libera/#devuan/ Thursday, 2021-02-04

systemdletea/v problems on refracta beowulf VM, with all the latest updates applied.  webcam led comes on when running cheese, but no video appears.   For comparison, I tried this on an old ascii VM, and it works.08:18
systemdleteI cannot get the mic on the webcam to pick up sound; I tried testing the webcam at onlinemictest.com.08:19
systemdleteInterestingly, this same webcam USED to work, and still seems to, on ascii VM, and I may have had it work on a regular devuan beowulf VM at some point, but idk now.08:20
systemdleteI've gone into alsamixer (there is no pulseaudio on any system here, I made sure of that!) and set the mic select, made sure the mic gain was up, etc.  I'm pretty sure it LOOKS like it is in order, but it doesn't work.08:21
systemdleteOh.  New mainboard since it last worked, so that might be related.  But I'd hope not.  I checked the system logs and saw no sign of a problem.08:22
systemdletedang.  I just noticed some errors after all... let me investigate.08:23
systemdleteah!  that's it.08:23
systemdletehttps://bbs.archlinux.org/viewtopic.php?id=25913408:24
systemdleteNarrowing it down:  The webcam works fine on the ascii host, but not in any of the VMs I've tried.  Again, in the VMs, the led comes on when I fire up cheese.  On the host, I'll see a video of me, but not when I run it in a guest.08:42
systemdlete(and, no, I am not trying to run them at the same time on the host and guest!)08:42
systemdleteThose error messages still appear in the messages log, but on the host, it doesn't seem to matter.  cheese still works.08:43
xinomilof*cking great...:  "wontfix" attitude established in debian for good... https://lists.debian.org/debian-ctte/2021/02/msg00008.html11:05
Wonkaxinomilo: well yeah, they've been removing sysvinit scripts left and right for some time now11:09
msiismI've discovered a little problem with my Bash prompt since the upgrade to Beowulf. And that problem is that it will expand the tilde symbolizing $HOME as soon as you change directories. See https://paste.debian.net/plainh/849ab27e16:51
nemohuh... WFM16:52
nemo${debian_chroot:+($debian_chroot)}\u@\h:\w\$16:52
nemowhich is probably the default16:52
msiismIt even does that when I use `cd ~`.16:53
nemoworked even when I copied your PS1 from your pastebin16:53
nemomsiism: what version of bash?16:53
nemobash --version16:53
nemoGNU bash, version 5.0.3(1)-release (x86_64-pc-linux-gnu)16:53
msiismnemo: Yeah, I remember that. root's ~/.bashrc on this system has this and it doesn't have the problem.16:53
msiismnemo: 5.0.3(1)-release16:53
nemoso... something in your bashrc?16:54
msiismnemo: Well, I deliberately set PS1 to \u@\h:\w\$ a while back and that worked just fine.16:54
msiismLet me try the default.16:55
n4diri'd also grep for PS1 in home. Perhaps you got it somewhere else16:59
msiismIn home?16:59
n4dirthe hidden configs in hoe16:59
n4dirdamn: home16:59
msiismWell, let me move my own ~/.bashrc out of the way for a second…16:59
n4dirprobably something like grep -r PS1 .[!.]* ; something like that17:00
msiismHa, it still occurs with my ~/.bashrc not being read at all.17:00
n4dirtook me ages to figure out Void didn't use .bashrc (or was it .profile)? Something like that i would check17:00
n4dirwhat bash related is to be found in home, thats what i would investigate. Good luck, sounds shitty17:01
msiismn4dir: You probably mean ~/.profile vs. ~/.bash_profile.17:01
msiismBut you can really choose which one to use.17:01
n4diryeah, such17:01
msiismSo, what do I do now…17:02
msiismWell, maybe look into the system-wide configuration.17:02
n4dirgrep for PS1 won't hurt. But if everything which happened was an upgrade ...17:02
msiismI'm not setting PS1 in ~/.profile, though. (And I don't use ~/.bash_profile.17:03
nemomsiism: what about .bashrc ?17:30
msiismI've moved my .bashrc out of the way already. Same result.17:30
msiismAnd the things in /etc/ are all vanilla Debian configs because I upgraded by reinstalling.17:31
n4dirwell, if this is a new installation and you didn't copy configs around and there is no chance there is a weird config somewhere, then there is no need to grep for anything. I would do it to be sure to have that out of the way17:32
msiismLet me try without reading ~/.profile, just to be sure.17:33
n4diri sure ran in it two or three times a config i didn't have in mind got in my way.17:33
n4dirlike usual: adduser testuser; see if he has the same problem17:34
n4dirwell; what i would do is probably: PS1=' $' and call it a day. :-)17:34
n4diraliases. Aliases to a lot of weird shit too17:36
n4dirand obivously: ask in #bash or if one of the masters is around in #linux. What get's sourced when for bash is quite complex and confusing, as far it's me17:37
