libera/#devuan/ Friday, 2023-05-26

rrqyes, if there's a problem due to having the wrong grub package installed it usually helps installing the right grub package00:00
rrqyou'll need to knwo which architecture and which bios variant (uefi or legacy)00:01
gnarfacerrq: does this error look familiar to you? https://paste.debian.net/1281166/00:02
latexwhich package do I need then?00:03
latexI got all of them00:03
latexthere should be some way to configure them right?00:03
rrqwhat's the architecture and what bios variant?00:03
latexx86_64-efi00:04
gnarfacei think you're literally not supposed to actually have all of them00:04
_ds_grub-efi is (probably) the only one which you need to install explicitly00:04
rrqinstall grub-efi-amd6400:04
gnarfacelatex: yea, try that^00:04
_ds_grub-efi:amd64 depends on grub-efi-amd64, whereas grub-efi:i386 depends on grub-efi-ia3200:05
gnarfacewoops... _ds_, rrq user has already reporting having that installed: https://paste.debian.net/1281167/00:07
fsmithredI'm back.00:08
_ds_“ic  grub-efi-amd64” doesn't look quite right00:08
XenguySo am I00:08
gnarfacehmm... yea, and that list also shows grub-efi-ia32-bin too, which is probably in error, right?00:08
fsmithredI didn't read the whole scrollback, but grub usually tells me i386 when I'm on amd64.00:08
gnarfacefsmithred: just look at my most recent two paste.debian.net links00:09
_ds_(hmm, ‘ic’ means configuration files installed)00:10
_ds_⇒ apt install grub-efi-amd6400:10
fsmithredI understand the error message.00:11
fsmithredlatex, if you booted legacy bios mode with a gpt partition table, you need a special bios_grub partition00:11
fsmithredI think that's what gparted calls it, and gdisk calls it type ef0200:12
fsmithredpartition must be at least 1MB in size and NOT formatted. No filesystem on it.00:12
fsmithredI think you can also get the error message about blocklists if you try to install grub to a partition00:13
gnarfaceis /dev/nvme0n1 a partition?00:14
gnarfaceor just a confusing device name?00:15
rrqand if already installed, then add --reinstall00:15
fsmithredchecking...00:15
rrqno it's a disk00:16
_ds_That's what I see from a search – partitions would be ‘p1’, ‘p2’ etc. appended to that00:16
gnarfacethat's what i thought but the 'n1' part kinda throws me off00:17
_ds_Apparently it's “namespace”00:17
gnarfaceah, nvme drives have namespaces...00:17
gnarfaceinteresting00:17
latexanyone know the non-systemd equivalent to /etc/crypttab?00:18
fsmithredok, so I'd like to know which grub is installed and whether this was bios or uefi boot.00:18
fsmithredyes, it's /etc/crypttab00:18
rrqit's supposed to be amd64 + UEFI .. all other grubs are herrings00:18
latexso I should remove the signed and bin ones?00:20
gnarfacewell you should definitely remove the "ia32" one at least00:21
_ds_I'd make sure that grub-efi-amd64 is fully installed.00:21
fsmithredthe -bin packages won't hurt00:21
fsmithredand you don't need the signed unless you're using secure boot00:21
gnarfaceyea, latex to be clear, that "ii" in the left column means fully installed, if you see anything else it's not fully installed00:21
rrqcertainly remove grub-efi-ia32-bin and grub-pc and then autoremove, then reinstall grub-efi-amd6400:22
rrq(I have the three amd64 ones and the two common ones. Only)00:24
fsmithredhow did grub-pc get installed? (I know how all the other grub packages got installed.)00:25
latexwhat's the difference between grub2-common and grub-common?00:26
fsmithrednot sure, but you get both00:27
fsmithredthat's automatic00:27
latexI guess it uses x86_64-efi now00:29
latexbut how do I know where grub-mkconfig ran?00:29
latexIt's not verbose enough to show me where its grub.cfg went00:29
fsmithredupdate-grub runs grub-mkconfig for you00:29
fsmithredgoes to /boot/grub by default00:30
latexis that fine?00:30
latexNot /boot/efi/EFI/debian/grub.cfg?00:30
fsmithredI think the latter is very small, isn't it?00:31
rrqthat one is something that tells where grub.cfg and grub modules are on the root partition00:31
rrqusing the same name is cute00:31
rrqdoesn't help comprehension a lot00:32
fsmithredI don't even have that in my uefi setup.00:33
fsmithredI have grubx64.efi00:33
_ds_Just the one file (and two directories)?00:33
fsmithredwhich I'm pretty sure has a small grub.cfg inside it.00:33
