search_social | Hello normally the devuan installer gives me a choice to format partitions as ext2, ext3, or ext4 but at the moment it is only giving me a choice of ext2. It also has a black background instead of the normal blue background. Can anyone think why that would be? | 04:10 |
---|---|---|
gnarface | wrong installer iso? | 04:24 |
gnarface | usually you'd see a lot more than just ext* too | 04:24 |
gnarface | never heard of it doing this as some sort of failure case | 04:25 |
gnarface | but try it in text and expert mode to be sure | 04:25 |
xrogaan | yeah, make sure you got the right ISO. Checksum and all | 04:28 |
search_social | It happens when I run the iso as a (loop) device from grub, but the same iso not as a loop device works | 04:38 |
search_social | okay nevermind it actually happened because i didn't run "load components from cdrom" | 04:43 |
mason | search_social: That bit me recently. | 04:43 |
DocScrutinizer05 | wild guess: missing fs driver kernel modules? | 05:19 |
DocScrutinizer05 | unlikely, particularly since `man ext4` | 05:25 |
search_social | DocScrutinizer05: it was fixed by choosing the "load components from cdrom" menu option | 05:37 |
iv4nshm4k0v | I'd guess that it's the /installer/ modules that were missing, until loaded. | 05:39 |
adhoc | evening all | 05:44 |
adhoc | has anyone been working with Kubernetes on Devian 3.x ? | 05:45 |
adhoc | installing Docker and Kubernetes seems to go ok, Docker "works" for values of running the hello-world test. | 05:46 |
adhoc | Kubernetes does not detect systemd and fails out... | 05:46 |
adhoc | this thread suggests using openrc; https://github.com/kubernetes/minikube/issues/6954 | 05:48 |
adhoc | but that does not seem to work either | 05:55 |
xrogaan | does it run on freebsd? If it does, then it should run on devuan. | 07:15 |
gnarface | there's no reason for them to take out the hook that calls "/etc/init.d/kubernetes" or whatever | 07:16 |
gnarface | that's just vandalism | 07:16 |
gnarface | they don't have to provide a script for every distro | 07:16 |
gnarface | team fortress 2 sure as hell doesn't | 07:16 |
gnarface | pretending like they don't know of any such platforms is pretty rich too | 07:17 |
gnarface | i'd check to see if it still works in gentoo, then maybe check into difference between gentoo's and debian's openrc setup | 07:18 |
gnarface | but i note that comment thread ends with someone basically saying that the assumption it works had never been tested | 07:18 |
gnarface | (and honestly, i'd expect disappointment if the result turned out to be that it did) | 07:19 |
adhoc | there are plenty of threads suggsting tha openrc is supported, however it currently does not. | 07:20 |
adhoc | Something that just occured to me is that I installed the Debian/Buster .deb files. | 07:21 |
gnarface | well is it in the repos? | 07:21 |
adhoc | I wonder if there is something Debian and systemd specific in those packages, becaue everything else seems to be a second class citizen there now days | 07:21 |
gnarface | it's possible, but it should be in the list of bannedpackages if so | 07:22 |
adhoc | there seems to be a devuan unstable and 4.0 in the kubernetes build system for an older version, but it fails | 07:22 |
adhoc | oh? where do I look for these banned packages? | 07:23 |
gnarface | http://packages.devuan.org/bannedpackages.txt this might be it | 07:23 |
gnarface | it is shorter than i reemmber | 07:23 |
adhoc | did not know that existed | 07:23 |
gnarface | remember* | 07:23 |
adhoc | do not really understand what that is for ? | 07:24 |
adhoc | packages not to pull from Debian ? | 07:24 |
gnarface | doesn't matter, it's not on there | 07:24 |
adhoc | ok | 07:24 |
adhoc | tomcat9 ! | 07:25 |
gnarface | that means you're right, it's supposed to work | 07:25 |
gnarface | but it also should be installable through the devuan mirrors | 07:25 |
gnarface | so make sure of that first | 07:25 |
gnarface | and do that | 07:25 |
onefang | Packages Devuan excludes from being pulled from Debian. | 07:25 |
adhoc | onefang: ta. | 07:25 |
adhoc | ok, so the kubernetes packages come from their own repos | 07:25 |
gnarface | i see, so then this is vandalism | 07:26 |
gnarface | but also vandlism of their own product | 07:26 |
gnarface | vandalism* | 07:26 |
