20:43
fsmithredip a20:43
fsmithredcheck that your interface has an address20:43
HackphiLip a ---> 192.168.1.1120:44
fsmithredping devuan.org20:45
fsmithredctrl-c to stop it20:45
HackphiLping devuan.org20:45
HackphiLoups!20:45
fsmithredyeah, you have to let it run before you stop it20:45
fsmithredlol20:45
HackphiLname or service unknown20:46
fsmithredyou have encrypted wireless?20:48
HackphiLI don't thinko so20:48
fsmithredyou're using wireless or wired connection?20:49
HackphiLwireless!20:49
HackphiLi get an rj45...20:50
fsmithredgood. That's easier.20:50
fsmithredplug it in and run 'dhclient eth0'20:50
HackphiLok...20:56
HackphiLplugged20:59
HackphiLit's not eth0 but enp9s021:00
fsmithredok21:00
fsmithreddhclient that21:00
HackphiLcannot find device "enp9s0"21:01
HackphiLcannot find device "eth0"21:02
fsmithredwtf?21:02
HackphiLoups21:02
fsmithredwhat display manager are you using?21:02
HackphiLxfce21:03
fsmithredlightdm?21:03
HackphiLyes21:03
HackphiL# dhclient enp1s021:04
HackphiLit's ok for ping21:05
fsmithredoh, good21:05
fsmithredI was going to suggest killing the display manager and then going to runlevel 221:05
fsmithredoh...21:06
fsmithredyou might not have runlevels yet21:06
fsmithredI guess you should continue the upgrade21:06
HackphiL# apt-get update ?21:06
fsmithredupgrade or dist-upgrade21:07
HackphiLupgrade first21:07
HackphiLdist-upgrade running...21:08
HackphiLxorg has been deleted21:09
fsmithredoh21:09
HackphiLxfce too21:10
fsmithredyeah21:10
fsmithredyou'll be able to add it again21:10
HackphiLI just said no when he asked me to delete the kernell21:10
crashoverrideoh, why?21:10
fsmithredthat might be ok if it's not the kernel that's running21:11
HackphiLshoud have I to delete the kernell?21:11
crashoverridepeople don't know how to be playful anymore.21:11
crashoverridenah, delete the RUNNING one.21:11
fsmithredwon't hurt to keep old kernel21:11
crashoverridethen it's fun.21:11
crashoverridefsmithred: wrong.21:11
fsmithredwhy you say that?21:12
HackphiLdit-upgrade ended21:12
fsmithredI've had systems with four or five kernels. They just sit there if you don't boot them.21:12
crashoverridefsmithred: that was the ubuntu mentality in 2013. Keep old kernels. Also, have a separate boot partition. 100MB ought to be enough, right?21:12
HackphiLme too with debian21:12
crashoverrideWell, as it turns out, no.21:13
fsmithredit was also redhat mentality in 200021:13
fsmithredHackphiL, is sysvinit installed?21:13
fsmithredsysvinit-core21:13
crashoverrideeventually, the kernels would fill the boot partition. And then a new kernel would be installed.21:13
crashoverrideOr its first half, at least.21:13
crashoverrideEver tried booting half a kernel?21:14
fsmithredno, but I've tried booting a full root partition21:14
crashoverridenice.21:14
crashoverridehow did it go?21:14
fsmithrednot well at all21:14
crashoverridehow bad?21:14
fsmithredgotta watch to make sure partitions don't fill up21:14
fsmithredwas long time ago. I don't remember details.21:15
HackphiLsysvinit-core not installed21:15
fsmithredwell, I don't know when sysvinit is supposed to get installed in that procedure.21:15
fsmithredThe one I followed did that first, before even editing sources.list21:15
crashoverridechallenge: install systemd on devuan21:15
fsmithredyou can't do the next step because systemd is running21:16
crashoverridecall it "rebian"21:16
fsmithredso install sysvinit-core21:16
fsmithredcrashoverride, it's impossible to install systemd in devuan.21:16
crashoverridenothing ever is impossible.21:16
crashoverrideGiven enough thrust, pigs fly just fine.21:17
HackphiLinstalling...21:17
fsmithredok, but the package manager won't know it's there21:17
HackphiLdone fsmithred21:17
fsmithredunless you fork amprolla21:17
fsmithredok, you should be able to boot into sysvinit and then purge systemd21:18
fsmithredand install the missing stuff21:18
crashoverridethat must be a good feeling21:18
HackphiLI reboot?21:18
fsmithredyeah, reboot. I can't think of anything else to do.21:19
fsmithredAnd then you should be able to continue with the instructions.21:19
fsmithredoh21:19
fsmithredeudev???21:19
fsmithredis that installed?21:19
fsmithredI suspect it is not.21:19
