| brocashelm | https://fossforce.com/2023/08/foss-week-in-review-window-maker-live-adopts-systemd-new-tails-on-the-down-low-and-google-free-e-os/ | 00:32 |
|---|---|---|
| brocashelm | >Starting with this release, the window manager is the distro’s exclusive desktop session option, as the Xfce desktop option has been removed. | 00:32 |
| brocashelm | i'm not sure by the wording of this, whether it's debian dropping xfce or something else | 00:33 |
| rustyaxe | windowmaker still exists? lol | 00:43 |
| Xenguy | brocashelm, Sounds weird, though not sure I understand at first glance | 00:59 |
| Xenguy | I know, I'm lazy and reluctant to click through, but I did, and I do occasionally love a good text browser. Nostalgic yet useful : -) | 01:00 |
| Xenguy | rustyaxe, Yeah, windowmaker is ancient tech. I used it before, in early days, and thought it was fine, if a little weird and quirky in its design | 01:02 |
| rustyaxe | it was aite 20 years ago on 800x600 screens yes | 01:03 |
| rustyaxe | 25 | 01:03 |
| Xenguy | Those were the daze, 800x600, haha | 01:05 |
| Xenguy | And our upgrades to 28000 baud modems! | 01:05 |
| Xenguy | But I digress | 01:05 |
| Xenguy | Right okay I get it, avoiding systemd became too onerous for them, so they caved | 01:08 |
| Xenguy | Good job, alas | 01:08 |
| Xenguy | I wouldn't be using it anytime soon in any case, as you say rustyaxe | 01:09 |
| Xenguy | So... whatevsies | 01:09 |
| brocashelm | so i wonder if windowmaker packages for debian will pull in systemd? that would mean devuan would have to fork that | 01:29 |
| golinux | Or ban it. | 01:32 |
| brocashelm | that's only if replacing it with elogind would still cause trouble, afaik | 01:33 |
| golinux | It would hardly be a high priority. | 01:34 |
| golinux | windowmanager users can step up if it's important to them . . . | 01:34 |
| golinux | oops windowmaker | 01:35 |
| brocashelm | as time goes on, seems the whole systemd bubble is getting harder to avoid | 01:36 |
| brocashelm | next debian release will be even more systemd | 01:37 |
| Xenguy | I think so brocashelm | 01:38 |
| Xenguy | This is guerilla warfare, and resistance, if you ask me | 01:38 |
| Xenguy | Sign me up! | 01:39 |
| Xenguy | = ) | 01:39 |
| Xenguy | Better than the military though, of course | 01:43 |
| Xenguy | But I digress | 01:43 |
| Guest8984 | helo | 02:26 |
| Xenguy | Nevertheless | 02:29 |
| brocashelm | xenguy: slackware seems to be the last stand for us | 03:53 |
| brocashelm | all they ever had to do was simply not put systemd on there, and it's working | 03:53 |
| mason | brocashelm: Slackware included PulseAudio as of 14.2 and elogind as of 15.0. | 03:55 |
| mason | I need to diff the artiX packages that don't link libsystemd0. Haven't had a chance yet. | 03:56 |
| brocashelm | mason: i got rid of pulseaudio and replaced it with alsa; elogind, however, is a problem | 03:57 |
| brocashelm | seatd and consolekit2 barely make for a usable desktop as polkit will not function correctly (IME) | 03:57 |
| mason | Luckily I use Openbox, which doesn't want much. | 03:58 |
| brocashelm | i customized openbox as best as i could to match xfwm4 for xfce, but it still has some issues. i would use it for a no-dbus system, though | 03:58 |
| brocashelm | that one and spacefm to also handle the desktop side | 03:58 |
| Xenguy | brocashelm, I could back up to Slackware if and when the time comes, before heading to BSD land | 04:26 |
| Xenguy | I always thought he was cool, being a deadhead and all | 04:27 |
| Xenguy | Then he survived some health scare | 04:27 |
| Xenguy | And really Slackware has always seemed to me to have an intention that is pure and uncomplicated, so good for him | 04:27 |
| Xenguy | It was the (seeming) lack of package management that steered me away from trying it... | 04:28 |
| Xenguy | But it's totally on my list for Plan B | 04:28 |
| brocashelm | i recommend salix if you ever decide to go the slack way | 04:29 |
| Xenguy | Is it a derivative? | 04:29 |
| brocashelm | yes, its package management and repo have dependency tracking, similar to debian's | 04:29 |
| Xenguy | bingo | 04:29 |
| Xenguy | Thanks, I'll have a look | 04:29 |
| brocashelm | slackware/salix 14.2 is the last pure gtk2 and is still supported (no EOL announcement yet) | 04:30 |
| brocashelm | np | 04:30 |
| mtnman | helo | 05:35 |
| al1r4d | Helo | 05:41 |
| brocashelm | good morning sir/madam | 05:42 |
| mason | ehlo | 05:51 |
| cosurgi | any rough estimate when Daedalus will be released ? | 13:46 |
| brocashelm | "when it's ready" | 13:48 |
| djph | soon(tm) | 13:49 |
| djph | ... bah! | 13:49 |