adhoc | https://repology.org/project/kubernetes/information | 07:26 |
gnarface | so there isn't much you can do but fork it yourself | 07:26 |
gnarface | well, i suppose you could try social engineering too | 07:26 |
gnarface | good luck | 07:27 |
gnarface | i don't see any evidence they're taking the complaint seriously, nor that they have any intent to | 07:27 |
adhoc | basically the only options I have is to blow away the stack of devuan machines and install debian or centos | 07:27 |
gnarface | try a different container? | 07:28 |
gnarface | or did they actually manage to vendor lock-in you? | 07:28 |
adhoc | seems to be standard practice to say; insufficent user base | 07:28 |
adhoc | $WORK has moved that way | 07:28 |
onefang | We need bigger users to make a bigger user base. B-) | 07:28 |
adhoc | I want to get some practical experience with it at $HOME | 07:29 |
adhoc | onefang: heh | 07:29 |
adhoc | gnarface: vendor lock in is a nasty game, a race to the bottom of features and cost | 07:30 |
adhoc | anyhow, there are a couple of things I can try, like uninstalling all the kubernetes stuff, installing openrc, then trying again, in case it is doing some detection at install time. | 07:31 |
adhoc | thanks folks | 07:32 |
search_social | doesn't devuan have a fake systemd for something like login or something? | 07:38 |
onefang | Yes. | 07:41 |
onefang | Don't ask me the details though. | 07:41 |
search_social | okay now i can't "load components from cdrom" because it can't find the cdrom when the cdrom is a (loop) device from grub | 08:18 |
search_social | okay i can just manually mount the fat32 file system and then the iso within it by going to the Alt+F2 shell in the middle of the installer LOL | 08:25 |
kreyren | E: Unable to locate package glibc | 10:23 |
kreyren | how can i install glibc on devuan? x.x | 10:23 |
kreyren | i am using merged O.o | 10:23 |
kreyren | https://packages.debian.org/source/bullseye/glibc | 10:23 |
kreyren | O.o | 10:23 |
gnarface | glibc is definitely in devuan | 10:24 |
kreyren | apparently not | 10:24 |
kreyren | O.o | 10:24 |
onefang | I just did a search, glibc-doc, glibc-doc-reference, and glibc-source. | 10:25 |
kreyren | not glibc itself though | 10:26 |
adhoc | that link is the debian packages repo? | 10:26 |
gnarface | it's also a link to the url for the source package | 10:26 |
* kreyren is checking on docker | 10:26 | |
xinomilo | look for binary packages : https://tracker.debian.org/pkg/glibc | 10:27 |
adhoc | kreyren: I did that earlier today, and it worked | 10:27 |
xinomilo | glibc is the source | 10:27 |
* kreyren < https://matrix.org/_matrix/media/r0/download/matrix.org/NsuoNBWitcTDJRGfobzUxcUm/message.txt > | 10:27 | |
kreyren | o.o | 10:27 |
kreyren | binary package? what | 10:28 |
xinomilo | libc-bin or something.. there's no package call glibc.. not in debian either | 10:28 |
gnarface | libc6 | 10:28 |
gnarface | libc6* | 10:28 |
* kreyren it even more confused | 10:29 | |
gnarface | kreyren: run this: apt-cache search ^libc6 | 10:29 |
* kreyren < https://matrix.org/_matrix/media/r0/download/matrix.org/FDQdGqwpfawEePrsmunJwYYC/message.txt > | 10:30 | |
gnarface | i dunno if you're expecting me to click on that or what | 10:30 |
gnarface | but it's not gonna happen | 10:30 |
adhoc | apt list --installed | grep libc | 10:30 |
kreyren | eg so libc6-dev-amd64 - GNU C Library: 64bit Development Libraries for AMD64 | 10:30 |
kreyren | ? | 10:30 |
adhoc | that shows; libc-bin/stable,now 2.28-10 amd64 [installed] | 10:31 |
gnarface | kreyren: yes, that's "glibc" | 10:31 |
rrq | here's another clicky :) https://pkginfo.devuan.org/cgi-bin/policy-query.html?c=package&q=libc6 | 10:31 |
gnarface | kreyren: this used to confuse me too, but i guarantee that glibc is a part of every single linux distro | 10:31 |
kreyren | libc6-dev/testing,unstable,now 2.31-9 amd64 [installed,automatic] | 10:32 |
kreyren | ? | 10:32 |
adhoc | the source is called "glibc" the installed files are called "libc-..." for historical reasons (AFAICT) | 10:32 |
adhoc | kreyren: that would be the include files for the library | 10:32 |
gnarface | kreyren: you only need packages with "-dev" in the name for build dependencies, that one is optional | 10:32 |
kreyren | i am trying to solve https://github.com/leftwm/leftwm/issues/242 where upstream observed this issue when glibc is not installed on KISS linux suspecting same on devuan | 10:33 |