msiismI don't have a lot of aliases. Just 15 of them.17:37
n4dirnot saying any of that is your problem, i doubt that. But i ran in what i said the last weeks with others.17:38
n4diras in: shooting obvious ideas17:38
msiismFor example: alias cls='clear'17:40
msiismSo, there's something that DOS did do better, after all. :)17:40
n4diri think we can agree that one is not the source of the problem :-)17:40
n4dirif "testuser" has the same problem, it is in the systemwide settings or a bug or such. If he hasn't, it must be a config somewhere in ~17:41
msiismProbably not.17:41
msiismRight.17:41
msiismLet's see.17:41
msiismOkay, primary user does not have the problem. 8|17:41
n4dirOh. So it should be a config or such in ~, right?17:42
msiismNow this is funny.17:43
Guest64hey after a recent update it seems like wicd was removed, so my internet doesn't work17:46
Guest64i had issues resolving from deb.devuan.org17:46
gnarfaceGuest64: which release?17:49
msiismHm… this doesn't seemt to be related to ~/.bashrc at all. I just copied the file from the other use that didn't have the problem and ran a session using it with my current user. Same result.17:49
n4dirthis will be time-consuming and not much fun. been there.17:50
Guest64ceres17:50
n4diranything unusual regarding the logging in?17:50
Guest64no17:50
n4direlse i'd assume all related should be found with ls .bash* and ls .profile*17:51
gnarfaceGuest64: packages disappearing temporarily from ceres is not very uncommon, i would just wait a day or two it'll probably come back17:51
Guest64hm17:51
n4dirsome come up with the idea to put stuff in .local17:51
Guest64i will check out .profile17:51
Guest64i use dash as my main shell17:52
msiismGuest64: I think n4dir was talking to me.17:52
Guest64oh ok17:52
Guest64lol17:52
n4dirGuest64: i was speaking to msiism . Sorry if  i screwed it17:52
msiism:)17:52
n4dirbig sorry17:52
gnarfaceGuest64: i doubt that dash is your issue here, though, completely separately, i really don't recommend using it for a login shell17:53
Guest64why not?17:53
gnarfaceGuest64: the description of your problem statistically is more likely to match a issue on the repo end you have no control over17:54
Guest64yeah i think it's probably a wicd issue bc w3m and dig don't work very well17:54
Guest64ok17:54
Guest64so i should just wait for the ceres repo to get sorted?17:54
gnarfaceprobably17:55
Guest64i should be able to change to a mirror then right?17:55
Guest64if there are any17:55
gnarfacedeb.devuan.org should already be pointing to all the mirrors; it's a dns round-robin17:55
Guest64oh17:55
gnarfaceif you just try again you'll get a different one17:55
Guest64i've tried a few times and the issue comes with resolving deb.devuan.org17:56
Guest64so i assume i'll have to bear without internet17:56
Guest64which isn't a big deal17:56
gnarfacewell, if wicd got removed, it probably took your network with it, but you don't need wicd to get a network connection17:56
gnarfaceyou just need to reconfigure your network manually, or install one of the other gui network config tools17:57
Guest64ok17:57
onefangSelecting a mirror manually from https://pkgmaster.devuan.org/mirror_list.txt might help.17:57
gnarfacethe old wicd package you were using might still be in /var/cache/apt/ too17:57
gnarfacethough it's a long shot17:58
Guest64onefang, that's what i thought initially but apparently deb.devuan.org will point to mirrors anyways17:58
onefangdeb.devuan.org only points to some of those mirrors.17:58
msiismn4dir: I've created another new user. That user didn't have the problem. This is beginning to be strange.17:59
n4dirmsiism: i would ask in #bash. And be it only for the chance to get all the love of greycat18:00
msiismn4dir: It's kind of a rule for me not to visit #bash, though.18:00
n4dirnah. Well. You will get it sorted. The time consuming is the shitty part18:01
msiismYeah, I'll put the new findings in my notebook. Will poke at it again later.18:01
gnarfacemsiism: it couldn't be expanding to match some other directory you forgot you left in /home/ or /etc/passwd, could it?18:07
msiismgnarface: How do you mean, exactly?18:09
msiismecho-ing $HOME gives the correct result.18:09
msiismOh, I get it.18:10
gnarfacemsiism: i don't know how, exactly.  but my suspicion is that if you actually look, it would be obvious if i'm right or not18:10
gnarfaceunless you have like a thousand users or something...18:11
gnarfaceusually i only have 118:11
msiismOhoh…18:11
msiismFound it, I think.18:11
msiismYeah, welcome to Unix…18:11
msiismgnarface: https://paste.debian.net/plainh/8b180b7d18:14
