freenode/#devuan/ Thursday, 2020-07-23

systemdletecan't seem to delete/extract portions of audio with audacity.  Audacity seems to be ignoring keyboard input.  Menus disable edit options even after selecting a portion of the track.00:01
systemdletethis is on ascii, with the stock version of audacity, whatever that is.00:01
systemdletefor comparison, vlc works as expected, and so do all other programs.00:04
roo^ybrocashelm: where can devuan chimaera be downloaded from?00:18
roo^yalready checked there. No chimaera 400:21
systemdletegolinux: ^^^00:21
systemdleteany idea?00:22
golinuxOh . . .duh . . .00:22
golinuxOf course no isos yet.  Just upgrade from ascii00:23
* golinux just woke up from a nap00:23
roo^yfor me that translates to: clone beowulf partition to it's neighboring partition, then upgrade to chimaera have both :) thanks00:26
golinuxfsmithred may have some test refracta isos00:34
fsmithredyeah, I have some chimaera isos00:34
fsmithredI think00:34
fsmithredjust one. amd64:
fsmithrednot a lot of grooming went into that one00:35
fsmithredit has openbox and lxpanel00:36
fsmithredI don't remember what else00:36
roo^yupdating is scuffed in beowulf. 2nd of the 3 things populated by 'sudo apt-get update && apt-get upgrade' is: Repository ' beowulf-updates InRelease' changed its 'Suite' value from 'testing-updates' to 'stable-updates' This must be accepted explicitly before updates for this repository can be applied. See apt-secure(8) manpage for details.00:37
fsmithreddo 'apt update' and say yes00:38
fsmithredyou really got that message with apt-get?00:38
fsmithredapt asks you to answer yes or no00:38
roo^yapt worked, downloaded00:40
fsmithredyou're upgrading to beowulf or from beowulf to chimaera?00:41
fsmithredoh, nm00:41
fsmithredI understand the problem00:41
roo^ycurrently wanting package updates for beowulf, not moving to chimaera00:42
fsmithredthis is a new beowulf install?00:43
roo^yboth sudo apt upgrade & sudo apt-get upgrade, populate: E: Could not get lock /var/lib/dpkg/lock-frontend - open (11: Resource temporarily unavailable) & E: Unable to acquire the dpkg frontend lock (/var/lib/dpkg/lock-frontend), is another process using it?00:45
fsmithredI would guess that the answer to that last question is yes00:46
roo^yheh, i have synaptic open might be why!00:46
fsmithredbeen there done that00:46
brocashelmit's the gooey's fault heh00:46
fsmithredalso done it in two different terminals00:47
roo^yterminal working now :)00:48
systemdleteanyone here successfully using audacity to extract audio segments?00:50
roo^ydone. done. It'd require a reboot to take full affect wouldn't it?00:52
brocashelmi have no problems with chimaera; i should've upgraded sooner00:54
roo^yrefracta ascii didn't do anything weird like the meltdown I had with screen/KB earlier, so got fingers crossed with all these healthy nutritious updates :P00:56
fsmithredsystemdlete, yes I've used audacity to extract audio from video (or from audio)01:17
systemdleteon ascii?01:17
systemdleteor beowulf?01:17
fsmithrednot sure if I've done it on beowulf01:18
fsmithredascii, jessie, wheezy at least01:18
systemdleteso on ascii for sure then01:18
fsmithredhang on and I'll do one01:18
fsmithredwhat's the problem?01:18
systemdleteit seems the program is not responding to input from the keyboard for one, and for another, after I select a segment of audio, it doesn't give me the edit options in the menu01:19
systemdleteevery other program works fine (as far as they normally do, at least)01:19
systemdletebtw, just fyi -- this is on host hardware, not a VM01:19
fsmithredspace bar stops play01:20
fsmithredI never use keyboard with audacity. What else can it do?01:20
systemdletewhat happens if you hit F1?01:21
systemdletethat did nothing on mine01:21
fsmithredyeah, nothing01:21
systemdletetry selecting just a portion of the audio or video and save it01:21
fsmithredwhat should it do?01:22
fsmithredI already selected, copied and pasted into a new file01:22
systemdletenow try playing it01:22
systemdleteit should play just what you selected01:23
fsmithredyeah, it all works01:23
systemdletefsmithred:  When I saved, it saved the entire file!01:23
fsmithredI never save projects01:23
fsmithredI export to an audio file01:24
systemdletenot project, just the file01:24
fsmithredI've never gotten it to save a file01:25
fsmithredan audio file I mean01:25
systemdleteoh crud01:25
fsmithredsave project is the only 'save' function01:25
systemdleteI thought it had an option to save just the file.  Then that makes sense01:25
systemdleteok, let me try that.01:25
fsmithredsimilar to gimp01:25