kreyren | x.x | 10:33 |
kreyren | so that would be libc6-dev right | 10:33 |
gnarface | uh... scanning that forum thread it's not clear you'd need the development headers package | 10:35 |
adhoc | the -dev file for the includes, yes. | 10:35 |
gnarface | i'm not sure how you're coming to that conclusion | 10:35 |
adhoc | I think that instance of; kreyren@dreamon:~$ apt list --installed glibc | 10:35 |
gnarface | the basic diagnosis (doesn't work because glibc is not installed) would also prevent basically everything else from working too | 10:35 |
kreyren | relevant: https://github.com/leftwm/leftwm/issues/242#issuecomment-801421472 | 10:35 |
kreyren | > I recall seeing a similar issue with KISS Linux because glibc was missing. | 10:36 |
adhoc | in that thread is misleading, when I run it it shows nothing, but it also shows nothing with any installed package too. | 10:36 |
gnarface | so the diagnosis doesn't seem to hold water | 10:36 |
kreyren | ah oke thanks | 10:36 |
gnarface | since it's unclear you'd ever be in this scenario naturally | 10:36 |
adhoc | if there was | grep libc on the end it would show something | 10:36 |
adhoc | I expect that if libc was missing the machine would not boot! | 10:37 |
kreyren | eh `apt list --installed glibc | grep libc` outputs blank? | 10:37 |
adhoc | The alternative is they are not using glibc, but perhaps another source? | 10:37 |
adhoc | apt list --installed | grep libc | 10:37 |
onefang | There are a few other libc , mostly used for embedded Linux development. | 10:38 |
gnarface | dietlibc and musl or something? | 10:38 |
onefang | Yep, and others. | 10:38 |
adhoc | try this; apt list --installed | grep libc-bin | 10:38 |
onefang | Also bionic in Android. | 10:38 |
kreyren | libc-bin/testing,unstable,now 2.31-9 amd64 [installed] | 10:38 |
adhoc | that looks sensible. | 10:39 |
adhoc | onefang: so wouyld they have an embedded libc that is not from glibc source? | 10:39 |
gnarface | i assume the one that's just called "libc6" would pull in any necessary dependencies but again... you should really have got them on install, so if you're missing them something else bad happened earlier that has not been considered in the diagnosis | 10:40 |
kreyren | ehh O.o | 10:40 |
kreyren | so can i say that glibc is installed, because libc-bin is installed? | 10:40 |
adhoc | a libc is indeed installed. | 10:41 |
kreyren | posted https://github.com/leftwm/leftwm/issues/242#issuecomment-801777315 | 10:42 |
kreyren | thanks for help ^-^ | 10:44 |
gnarface | kreyren: you still may be missing packages... i have way more than just one and not that one | 10:44 |
gnarface | kreyren: depends on what you're trying to do exactly i suppose | 10:44 |
kreyren | run the leftWM in slim or from tty using `dbus-launch leftwm` | 10:45 |
kreyren | because it fails to launch atm | 10:45 |
* kreyren is checking x11-dl crate | 10:46 | |
gnarface | i never launch x that way either, fyi | 10:47 |
gnarface | everything about what you're doing is suspicious and weird | 10:47 |
kreyren | how then? | 10:47 |
gnarface | "startx" | 10:47 |
kreyren | did that too same issue, was unable to capture logs | 10:47 |
gnarface | the logs have to go in /var/log/ or ~/.local/share/xorg/ | 10:48 |
kreyren | checking | 10:48 |
kreyren | `exec dbus-launch leftwmm` in xinitrc? | 10:48 |
gnarface | uh, no | 10:50 |
kreyren | o.o | 10:50 |
gnarface | no i made mine into a bash script | 10:50 |
kreyren | o.o | 10:51 |
gnarface | i don't use "exec" i just run the WM | 10:51 |
kreyren | what | 10:51 |
gnarface | full path to binary | 10:51 |
gnarface | /usr/bin/leftwm | 10:51 |
gnarface | or wherever | 10:51 |
kreyren | ~/.cargo/bin/leftwm | 10:52 |
gnarface | that might work but that's not the full path | 10:52 |
kreyren | replaced tilde with full path | 10:52 |
gnarface | i think it'll work actually give it a try | 10:52 |
kreyren | trying (killing X) | 10:52 |
kreyren | that gives me a black screen with a mouse cursor which i assume is leftwm -> Works? | 10:56 |
kreyren | kreyren@dreamon:~$ cat ~/.local/share/xorg/Xorg.0.log.old | ix | 10:56 |
kreyren | http://ix.io/2ThG | 10:56 |
gnarface | if you want me to look at the pastes use paste.debian.net | 10:56 |