_ds_(same here if so)00:33
rrqgrub's boot menu is in /boot/grub/grub.cfg of the root partition filesystem00:33
fsmithredwell, I have around 7 directories in my EFI/ but most are just leftovers.00:34
rrqthe EFI partition holds the boot loaders and whtever config they need00:35
_ds_I see “(,gpt1)/boot/grub” in grubx64.efi – presumably that's the default grub.cfg content.00:35
_ds_(in the EFI partition, anyway)00:36
rrqYes, "(,gpt1)" means "first gpt partition on 'this' media"00:37
rrqthe boot loader is a program run in "raw mode" without any system calls available apart from through UEFI .. no kernel with supporting device drivers, no filesystem00:39
rrqUEFI provides device access to the device of the boot loader00:40
rrqI think most uefi offers FAT and iso9660 filesystem support00:41
rrqanyhow; lot's of fiddly details one wants to be able to ignore00:43
dan9er[m]is devuan*.onion down?07:28
dan9er[m]getting host unreachable on 2 different devices07:31
FatPhilthe UEFI code base is bigger than the core linux code base - it's got *tons* of device drivers and filesystems compiled into it.08:54
Guest95hey there!11:18
Guest95i am running Chimaera and would love to use a kernel more recent than 5.10... what would be the easiest path?11:19
u-amarsh04hi11:19
Guest95(am afraid some would say "compile it yourself"...)11:19
rrqchimaera-backports offers 6.1.20-2~bpo11+111:21
u-amarsh04@Guest95 you could temporarily add the line "deb http://sledjhamr.org/devuan/merged ceres main contrib non-free", run aptitude -u, and instead of doing any other updates, just look for a newer kernel for your architecture and perhaps packages firmware-linux, firmware-linux-nonfree.11:23
u-amarsh04add that line to /etc/apt/sources.list11:24
u-amarsh04you could in aptitude hit "+" to mark the kernel and firmware package(s) for download, then download and install them (for some reason I have to run update-grub manually), then comment out the line from your /etc/apt/sources.list11:25
u-amarsh04but adding chimaera-backports would probably be safer11:28
Guest95aaaah a chimaera-backports indeed!11:29
Guest95thanks rrq and u-amarsh04! <311:30
Guest95hmmm i have chimaera-backports listed already in my /etc/apt/sources.list11:30
Guest95it was just a matter of selecting the right package, duh!11:34
latexHow do I switch init system again?14:07
latexsysvinit makes my brain hurt14:07
FatPhilyikes, I've just discovered one of my machines is still running ascii - should I be worried, or can I still chill?14:17
FatPhilit works great, stable as a stable thing14:18
latexFatPhil: you are now vulnerable to PrintNightmare14:43
latexseriously someone save my brain and teach me how to switch init14:45
onefangASCII has been archived, so you might have to update your sources.list.15:04
onefangOr upgrade to a later suite.15:04
fsmithredlatex, 'apt install runit-init runit-services'15:08
fsmithredor apt install openrc  (I think that one gives you on-screen instructions)15:09
fsmithredand FYI, both of those will use sysvinit scripts by default. The runit-services package will add some run scripts to replace the sysvinit scripts.15:09
fsmithredwithout that you just get the gettys, ssh and maybe one or two other things.15:10
latexwhat are your thoughts on pipewire? It used to suck but I heard they actually have the ability to properly display libpulse programs in the jack graph15:11
latexI still despise pipewire because of the elogind requirement and how they basically fail to merge libpulse into jack graph, but maybe that's fixed now.15:12
fsmithredI tried pipewire (i.e. installed it) but I couldn't figure out what to do with it, and it seemed like it only worked if pulseaudio was installed.15:12
fsmithredSo I gave up and removed it.15:12
latexI'll still run jack+pulseaudio combo on my main pc15:12
fsmithredoh, I recently came across instructions for geting firefox to work with jack.15:13
fsmithredwithout pulse15:14
latexit already works for me15:14
latexbut firefox uses jack in a stupid way15:14
latexit keeps making new jack nodes and stuff15:14
latexso my port connection automation doesn't work15:14
fsmithredoh, I didn't know that. Thanks.15:15
fsmithrednow I can go back to saying that I wish ff supported jack.15:15