systemdletemy duh.01:26
fsmithredand when I close a file, it asks to save, and I always say NO01:26
fsmithredthat's also standard procedure at the radio station I help out01:27
systemdleteok, so I select the section of the audio I want, but export is disabled?01:27
fsmithredselect, Edit-copy, File-new, Edit-paste01:27
fsmithredthen export from the new file01:27
systemdletecopy is disabled too01:27
fsmithredmaybe re-select your selection01:28
fsmithredthat's weird01:28
systemdleteI click on the point on the graphic where my selection starts and drag right to the end01:29
systemdletethat's select I thought01:29
systemdletethere's a double-headed arrow showing the begin/end01:29
fsmithredif you hit the play button, just that segment should play01:29
systemdleteit does01:29
fsmithredno arrows here, just white background on the selection01:29
systemdletebut the export and the edit options are disabled01:29
fsmithredarrows are in the timer bar above the wave01:30
systemdletesorry, yes.01:30
systemdlete(I figure you are expert at this)01:30
fsmithredI don't do it often, but I've been doing it a long time01:30
systemdleteyou say "white background" -- mine is sort of that ugly grey default color01:31
fsmithredand winamp before linux01:31
fsmithredthunder is coming01:31
systemdleteanother thing:  At the bottom, "Selection Start:" and the other counters do not reflect my selections01:31
systemdleteNot sure if that matters01:32
fsmithredmine do01:32
systemdleteso mine are not updating... the DE I am using?01:32
fsmithredxfce here01:32
fsmithredcinnabar theme01:32
systemdletepreferences is greyed out also?01:33
fsmithredI have ugly gray bg on unselected areas, white on selected01:33
systemdleteI am donig SOMETHING wrong01:33
fsmithredyours is broken01:33
fsmithredHelp, About   2.2.201:34
systemdleteI didn't mean to, honestly... :D01:34
systemdleteYou may have nailed it01:34
systemdleteI just installed it today01:34
fsmithredyeah, there were some problems with 2.1.something01:34
systemdletelike, an hour ago01:35
fsmithredin beowulf?01:35
systemdleteyou told me you are ascii also01:35
fsmithredcheck backports01:35
fsmithredif not, I have 2.2.1 packaged for ascii01:38
systemdletenah.  not in ascii-backports01:38
fsmithredaudacity and audacity-data01:38
fsmithredactually, the one you have should not be as broken as it is01:39
systemdleteI will un-break it then...01:39
fsmithredmaybe move ~/.audacity-data and maybe reinstall the packages01:40
fsmithredor purge and reinstall01:40
fsmithreddid roo^y ever reboot?01:42
fsmithredI'm gonna be afk soon01:42
systemdletefsmithred:  what should my "deb" line look like in /etc/apt/sources.list.d/refracta?01:43
systemdleteit croaks on it01:43
roo^yi'll shutdown soon. coming up 10am thurs in Australia ..bit past my bed time01:43
fsmithredsystemdlete, that file should not exist01:44
fsmithreddoes it???01:44
systemdleteno, I'm creating it.  No?01:44
fsmithredthere is no refracta repo01:45
fsmithredjust devuan01:45
systemdletehow do I install the 2.2.1 version?01:45
systemdletedownload and dpkg -i ?01:45
fsmithreddownload the debs in the link I provided01:45
fsmithredyeah dpkg -i01:45
systemdletethanks fsmithred -- that works, and really made a big difference.  Everything seems to just work with this newer version.02:38
NematocystI don't know how to get my new beowulf installation to boot.  I installed grub to the same ext4 partition, but windows just comes up as if devuan wasn't there, no grub menu06:01
gnarfaceNematocyst: install grub to the MBR of the primary boot disk06:02
gnarfaceNematocyst: (that's where the Windows one is currently)06:02
Nematocystis that possible with UEFI?  I'm afraid all this gpt and UEFI is mysterioius to me.  i'm used to the other method06:03
gnarfaceit's possible with UEFI but secure boot might sabotage you if enabled (bios design dependent)06:03
Nematocystso booting the live DVD again, opening a command prompt, i do: grub-install /dev/nvme0n1p2 (efi), or /dev/nvme0n1, or /dev/nvme0 ?06:13
Nematocystthe system is /dev/nvme0n1p4 (ext4) and /dev/nvme0n1p5 (swap)06:16
gnarfaceif Nematocyst comes back, someone tell him it's probably /dev/nvme0 but now the naming convention is throwing me for a loop too so i'm not sure07:46
gnarfacei would guess /dev/nvme0 first.  it's definitely not /dev/nvme0n1p2, /dev/nvme0n1p4, or /dev/nvme0n1p5.  /dev/nvme0n1 shouldn't exist as far as i know so that's what is throwing me for a loop.  I guess i don't know enough about nvme devices... could there be two separate disks on the same physical device?07:48