gnarface | but the one called ".old" fyi is from the previous run not the current, so it's not super relevant | 10:57 |
gnarface | black screen with only a cursor sounds like X worked but the window manager did not | 10:57 |
kreyren | the previous run was on leftwm and then i switched to xfce4 | 10:57 |
gnarface | still... i'm not familiar with your window manager | 10:57 |
kreyren | https://paste.debian.net/1189811/ | 10:58 |
kreyren | <gnarface "still... i'm not familiar with y"> checking | 10:58 |
kreyren | based on README.md of the project it starts into a black screen | 10:59 |
gnarface | kreyren: well, nothing seems wrong with that other than the fact it's not even devuan and it's running systemd | 10:59 |
kreyren | it's devuan running sysvinit O.o | 10:59 |
gnarface | kreyren: black screen with only a cursor also strongly suggests X is working | 11:00 |
kreyren | afaik the systemd things in xorg are devuan way of handling the compatibility? | 11:00 |
kreyren | or maybe i am using a kernel made for debian? | 11:01 |
gnarface | kreyren: no, the line where it says that systemd-logind is taking over the session is kinda blowing your cover | 11:01 |
* kreyren < https://matrix.org/_matrix/media/r0/download/matrix.org/YKgZBmcCGVhPcBkCxDNJMSIl/message.txt > | 11:01 | |
gnarface | kreyren: either you've mixed debian packages in against instruction and stuff snuck in you weren't expecting, or you're straight up trolling me | 11:01 |
kreyren | i am not trolling! :( | 11:01 |
kreyren | i am using liquorix kernel so i assume that is putting in some systemd things? (the default kernel is causing my system to halt when sched is slightly overwhelmed consistent with other distros using fair sched) | 11:02 |
gnarface | kreyren: unfortunately neither of these issues actually explains what is going wrong, but you should try it on a devuan livecd to see if it behaves any better | 11:02 |
kreyren | or like i can boot devuan kernel O.o | 11:03 |
gnarface | kreyren: at this point the only thing that will help is a clean install. that kernel package probably pulled in systemd. | 11:03 |
kreyren | x.x | 11:03 |
gnarface | kreyren: (which incidentally is really bad behavior for a kernel package so you should double check it wasn't something else) | 11:03 |
kreyren | i don't see systemd in processes though | 11:04 |
kreyren | oh wait | 11:04 |
kreyren | nope | 11:04 |
* kreyren though that he got wrong xorg log | 11:04 | |
gnarface | you're sure you're logged into the right hardware too? | 11:05 |
kreyren | and nothing containing "systemd" is installed O.o | 11:05 |
kreyren | <gnarface "you're sure you're logged into t"> yes | 11:05 |
kreyren | this is not SSH session | 11:05 |
gnarface | other window managers work if you try this? | 11:05 |
gnarface | just not leftwm? | 11:05 |
kreyren | yes xfce4 works | 11:06 |
gnarface | the leftwm binary could be suspect, or it could just be choking on version mismatches. this type of failure also strongly fits the pattern of a mangled install | 11:06 |
gnarface | did you ever use debian mirrors for anything else? or 3rd party mirrors intended for debian? those are the mistakes. | 11:07 |
kreyren | let me try devuan kernel then i think it's from liquorix and devuan is making a compatibility to sysvinit fooling the xorg that it's systemd-logind | 11:07 |
kreyren | i have 3rd party mirrors for winehq, vscodium, riot-im, torproject and liquorix | 11:08 |
gnarface | that's a lot | 11:08 |
gnarface | that's a lot of risk | 11:08 |
kreyren | all of these seems to be optimized to not run on systemd though i was checking them x.x | 11:09 |
kreyren | xscreensaver-systemd is running though | 11:09 |
kreyren | which was pulled from devuan using the xfce4 session | 11:09 |
gnarface | well i dunno if you got some shim in there that's fooling it or actually systemd i just know i don't have it here and my xorg logs don't say that | 11:09 |
kreyren | interesting O.o let me check devuan kernel then brb | 11:09 |
gnarface | the mistake could have been made in your sources.list perhaps | 11:10 |
gnarface | since xscreensaver-systemd is not a devuan package | 11:10 |
gnarface | there's a lot of evidence of debian here | 11:10 |
gnarface | when you mix repos from 3rd parties you *really* gotta pay attention to what they slide in as dependencies | 11:11 |
kreyren | Still mentiones systemd-logind | 11:11 |