crashoverrideif not, it will still boot21:19
HackphiLgrub>21:19
fsmithreddo you know your partition layout?21:20
crashoverridemaybe not past the init ram fs21:20
crashoverridebut it will boot-ish21:20
HackphiLhda21:20
fsmithredwhich is the root partition, and do you have a separate /boot partition?21:20
fsmithredthat should be sda unless you're running debian lenny21:21
HackphiL /home is separate21:21
fsmithredand there should be a digit at the end21:21
fsmithredand is this bios or uefi?21:21
HackphiLbios21:21
fsmithredgood21:21
HackphiLold pc21:21
crashoverrideI'm having a first world problem21:21
fsmithredset root=(hd0,1)21:21
crashoverridedog hair in my red wine21:22
fsmithredlinux /vmlinuz ro root=/dev/sda121:22
fsmithredI'm assuming sda1 is your root partition21:22
fsmithredinitrd /initrd.img21:22
fsmithredboot21:22
fsmithredfuck21:22
fsmithredoh, nm. That should be ok if xorg is gone.21:23
crashoverrideError: fuck instruction unknown.21:23
crashoverridealso does that even work with grub 2?21:23
crashoverrideI miss grub 1.21:23
fsmithredI think there's another linux distribution that might recognize that command.21:23
HackphiLf... english clavier21:23
fsmithredyes, you can boot grub2 from command-lne21:23
fsmithredfrom grub-prompt, I mean21:23
crashoverrideHackphiL: ouate dou iou ave aguinste zeu angliche quiboarde?21:24
fsmithredI learned that at a LUG meeting early in my linux experience, and it has served me well many times21:24
crashoverrideSeriously, tho, lrn2ansi, it will save your life.21:24
fsmithredHackphiL, do those commands work?21:25
fsmithreddo I need to repeat them?21:25
crashoverridefsmithred: I gave up on grub when they replaced grub 1 with grub 2. That was a regression in my eyes.21:25
crashoverridenow using extlinux when I need linux.21:26
HackphiLdifficult with english clavier ;(21:28
fsmithredtab-completion works at grub prompt21:29
coniferhi, is there a way to install ceres directly?21:30
fsmithreddebootstrap install21:30
coniferor do i need to get beowulf and upgrade?21:30
fsmithredthat's one way21:30
fsmithredyou might be able to select it if you use a mini.iso21:30
fsmithredand expert install21:31
HackphiLbad sda ;(21:31
coniferthanks, good to know21:31
fsmithredHackphiL, what?21:31
crashoverridewait, is ceres out now?21:33
fsmithredceres is always out, ceres is never out21:33
coniferanother question: does ceres cause much trouble in everyday usage? i.e is it very unstable? ;)21:33
fsmithredceres=sid21:33
crashoverrideah21:33
crashoverrideok21:34
crashoverrideconifer: ymmv I guess21:34
fsmithredconifer, that varies with how fast devs are building packages and adding them to repo21:34
crashoverrideconifer: i.e. totally depends WHEN you upgrade.21:34
HackphiLgrub> linux /vmlinuz ro root=/dev/sda1  ---> error : disk "hda,!" not disponible21:34
fsmithredunstable means "versions change frequently"21:34
fsmithredgrub> linux /vmlinuz ro root=/dev/21:35
crashoverrideit's like russian roulette. 5 out of 6 people report it being harmless.21:36
fsmithredand press TAB a couple times21:36
crashoverridefsmithred: seriously, grub supports completion?21:36
fsmithredhow many disks are there?21:36
fsmithredyes, tab completion was in grub1 also21:37
HackphiLtab ---> same line21:37
crashoverridefsmithred: never tried it21:37
fsmithredwtf is hda?21:37
HackphiLhow to be certain?21:38
stiltrhda is usually pata disks, I think.21:38
fsmithredhow many disks are in this computer?21:38
HackphiL121:38
fsmithredpata disks have been called sda since squeeze, I think21:38
stiltrHmm. Interesting.21:39
coniferi was (mostly) happy using ascii+backports, but came across some third party soft i couldn't install because the dependencies weren't fresh enough21:39
fsmithredok, HackphiL lets go back to first line21:39
fsmithredset root=(21:39
stiltrI think he's not setting the root in grub and it's defaulting to hda?21:39
fsmithredthen TAB21:39
coniferso i thought ceres might be a better choice than beowulf21:39
fsmithredshould tell you hd021:40
fsmithredset root=(hd0,21:40
fsmithredthen TAB again21:40
HackphiLthere is nothing importanton this disk21:40
crashoverridehttps://media.tenor.com/images/e623b6fa01166ddb5d91f385571a06ad/tenor.png21:40