gnarfaceseems possible i've just never heard of it done that way except on cheesy USB flash card adapters07:49
roo^yJust booted Beowulf after installing update packages. I let it idle, & assume the black screen it went to, was the screensaver it's set to after 10mins. It would not "wake up" from this state, so I used Ctrl Alt Backspace to kill X, back to the login screen. I have now disabled screensaver. (Mele PCG35 Apo)08:58
gnarfaceroo^y: that was the one you were worried maybe it was video card failure?  turns out to be a power management state issue after all?09:06
gnarfaceroo^y: (unfortunately a common outcome - for some reason video card drivers and a slew of USB devices fail to sleep properly)09:07
roo^ySame pc^09:07
gnarfaceit's hard to say if it's the actual screen blanking that is the problem, or if it's just the coincidental sleep that happens right afterwards09:07
roo^yI see09:08
gnarfacescreen blanking has been safe for me more often than sleep09:08
gnarfacebut neither have 100% clean track record here09:08
gnarfacesince the default configurations do both at about the same time you have to be paying close attention to be sure which is the culprit09:08
roo^yYeah, the first it happened yesterday, I'm pretty sure it was active, typing out a comment for IRC09:10
gnarfacehmmm.  if you were typing, that should have counted as active, but it's not a guarantee in all cases if your input device is weird09:14
gnarface(like if it were a bluetooth device that showed up as both a keyboard and a gamepad, you could have been typing on it as a keyboard but still being ignored by the powermanagment's "activity" monitors)09:15
gnarface(somewhat rare though unless it's actually a gamepad)09:15
gnarface(or if you had a "main" keyboard already attached prior)09:16
gnarfacebut if that were an issue, you'd probably have noticed other stuff like it blanking the screen while you're typing or playing video games09:16
gnarfacebut it's seeming right now like just some problem with the driver failing to wake up from a dpms suspend/off state09:18
gnarfacewhich is definitely something that has happened before with many drivers09:18
roo^yOk, it's a USB keyboard, plugged into A USB hub09:35
gnarfaceoh interesting, i wonder if the USB hub is interfering somehow09:37
gnarfaceyou could try making a custom xorg.conf snippet to explicitly assign that keyboard as the corekeyboard for X, which afaik should be happening automatically but can't be sure of09:38
roo^ybefore beowulf, i've been in a habit of using 'xset dpms force off' i think, to kill screen while i sleep or go away ..i'll have to check if it wakes from that09:40
roo^yonly ran 'xset dpms force off' experiment for a few seconds for my monitor light to change to standby color, then i woke it. If problems persist, 2 experiments can be to plug mouse & KB directly in. Also test HW by booting into ASCII & see if it's still trouble free09:50
gnarfaceroo^y: could be related to something else running in the background.  i've noticed that in particular, mplayer, firefox, and blizzard games played through wine all have on their own a very high chance to lockup the nvidia official xorg driver at the moment dpms kicks in, especially if there's a screensaver running too10:57
gnarfaceroo^y: this bug has persisted through multiple generations of nvidia cards, multiple versions of nvidia drivers, multiple kernels, multiple linux distros, across over a decade for me, though it's conclusively a bug in the nvidia driver itself that nothing else seems to expose except the system sleep state10:58
gnarfaceroo^y: (if it never happens while sleep and dpms are disabled, then after a few years you'll know)10:59
gnarfaceroo^y: (just try not to burn your screen instead)10:59
roo^yok. I think this Mele is all intel11:02
gnarfaceroo^y: yea, i know it's not an "apples-to-apples" comparison, i just wanted to cite that such bugs can exist, and are really difficult to diagnose because they come from a rare, difficult-to-reproduce interaction between the driver and multiple programs11:03
roo^yi see11:03
gnarfacei would say be suspicious of anything using opengl or hardware video decoding11:04
gnarfacesince in general those are the driver features that seem the most fraught with weird/rare stability issues11:04
gnarfacebut almost nothing freezes a dumb framebuffer with unaccelerated 2g graphics anymore11:05
gnarfacealso if it's an intel chip, depending on the model, you may have the choice between the kms "modesetting" driver or the native intel one.  they will have different performance but i can't predict which will be better for you.  they may have different reliability, too.11:06