kreyren | O.o | 11:12 |
gnarface | trying it from a fresh install without all the 3rd party repos would be very informative. the devuan live cd might be a good secondary measure | 11:13 |
gnarface | i noticed leftwm isn't a devuan component either | 11:13 |
gnarface | are you using a binary for an older distro release? maybe that needs to be rebuilt against devuan versions of stuff | 11:13 |
kreyren | but they didn't slide in any systemd deps the xscreensaver is also from devuan checking the package agains apt-cache policy | 11:13 |
kreyren | O.o | 11:13 |
kreyren | <gnarface "i noticed leftwm isn't a devuan "> installed using cargo | 11:14 |
gnarface | oh, what's cargo? something that ignores apt and installs files anyway? | 11:14 |
gnarface | seems dangerous on it's own | 11:14 |
kreyren | it's rustlang's package manager it installs packages in home dir | 11:15 |
kreyren | it doesn't touch the system | 11:15 |
gnarface | hmm, interesting | 11:15 |
gnarface | and this is meant for debian buster? current stable? | 11:16 |
gnarface | and you think (thought) this was devuan beowulf you're trying it on? | 11:16 |
kreyren | it compiles for the system that it's running so in theory this is designed to work on anything turing complete | 11:16 |
kreyren | it requires the libs though if they are not implemented with the package x.x | 11:16 |
kreyren | this is devuan chimaera | 11:17 |
lts | Cargo/pip/npm/etc are pulling in unknown third party software, which pull in unknown third party software. You usually don't want them running unsandboxed | 11:17 |
djph | s/unsandboxed// :D | 11:18 |
kreyren | The software itself runs sandboxed, but it requires a read in libs | 11:18 |
fsmithred | I have the same line in my Xorg.0.log | 11:18 |
fsmithred | in pure devuan beowulf | 11:18 |
gnarface | hmmm | 11:19 |
gnarface | weird | 11:19 |
fsmithred | no | 11:19 |
fsmithred | not the same line | 11:19 |
kreyren | o.o | 11:19 |
kreyren | gnarface: maybe you are running the non-merged system? | 11:19 |
fsmithred | systemd-logind: logind integration requires -keeptty and -keeptty was not provided, disabling logind integration | 11:19 |
kreyren | o.o | 11:20 |
gnarface | mine's not quite like that but it fails similarly (something about missing service files) | 11:20 |
djph | fsmithred: ew, why is systemd-logind running on beowulf? | 11:20 |
fsmithred | kreyren, there is no non-merged system | 11:20 |
gnarface | kreyren's shows systemd-logind taking over the session at multiple points | 11:20 |
djph | oh. | 11:20 |
gnarface | i assume some of them are waking up from sleep? | 11:20 |
fsmithred | ps shows no systemd running | 11:20 |
kreyren | i meant the deb.devuan.org/devuan not using the merged repos | 11:20 |
fsmithred | kreyren, there's no system there | 11:21 |
fsmithred | only a couple hundred packages | 11:21 |
kreyren | o.o | 11:21 |
kreyren | ah oke | 11:21 |
fsmithred | and half of them are task-language | 11:21 |
kreyren | also it says "Distributor: Debian" in Xfce4 | 11:21 |
fsmithred | where in xfce? | 11:22 |
kreyren | xfce4-about | 11:22 |
* kreyren uploaded an image: (73KiB) < https://matrix.org/_matrix/media/r0/download/matrix.org/CJAREpoykySoekOkkTySrVFD/image.png > | 11:22 | |
kreyren | (xfce4 installed from netinstall of devuan) | 11:22 |
adhoc | on Devuan 4 no less | 11:22 |
fsmithred | I have no idea where to find xfce-about | 11:22 |
kreyren | ah sorry xfce4-about | 11:23 |
adhoc | when is chimaera due to be released? | 11:23 |
kreyren | wait i said that | 11:23 |
kreyren | eh x.x | 11:23 |
fsmithred | adhoc, buster is in freeze, so possibly by the end of this year | 11:24 |
adhoc | ok | 11:27 |
gnarface | oh i didn't realize it might be that soon | 11:27 |
* kreyren assumes that everything is fine then and goes to mess with leftwm in startx | 11:28 | |
adhoc | what is leftwm written in ? | 11:28 |
kreyren | Rust | 11:29 |
* kreyren figured out how to open element-desktop in leftwm | 11:29 | |
fsmithred | I said buster, but I meant bullseye. | 12:48 |
Xenguy | Have to run, but recent Debian chatter suggests that bullseye is getting ready | 14:01 |
Xenguy | fsmithred: ^^ | 14:01 |
Tenkawa | Xenguy: | 14:06 |
Tenkawa | 2021-03-12: Hard Freeze - for key packages and packages without autopkgtests (scheduled) Full Freeze date not yet determined. | 14:06 |