fsmithredand it should show the partitions21:40
fsmithredOH21:40
fsmithredkill it and do a fresh install21:40
crashoverridethe dog hair in my red wine is actually a random hair21:41
fsmithredmeaning the dog did not select that hair especially for you?21:41
fsmithredand unless you have huskies, it's fur21:42
coniferor is there another way to go about getting newer versions of some libs when backports can't help me?21:42
HackphiLmsdos21:42
fsmithredno, it's backports or backport your own or upgrade21:42
stiltrconifer: You can backport them yourself.21:42
fsmithredyes21:42
fsmithredmsdos1, msdos2...?21:42
fsmithredso the line should be21:43
stiltrconifer: What are you trying to install?21:43
fsmithredset root=(hd0,msdos1) ?21:43
crashoverridebackporting oneself must be a lot of work21:43
coniferstiltr: can this be done without shooting oneself in the foot?21:43
fsmithredsome packages are easy to bacport, some are not.21:43
stiltr^^^this21:44
crashoverrideconifer: just aim higher.21:44
coniferi wanted to try out some mastodon clients or some other IM app21:44
conifershooting myself in the knee doesn't cut it either21:44
HackphiLhd0,msdos121:44
fsmithredyeah21:45
HackphiLhd0,msdos521:45
crashoverrideas the old saying goes: "If you keep shooting yourself in the foot, you need to be aiming higher."21:45
fsmithredthat should work21:45
HackphiLhd0,msdos621:45
fsmithredoh21:45
fsmithred6 is possibly your /home parttion21:45
fsmithredor 521:45
fsmithredone of them is swap21:45
yetigrub can ls21:45
fsmithredgrub should tell you the filesystem on it21:45
crashoverridehow does it count?21:45
HackphiLI think so for /home21:46
fsmithredgrub counts disks from 0 and partitions from 121:46
crashoverridelike 0..4 physical, 5..n logical?21:46
fsmithredyes21:46
HackphiLswap is sda521:46
crashoverrideah sorry, 0..3 4.n21:46
fsmithredfor msdos partition table21:46
crashoverride4..n even21:46
fsmithredlinux /vmlinuz ro root=/dev/sda121:47
crashoverrideoh wait, misread21:47
crashoverrideit's actually 1..4 5..n21:47
crashoverridemakes more sense21:47
crashoverridematches fdisk and the dev numbering too21:47
fsmithredgpt lets you have 128 primary partitions21:48
HackphiLls ---> (proc) (hd0) (hd0,msdos6) (hd0,msdos5) (hdà,msdos1)21:48
fsmithredhda???21:48
fsmithredok, tell it that21:49
fsmithredset root=(hda,msdos1)21:49
fsmithredI don't believe it, though21:49
HackphiLls ---> (proc) (hd0) (hd0,msdos6) (hd0,msdos5) (hd0,msdos1)21:49
fsmithredah21:49
fsmithredhd0,msdos121:49
fsmithredset root=(hd0,msdos1)21:50
fsmithredlinux /vmlinuz ro root=/dev/sda121:50
fsmithredinitrd /initrd.img21:50
fsmithredboot21:50
fsmithredI need to go in a couple minutes21:50
fsmithredif you can't rescue this migration, download an installer iso and start fresh.21:51
HackphiLfile /vmlinuz non-disponible21:53
crashoverrideHackphiL: that's some interesting frenglish21:54
HackphiLcan you give the link for iso pls?21:54
crashoverridewhat it meant to say is "not found"21:54
fsmithredhttps://sledjhamr.org/devuan-cd/devuan_beowulf/21:55
fsmithredfiles.devuan.org has isos, but sledjhamr is faster21:56
fsmithrednetinstall iso should be sufficient. It will download all that you want.21:57
HackphiLI think I'll choose desktop ;)21:57
fsmithredok. You can do offline install with that, but I strongly recommend selecting a package mirror when it asks.21:58
HackphiLwhich one?22:01
fsmithreddeb.devuan.org22:01
HackphiLdownloading at 4,5 Mo/s22:03
crashoverrideHackphiL: you need to stop francising all the things to :p22:12
crashoverrideit's MB in the entire rest of thr world.22:13
crashoverrideit's like americans being all dreamy with their fairytale units...22:13
crashoverrideyes but the world still is on metric.22:13
crashoverrides/thr/the/22:14
HackphiLI write what I read on my pc so 4,5 Mo/s23:19
HackphiLif it was written 4,R MB/s I'd wrote it23:21
HackphiLfor the rest listen the sex pistols on their famous album named "never mind the bollocks"23:22
HackphiLwell my dear crashoverride , I have to shed a tear for Nelson...23:23
tuxd3vhello to all free citizens of this world spread around the Galaxy :)23:30

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