onefangI use just ALSA and JACK, but I'm doing music production.15:17
onefangYou can tell FF to use ALSA direct.15:18
fsmithreddoesn't it do that without any telling?15:18
fsmithredor you mean when jackd is running?15:19
onefangIt uses ALSA without telling it if you have apulse installed.15:22
onefangI haven't tried routing FF directly to JACK.  I got music to make, rarely listen to FF stuff.15:23
latexI want to install jack on my friend's devuan but idk how to write sysvinit scripts15:24
fsmithredlatex, what do you need a sysvinit script for?15:27
fsmithredjackd is generally started with a single command15:27
latexrunning jack at boot15:29
latexon my gentoo pc I have an openrc script that runs jack under my user at boot15:29
latexbut I agree that maybe a user-specific init script (be it with dinit or s6) makes more sense15:30
latexI do wanna try that so I can avoid using sysvinit15:30
fsmithredlatex, I usually set up qjackctl to start jackd. The clicky interface makes me feel like I'm working with an actual hardware stereo system.15:52
onefangI do that to.15:52
latexThat's not the UNIX way15:54
latexI am disgusted15:54
latexThe UNIX way is to write an init script that makes jackd manageable through your init system15:54
fsmithredlol15:54
onefangqjackctl has some scripts you can edit to do other UNIXy things when you start or stop it.15:54
latexNo15:54
latexIt's fake15:54
latexWhy would you want to have a Qt5 program open in order to have working system audio?15:55
latexThat stuff needs to be lower-level than your DE or WM with Qt515:55
latexAudio should be handled in the init system15:55
onefangI use ALSA for system audio,  JACK is for making music.15:55
latexI use JACK for everything15:55
latexI require the routing flexibility15:55
onefangI have a bunch of audio devices.15:56
fluffywolf"Audio should be handled in the init system"  time to roll pulse into pid 1?  :P15:56
latexlet's go15:56
latexfluffywolf: are you fluffy?15:56
onefangNOw look what you've done.  lol15:56
fluffywolfyes!15:56
latexI'm rubbery15:56
fluffywolfsounds kinky.15:58
latexIt's only kinky if that's the way you think about it15:59
fluffywolfjust don't start talking about how the blueberry scene in willy wonka is the best thing ever...16:00
latexlol16:00
latexMeh I'm not the biggest fan of it but I can see the appeal16:00
onefangWaaay #devuan-offtopic.  lol16:02
jason123onircI converted debian armv7 install to devuan and even on debian after awhile ethernet drops. Its running headless so I would prefer for the ethernet connection to stay alive. What do I need to change?20:36
latexis there a pipewire init script?20:45
gnarfacelatex: nothing in /etc/init.d/? it could be getting started by the session manager like pulseaudio does now21:30
latexwhy?21:30
latexAnd where is that?21:30
gnarfacei don't know, and i don't know21:31
latexWhat's a session manager again?21:31
gnarfacegraphical login manager21:31
gnarfaceor session manager21:31
latexWhy would anyone want to use one?21:31
latexI just type startx after logging in21:31
gnarfaceoh, i see. i'm not sure how to even make pulseaudio work right in that situation these days21:31
gnarfaceafaik they need the session manager because they spawn per-user daemons21:32
latexpulseaudio gets automatically started by programs that need it21:32
latexso if you just set up a user config it'll do21:32
gnarfacei think the session manager is still what's triggering it, but not sure21:32
miojohi guys, where can i found the nice devuan walpapers?21:32
gnarfacemiojo: i'm not sure we have any but ask golinux21:33
gnarface(besides the one it ships with anyway)21:33
golinuxhttps://git.devuan.org/devuan/documentation/src/branch/master/art/graphics21:33
miojothank you guys!21:34
golinuxThe canonical collection . . .21:34
golinux. . . and gals21:34
miojo:D21:34
latexmumble freezes upon joining a server23:18
latexCan anyone reproduce?23:18
gnarfacenope23:19
gnarfacewhich release were you using again?23:19
latexdaeduloduls23:24
gnarfaceyou still got a bunch of other parts from other distros mixed in there, or is it pure daedalus?23:25
gnarfaceunexplained crashing is a frequent symptom of mixing distros or releases23:26
gnarfacealso, did it used to work or is this the first time you're testing it?23:27

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