Tenkawa | Hard Freeze has already been set but it usually takes a month between Hard Freeze and release | 14:08 |
Tenkawa | if past release cycles hold true | 14:08 |
GyrosGeier | hi | 14:08 |
GyrosGeier | I have a server with serial-over-lan control | 14:09 |
GyrosGeier | so it's currently booting with systemd-boot because that works with the serial console | 14:10 |
GyrosGeier | is there a replacement that can boot an EFI system and supports serial console? | 14:10 |
Tenkawa | GyrosGeier: is it just a uart driven getty? | 14:11 |
Tenkawa | ie if the getty could be started with sysvinit to talk serial will that interface with the ethernet controller or do y ou need it going the other direction? | 14:12 |
Tenkawa | talking ethernet oout to serial | 14:13 |
Tenkawa | s/out//out | 14:13 |
Xenguy | Tenkawa: Thanks, and TTYL all | 14:16 |
DPA | After the bootloader, the serial console can be enabled in /etc/initab. | 14:27 |
DPA | Regarding other bootloaders with serial support, grub should be able to do that too: https://docs.fedoraproject.org/en-US/Fedora/21/html/System_Administrators_Guide/sec-GRUB_2_over_Serial_Console.html | 14:27 |
DPA | (update-grub instead of the mkconfig stuff) | 14:27 |
DPA | Speaking of grub, Is anyone going to do anything about the beowulf-security grub-efi-*-signed grub config prefix bug? | 14:27 |
Tenkawa | DPA: ouch... | 14:28 |
Tenkawa | thats a doozy | 14:28 |
* Tenkawa doesn't like any signing/security bugs | 14:33 | |
iv4nshm4k0v | FWIW, I configure serial console this way: 1. replace 1:2345:... getty tty1 entry in /etc/inittab with: con:2345:respawn:/sbin/sulogin; 2. boot kernel with console=ttyS0. | 14:35 |
iv4nshm4k0v | (Some VPS providers are nice enough to allow SSH access to their control interface and to the VM's serial port from that. Much more convenient than going through VNC IMO.) | 14:37 |
Tenkawa | almost everything I have either uses ssh or serial via uart | 14:38 |
* Tenkawa uses over 90% embedded devices that need uart consoles | 14:38 | |
* iv4nshm4k0v doesn't use anything "signed" | 14:40 | |
Tenkawa | iv4nshm4k0v: I "had" to back in my telecom and financial days | 14:41 |
Tenkawa | regulatory requirements | 14:41 |
Tenkawa | this is all hobby now | 14:41 |
iv4nshm4k0v | Well, I've meant $ apt-cache search -- -signed\$ specifically. I don't have anything against digital signatures /in general,/ just against the cases where the user may be locked out of his or her computer. | 14:43 |
Tenkawa | heheh for a home machine it is a bit much for most | 14:45 |
GyrosGeier | Tenkawa, when it's booted yes | 15:18 |
GyrosGeier | the issue is the bootloader itself | 15:18 |
GyrosGeier | the BIOS outputs to the serial port, and the kernel does | 15:18 |
GyrosGeier | but the boot menu would only go to the VGA card | 15:19 |
Tenkawa | GyrosGeier: yeah without a direct uart to the bios that is problematic | 15:24 |
Tenkawa | some of those servers have that though and then you would just need a adapter to get that on your network ie a network kvm | 15:26 |
GyrosGeier | it works with systemd-boot | 15:26 |
GyrosGeier | which just uses the UEFI console drivers | 15:26 |
Tenkawa | then you would be able to control it without os control at all | 15:26 |
GyrosGeier | hence my need for a replacement | 15:26 |
GyrosGeier | not an urgent need, since I can boot blindly, but if I ever have to change a kernel command line, I'd be lost | 15:27 |
iv4nshm4k0v | Well, I use Syslinux as the bootloader. It /does/ support prompting on the serial port. | 15:40 |
Tenkawa | yeah I use syslinux too | 15:42 |
Tenkawa | very flexible | 15:43 |
iv4nshm4k0v | I haven't tried Syslinux' EFI support, though. My impression was that non-mobile computers still provide a "legacy boot" option. I don't have any compelling reasons to consider EFI boot instead. (Much like I don't have any compelling reasons to consider Systemd, either.) | 15:43 |
Tenkawa | we use syslinux+efi on soc's in some of our images but grub + efi on x86 | 15:45 |
iv4nshm4k0v | Tenkawa: Right; no reason to use EFI when BIOS is available; but indeed makes sense to use the former in the absence of the latter. | 15:45 |
Tenkawa | some of our ubuntu soc users just wanted syslinux + efi instead of syslinux + mbr *shrug* | 15:48 |
Tenkawa | seems like adding complexity where its not needed but oh well | 15:48 |