| brocashelm | fwiw: you can switch over to daedalus anytime you wish; they just need more testers for ISOs | 13:50 |
| onefang | Roughly soonish, or later maybe. It's usable now. | 13:50 |
| cosurgi | onefang: thanks! | 14:17 |
| al1r4d | cosurgi: ask Jaromil, mabye he know | 15:12 |
| golinux | jaromil is on sabbatical | 16:26 |
| golinux | and is rarely seen around here | 16:28 |
| fsmithred | I heard a rumor that the isos are done | 16:29 |
| ManinTheSandbox1 | Thanks for the IPtables | 20:40 |
| ManinTheSandbox1 | I want to limit my ports in my desktop | 20:40 |
| ManinTheSandbox1 | but firefox opens ports | 20:40 |
| ManinTheSandbox1 | so i can do sudo iptables -D INPUT -j DROP | 20:41 |
| rwp | I have been completely offline for the past ten days. Today I see that my Chimaera systems say this. | 22:06 |
| rwp | N: Repository 'http://deb.devuan.org/merged chimaera-security InRelease' changed its 'Suite' value from 'stable-security' to 'oldstable-security' | 22:06 |
| rwp | I assume that is tracking the upstream Debian repositories now that Debian has released. | 22:07 |
| rwp | Making Daedalus more or less released too since it is also tracking Debian. | 22:08 |
| fsmithred | rwp, the changes were just initiated a little while ago. | 22:16 |
| fsmithred | changed links in repos I mean | 22:16 |
| fsmithred | Debian is already up to first point-release, I think. | 22:17 |
| fsmithred | "little while" = less than 1 hour | 22:17 |
| rwp | I guess I returned to being online at just the right time them! Random convergence... | 22:18 |
| fsmithred | probably wouldn't hurt to wait a couple of hours for mirrors to catch up. | 22:18 |
| rwp | Good information. Thanks! | 22:19 |
| fsmithred | the software is digital but the relase is analog | 22:19 |
| rwp | I have been on travel; camping, bicycling, driving a sag wagon (aka "broom wagon"), and completely offline. Home to the problems of the world again. It will take me several days to catch up on everything. | 22:21 |
| fsmithred | sounds like a good time | 22:22 |
| squeaktoy | https://bpa.st/raw/ANJA help I'm upgrading to ceres but I can't continue due to this error while doing apt dist-upgrade | 22:47 |
| fsmithred | squeaktoy, is libgudev still causing problems? I didn't look. | 22:48 |
| squeaktoy | idk what that is | 22:49 |
| fifi | fsmithred, do you know fungalnet? | 22:49 |
| fsmithred | fifi yeah, been a long time since I was there | 22:49 |
| fifi | same here ;p | 22:50 |
| fsmithred | assuming you're not talking about mycology | 22:50 |
| fifi | no ;p | 22:50 |
| squeaktoy | Wait maybe I know what's happening | 22:50 |
| squeaktoy | it's nvidia-persistenced again | 22:50 |
| fifi | I haven't heard from this guy for a long time, but he's a good bloke, huh take care m8 | 22:50 |
| squeaktoy | There are some left over services in /etc/init.d apparently somehow | 22:50 |
| fsmithred | squeaktoy, add --no-install-recommends | 22:50 |
| fifi | I remember he told me once about u, I think he said something about fk parabola?? | 22:51 |
| squeaktoy | I fixed it | 22:53 |
| squeaktoy | there were some non-executable scripts in /etc/init.d | 22:53 |
| squeaktoy | after removing them it works | 22:53 |
| golinux | Why are you upgrading to unstable? | 22:53 |
| squeaktoy | daedalus is too outdated | 22:54 |
| fifi | lol golinux sorry for offtopic but I remember u from back in 2017-18, glad to see you still alive all the best LOL I am drunk rn but thanks lol take care | 22:54 |
| squeaktoy | also the conservative approach to packaging causes software bugs in the stable repos | 22:54 |
| squeaktoy | e.g. Mumble not working | 22:55 |
| squeaktoy | or OBS crashing | 22:55 |
| squeaktoy | and more famously yt-dlp not working because it's outdated | 22:55 |
| golinux | fifi: Thanks for the greeting from the past. Yup . . . still breathing and you too . . . | 22:56 |
| rwp | yt-dlp is best used directly from the upstream. Speaking as someone who prefers packaged stuff but yt-dlp needs to be volatile because web sites are volatile. | 22:57 |
| squeaktoy | There's a problem. My keyboard and mouse no longer work at lightdm | 22:58 |
| fsmithred | I think that's the libgudev problem. squeaktoy look it up at the forum. There are a few recent posts about it. Have to hold or pin one package. | 23:01 |
| squeaktoy | oh thanks | 23:08 |
| squeaktoy | How come this bug happen? | 23:08 |
| golinux | ceres is a bug-magnet! | 23:21 |
| rwp | Unstable (aka Ceres and Sid) are the daily bleeding edge bits. That's just situation normal for the daily bleeding edge. | 23:40 |
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