roo^ycool, i could look at that too, thanks11:07
roo^ywhen using the lsmod command, the last entry for modules is 'video', with 'i915' in it's comment section. So the native intel driver would be loaded, & I'd have the option to try the kms modesetting driver to troubleshoot issues in future11:52
gnarfaceroo^y: you'll have to examine the Xorg log to be sure it's being actually used.  the kernel might load it even if Xorg doesn't use it11:55
gnarfaceroo^y: your Xorg log should be at either /var/log/Xorg.0.log or i think ~/.local/share/xorg/Xorg.0.log11:55
gnarfaceroo^y: (varies depending on configuration)11:56
roo^ythe tech side seems like a very deep never-ending rabbit hole11:57
gnarfaceroo^y: i know, i know.  even if it's using the Intel one by default, there's a secondary issue to check on still, with regards to DRI2 or DRI3 (usually defaults to DRI2 but in some cases DRI3 is better)11:58
gnarfaceroo^y: you should take heart that there's still options to explore though11:59
gnarfaceroo^y: consider that long before this phase, with Windows your options were: 1) reinstall 2) buy another computer 3) pray12:00
brocashelmand a wangblow$ reinstall takes fucking 1-2 hours total and might still fail12:01
brocashelmwhat a nightmare12:01
gnarfacebut i feel ya.  every driver&hardware combination is a unique and beautiful snowflake with it's own personalities and emergent behaviors depending on the ambient room temperature and power line quality.  after a while you get a feel for your stuff though and know what types of things to avoid.12:01
brocashelma typical gnu/linux installer takes 20 minutes at most if you know what you're doing12:02
gnarfaceyea, that's really interesting that the windows installer still takes the same amount of time that it did in the 90's despite a 2000% increase in computing power12:03
gnarfacebut we're starting to drift off topic now, and it's my fault, sorry12:04
zatumilmaybe you are more like directx and vulkan
kreyrenAnyone willing to help me with SMTP configuration? (#postfix is inactive atm) --
gnuworldorderGreetings all19:34
gnuworldorderI'm having a problem with a newer ryzen laptop, xorg (xrandr) doesn't see my external hdmi out... I have all the amd/radeon drivers installed.... any tips/tricks I am unaware of?19:35
gnuworldorderxrandr -q just returns screen 0 and thats it19:35
stiltrIt doesn't even show info for the built-in screen?19:42
gnuworldorderxrandr: Failed to get size of gamma for output defaultScreen 0: minimum 1920 x 1080, current 1920 x 1080, maximum 1920 x 1080default connected 1920x1080+0+0 0mm x 0mm   1920x1080     77.00*19:44
gnuworldorderlistproviders says number 019:45
gnuworldorderadn I do have firmware-linux-nonfree installed19:46
gnuworldorderI was thinking about testing something other than xfce but not sure if that would help19:46
gnuworldordergonna try that real fast19:49
stiltrI wouldn't think the de would be the problem, but I don't really know what the problem is either...19:54
brocashelmwith chimaera (testing), noticing that i get graphical glitches when switching to a new tty screen (from xorg), and have already had two random/sudden system crashes without a way to do a soft reboot (that i know of)20:23
brocashelmwhen the system freezes, my keyboard is unusable20:24
brocashelmlet's see. just updated firmware-amd-graphics (tried to go without non-free/contrib since install) and will analyze performance20:54
fsmithredbrocashelm, you know magic sysrq keys?21:10
brocashelmnot familiar21:24
golinuxYou should check it out.  Very handy function when needed21:33
golinuxSearch for reisub21:34
fsmithredset kernel.sysrq=1 in /etc/sysctl.conf to enable all of them21:35
fsmithredoh, already done in refracta21:35
fsmithredand the gentoo wiki page I linked is incomplete. There are more key combinations.21:39
brocashelmah, i see21:42
brocashelmyeah, it was already like that for me21:43
brocashelmi just downgraded a few ceres packages i accidentally overwrote in place of chimaera21:43
brocashelmto correct dependencies21:43
JTechnohello friends, I've just installed ceres and to my surprise I can't switch from X to console using ctrl-alt-fx is this normal?23:20
golinuxReally?  What do you expect.  It is UNSTABLE!23:22
JTechnoit is indeed23:22
brocashelm"b-b-b-but i thought it was debian, the king of stable distros!" :D23:57
JTechnoI'm ashamed to say this but it was a keyboard problem23:58
brocashelmi say stick with chimaera if you really need newer stuff, since it has actually gotten stabler23:59

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