onefang | Some of the more advanced syslinux stuff isn't available for EFI yet. Though that may have been fixed since last time I looked. | 15:49 |
Tenkawa | I'm doing a lot of devuan testing right now to see how its running | 15:49 |
iv4nshm4k0v | Tenkawa Any genius can make a simple solution; it takes a very fine grade of mediocrity to make things complex for a change. | 15:50 |
onefang | lol | 15:50 |
Tenkawa | iv4nshm4k0v: thats the thing too.. people tend to overcomplicate | 15:50 |
iv4nshm4k0v | onefang: Last time I've checked (late last year, I think?), Syslinux' Git repository had no commits for over a year. Frankly, that got me concerned. | 15:53 |
onefang | Just did a git pull on my copy of their source code, still no changes. | 15:57 |
Josh_2 | Hi, can I run OpenRC on Devuan? Do I have to do a custom install? | 17:27 |
Josh_2 | oh right It's literally in the installer xD | 17:37 |
Josh_2 | Okay my mind is made up, I will move to Devuan | 17:38 |
Josh_2 | wish me luck :P | 17:57 |
unixbsd | hi | 19:33 |
unixbsd | Do you know a possible Chess game that works and can be played with the Gamepad /dev/input...blabla? (regular gamepad on usb)? | 19:33 |
Hurgotron | unixbsd: https://github.com/fbergo/eboard mentions joysticks, but not USB. If you can do mapping of the keypad to keyboard keys it should work. | 19:42 |
Hurgotron | Stuff doesn't look very current, though. | 19:43 |
unixbsd | ah yeah I know eboard, I cannoot setup up joystick on it. | 19:45 |
unixbsd | well, seems we have no luck ... | 19:46 |
Hurgotron | what's the problem with setting up the joystick? | 19:47 |
unixbsd | I guess the easiest is to install PS2 emulator. I will check if pcsx ps2 works. | 19:50 |
unixbsd | maybe there are chess games on it. | 19:51 |
josh` | Hi, I just installed. Getting some minor annoyances, I have installed network-manager and its constantly asking for my root password.. | 20:14 |
josh` | I get asking once but everytime I click anything I'm asked | 20:14 |
fsmithred | make sure you're in the netdev group. It shouldn't do that. | 20:15 |
josh` | Okay thanks | 20:15 |
fsmithred | and I have to go, so I can't stay and help. | 20:15 |
fsmithred | bbl | 20:15 |
josh` | apparently my user is part of netdev group | 20:16 |
golinux | Josh . . . You didn't say which release you installed. There is a change of path in beowulf that might be an issue. Do read the release notes: https://files.devuan.org/devuan_beowulf/Release_notes.txt. | 20:44 |
josh` | Its Beowulf | 20:50 |
josh` | Is synaptic the gui package installer? | 20:51 |
josh` | now I gotta sort out this nvidia drivers problem | 21:11 |
josh` | https://plaster.tymoon.eu/view/2348#2348 this is the error I get when trying to install nvidia-drivers | 21:18 |
gnarface | josh`: use paste.debian.net if you want me to actually read your pastes. use the nvidia driver packages from the repo, not from nvidia.com | 22:39 |
gnarface | (if you have a recent card you'll probably need the kernel and driver packages from beowulf-backports instead) | 22:40 |
josh` | My card is a gtx 965m | 22:57 |
josh` | so its not particularly new | 22:57 |
josh` | gnarface: http://paste.debian.net/1189922/ | 22:58 |
gnarface | josh`: that might still count as new enough to need the backports stuff | 22:58 |
gnarface | josh`: something else is very wrong, it shouldn't want to drop all those packages just to install that driver unless you've messed up your sources.list | 22:59 |
gnarface | josh`: have you accidentally got two different versions of devuan in there? | 22:59 |
gnarface | josh`: maybe your system is just very out-of-date; try doing a "apt-get update && apt-get upgrade" first | 22:59 |
gnarface | nvidia-driver is already the newest version (418.181.07-1). | 23:00 |
gnarface | it says it's already installed, too | 23:00 |
gnarface | btw | 23:00 |
josh` | right so whats up with the error at the end? | 23:01 |
josh` | This is a brand new install from the iso | 23:01 |
gnarface | what? the part where it tries to install a deprecated package and then barfs on it? that also supports my hypothesis. the only thing so far that does not is the claim this is a brand new install. which iso did you use, exactly? | 23:01 |
josh` | Let me go see | 23:02 |
gnarface | also... none of this proves anything is actually not working in the already installed packages | 23:02 |