john2Upgraded to chimaera, xfce 4.16 seemed to be acting up a little bit. The regular application menu says it unexpectedly left the panel and when I press execute, the dialog box comes up again. (At least the whisker menu works though) On the Desktop certain icons like home, Trash and file system won't function normally but the file manager works18:14
msiismThere were some remnants from when I tested how solely numeric user names will break things on Unix-like systems.18:14
msiismThis is in /home18:15
gnarfacemsiism: also check the contents of /etc/passwd - directories defined in there as home directories i think also get ~-expanded18:15
gnarface(not all of them will be in /home, or even exist, necessarily)18:15
Guest64john2 do your desktop icons have parts of themselves cropped out? i'm on ceres and i just noticed this today18:16
gnarfacedon't paste it in herw18:16
gnarfacehere*18:16
john2I'm not sure about cropped out18:16
msiismgnarface: Sure. I mean, those things should all have been wiped when I installed this system. I only left /home intact.18:16
john2they look normal they just don't function18:16
Guest64xfce might keep logs18:17
Guest64i know lxde did that18:17
john2I hear this may be a debian problem too18:17
msiismgnarface: Okay, I had to fix two things in /etc/passwd as well. Thanks for the pointer.18:33
msiismIt works now.18:33
msiismMakes me wonder, though, because I used adduser to create that user with no unusal parameters as far as I recall.18:34
gnarfaceno problem18:36
gnarfacei could only speculate really18:37
gnarfaceonce you start to see large enough chunks of the pattern, you can just predict where the gaps will appear18:37
John2alright if by cut off you mean the dock icons, right click, click properties and adjust the size up18:37
John2I fixed my issue by manually updating xfce packages18:38
msiismgnarface: :)18:38
Guest64John2 thanks, i fixed my issue with lxde by doing the same but i thought your packages were up-to-date, so i didn't mention that18:40
John2I thought it would've done it automatically with apt update and apt upgrade18:40
John2but I had to read which packages were kept back18:41
Guest4is there anything similar to udev in devuan? i'm trying to do manual wifi config for ethernet20:25
Guest4*network config20:25
john2whenever I try to start rc-service, bash says command not found20:27
john2im on openrc20:27
john2john2:i also tried /etc/init.d but that didn't seem to work either20:28
john2start-stop-daemon: not found20:45
masonGuest4: eudev, but manual wifi config should be possible with just ifupdown.20:46
Guest4ok20:47
masonGuest4: You'll want to make sure you have any necessary firmware packages. For instance, on my laptop I need firmware-iwlwifi.20:47
Guest4so lspci -v works right?20:47
masonGuest4: And you'll want to make sure you have wpasupplicant. Not thinking there's much else that won't be pulled in automatically.20:48
masonGuest4: Works on my T420. Shows me my wifi, and its loaded driver.20:48
Guest4alr20:48
gnarfaceGuest4: have you read the release notes?  make sure you're not running into the permission backend conflict with your login manager issue21:05
gnarfaceGuest4: you shouldn't be missing udev functionality.  it should be there, whether it's named udev, systemd-udevd, or eudev21:05
Guest4ok21:05
Guest4i wasn't sure bc devuan doesn't use systemd21:05
gnarfaceGuest4: yea it doesn't, but some jerks renamed udev "systemd-udevd" anyway21:05
Guest4i didn't get an error was just reading the archwiki for help21:06
gnarfaceGuest4: (the primary reason why it got a fork to eudev was just to rename it)21:06
gnarfaceyou'll still need wpasupplicant if you're using wireless21:08
gnarfaceonce started up, all this stuff should work the same on devuan as debian21:08
gnarfacesome configs will just be in different places maybe for certain things... like if you're not using dhcp then i think you'll still need a /etc/resolv.conf or the resolvconf package21:10
gnarface(systemd i think absorbed that config file on debian)21:10
gnarfacebut anything that didn't get replaced should function more or less the same on devuan as it did before systemd in debian21:11
gnarface- to the point that often just looking up old Wheezy documentation is sufficient where the devuan documentation is missing21:11
Guest4i believe i used dhcp the first time i installed but wicd is gone bc i was stupid21:12
Guest4i think i have a resolv.conf21:12
gnarfacea dhcp client will auto-generate a resolv.conf for you, so you won't have to mess with it.  this is just in case you end up doing manual configuration21:14
gnarfaceall things being equal, it's actually usually much easier to do a manual configuration once you know how to do it both ways21:14
Guest4alright21:19
Guest4thanks21:19

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