gnarface | are you experiencing missing features or performance issues? | 23:02 |
gnarface | or did you just try to do an update and wonder what's going on? | 23:03 |
josh` | this one https://mirror.leaseweb.com/devuan/devuan_beowulf/installer-iso/devuan_beowulf_3.1.0_amd64-netinstall.iso | 23:03 |
gnarface | alright, should be fine | 23:03 |
josh` | I'm not experiencing any problems it just there is clearly an error at the end | 23:03 |
josh` | I haven't tried to reboot to see if it is going to use nvidia | 23:03 |
gnarface | yea but i'm more disturbed about the part where it's about to throw your window manager overboard | 23:03 |
josh` | right | 23:04 |
gnarface | the nvidia thing doesn't look any more fucked up than normal | 23:04 |
josh` | xD | 23:04 |
gnarface | but why is it telling you that you're not using xfce anymore? | 23:04 |
gnarface | did you also change window managers before this? | 23:04 |
gnarface | something important is missing from your account of what happened here | 23:04 |
josh` | Nope | 23:04 |
josh` | I'm using the xfce that was installed by the install media | 23:05 |
josh` | I use xfce anyway so I kept the default | 23:05 |
gnarface | https://paste.debian.net/1189923/ | 23:05 |
gnarface | make sure your sources.list looks like this | 23:05 |
josh` | Okay | 23:05 |
gnarface | then run this, just for good measure: apt-get update && apt-get upgrade && apt-get dist-upgradse | 23:06 |
gnarface | sorry "dist-upgrade" on that last bit, not "upgradse" obviously | 23:06 |
gnarface | that should just make sure you have all your stuff current at least | 23:06 |
josh` | https://paste.debian.net/1189924/ | 23:06 |
josh` | thats mine | 23:06 |
gnarface | yea, don't do that | 23:07 |
gnarface | use mine | 23:07 |
gnarface | figure out why later | 23:07 |
josh` | okay I'll swap em | 23:07 |
gnarface | it shouldn't want to remove a bunch of stuff, it should only want to mostly upgrade everything | 23:08 |
gnarface | make sure though | 23:09 |
josh` | https://paste.debian.net/1189925/ thats the output of running the update command | 23:09 |
josh` | I swapped to your sources before hand obviously | 23:09 |
gnarface | yea, the nvidia-persistenced thing seems really annoying. you don't actually need that package though, so try to purge it first "apt-get --purge remove nvidia-persistenced" | 23:10 |
gnarface | then try the update command again | 23:10 |
josh` | okay done | 23:11 |
gnarface | did it work this time? | 23:11 |
josh` | the error is gone, but it still has the long list of 'no longer required' | 23:11 |
gnarface | ok here's the problem with that | 23:11 |
gnarface | only you can know if it's right or not | 23:11 |
josh` | ah I see | 23:11 |
josh` | well looks to me that most of it are just plugins I'm not using | 23:12 |
gnarface | ok | 23:12 |
gnarface | do you have a second machine you can come back into this IRC channel with if it goes all very wrong? | 23:12 |
josh` | yes | 23:12 |
josh` | but I have to go out now :( | 23:12 |
gnarface | alright, well let me know what happens when you get a chance to try it. it should be fine, i'm just disturbed by the amount of xfce (the default window manager) stuff that it wants to remove | 23:13 |
gnarface | but if you're not using xfce that's not very concerning | 23:13 |
josh` | Okay cool. Thanks for the help | 23:13 |
josh` | Well I am :P | 23:13 |
gnarface | well, usually after the upgrade everything sorts itself out | 23:13 |
gnarface | sometimes they rebundle stuff or whatever | 23:14 |
gnarface | you might complicated things by putting proposed-updates in there too early too | 23:14 |
gnarface | not sure | 23:14 |
Jjp137 | oh the proposed-updates being included is a bug in the 3.1.0 iso | 23:14 |
gnarface | and after the update i'm still not sure you'll have all the right nvidia packages | 23:14 |
gnarface | (libgl1-nvidia-glx gets left out often) | 23:14 |
gnarface | so this might take a couple steps to clean up | 23:15 |
gnarface | but if it was a fresh install then it shouldn't be too far gone | 23:15 |
golinux | Jjp137: Yes, we missed deleting proposed-updates after those packages had been moved to main | 23:17 |
golinux | We are to going release a 3.1.1 to fix that soon. | 23:18 |
Jjp137 | oh cool | 23:19 |
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