libera/#devuan/ Saturday, 2024-03-09

XenguyThat's a helluva 'Guide to System Upgrades with Debian' documentation rwp, you should be proud : -)00:00
XenguyI like the page look'n'feel also, very clean00:00
rwpI am glad you like it Xenguy!  Hopefully people will find it helpful.00:14
XenguyYeah, looks like really good documentation, very thorough00:15
avbox24I still struggle with update from version 4 to 5. libpamg0g breaks (or debconf). As debconf is needed for nearly everything, I look for a way to reapir it, but no sucess till far. Any ideas?09:03
avbox24I was able to manage to update debconf and libpam0g. After changing version 4 to 5 in /etc/apt/sources, I manually (first) installed debconf and libpam0g, but now it is stopped with libpam-runtimes, so I have to restart whole process.09:27
amarsh04I'm still stuck not updating libpam0g-dev libpam-modules, libpam-modules-bin due to waiting on an update libpam-elogind and libelogind-compat09:35
avbox24Again it is broken, was able to install everything related to libpam*, but then it stops with policykit* stuff.09:47
gnarfaceavbox24: same thing with all of them, if you put them all on one command line with the proper version number like libwhatever=9.3.2 it should fix it09:51
gnarfacejust specify version for everything09:51
gnarfaceit's not complex, it just goes with the highest version number in every case, and when that's not working you have to manually override it09:52
gnarfaceyes, you may have to restart some programs, you might even have to restart your whole gui stack09:53
avbox24Do I understand this right: apt-get install debconf=1.5.88 ?09:53
gnarfaceeventually when you update libc and the kernel you have to restart the whole thing anyway, so sometimes it's easier to just reboot anyway09:53
gnarfaceyes, like that, but with all of them09:53
gnarfaceapt-get install debconf=1.5.88 libwhateverelse=1.2.3 libsomething=5.2 libstuff=...09:54
gnarfaceotherwise you might just be changing them back and forth in a loop09:54
gnarface(that's why i suggested aptitude, so it would do that work for you)09:55
avbox24Ok, thank you so much. And just to understand, this works when it is "broken", I tried yesterday aptitude safe-upgrade, it ended up not beeing able to process with 500'000 "stages", I then changed to 5'000'0000 but after some hours I stoped it.09:56
gnarfacewell, it's possible to break it worse than even this will fix09:57
gnarfacebut for normal dependency loop problems, it's likely to work if you do it right, yes09:58
gnarfacei have no idea why aptitude failed, i really thought it would work for you but i don't use it a lot myself09:58
gnarfacesometimes you have to practically remove your entire graphical stack and just reinstall the lower level versions afterwards from the system text console09:59
gnarfaceyou sure you didn't do something weird with this install like upgrade it to unstable then downgrade it back to stable?09:59
gnarfaceit's actually possible to screw up the package dependency system itself if you do that, as i've learned the hard way10:00
gnarfacethat's not really easy to fix10:00
gnarfacenot with just my skills without a reinstall, anyway10:01
gnarfaceanyway, every time your command fails, it means you missed a package you need to add to the list with the explicit, correct version number requested10:02
gnarfacethe error should basically tell you which package(s) you need to add10:02
gnarfaceif you can back it into a corner where it gives a different error than "version [X] is requested but version [Y] is to be installed" then show me the error10:03
avbox24So I'm again in broken stage, it is libpam-runtime_1.5.2-6+deb12u1_all.deb, if I understood it right, I should be able to install it wiht apt-get install libpam-runtime=1.5.2-6 or apt-get install libpam-runtime=1.5.2, but the system tells me that it could not be found.10:41
avbox24Ok, I had to add the whole stuff after the package name, apt-get install libpam-runtime=1.5.2-6+deb12u1_all, but it does not solve the problem, again next try.10:52
gnarfaceyea, you gotta specify that whole string11:20
gnarfaceusually newer stuff registers as newer but it's just by alphanumeric sorting, so occasionally (like when they use a datestamp instead of a regular version string) older stuff can look newer11:22
gnarfaceand that can also lead to the type of problem you're having11:22
avbox24I could install a lot of stuff manually, actually I'm at python3-minimal. It says it can't install 3.11 over 3.9. Any ideas?13:52
avbox24 python3-minimal depends python3.11-minimal (>= 3.11.2-1~) but13:57
avbox24  python3.11-minimal is not installed ???13:57
avbox24I did see that installing packages, always and always perl-base is reinstalled. At some point it is then broken. I set perl-base to hold 'apt-mark hold perl-base', so I coud install python3-minimal. Let's see if I can finish it and if it works...14:20
avbox24After holding perl-base, I get complain that libglib-object-introspection-perl : depends on: perl (>= 5.36.0-4) but 5.32.1-4+deb11u3 ist istalled, I then set perl-base to unhold 'apt-mark unhold perl-base' and then I could update it, but still no full dist-upgrade14:30
gnarfaceavbox24: pinned/held packages aren't gonna help your upgrade attempt...14:41
gnarfacehttps://pkginfo.devuan.org/cgi-bin/policy-query.html?c=package&q=%5Epython3-minimal%24&x=submit14:41
avbox24To be clear, perl-base is on stage 3.6, I don't understand why it is always reinstalled and breaks the whole installation?14:42
gnarfacehttps://pkginfo.devuan.org/cgi-bin/policy-query.html?c=package&q=%5Eperl-base%24&x=submit14:42
gnarfacethere's gotta be something in there that's still the wrong version14:44
gnarfacesp ot14:44
gnarfaceso it's trying to make everything match that14:44
gnarfacemaybe it's something that's not there anymore even, or has changed names14:44
avbox24how can I find out what the perl-base for daedalus has everything it needs (is current)? When it is called during apt-get dist-upgrade it always breaks the whole system.14:45
gnarfaceif you run "apt-cache show perl-base" you can see the dependencies14:47
gnarfaceit doesn't say whether they're satisfied, you'll have to check that separately14:47
gnarfacebut you can see what it requires, what it conflicts with, etc14:47
avbox24Thank you gnarface, I will check it.14:47
avbox24it Pre-Depends: libc6 (>= 2.29), libcrypt1 (>= 1:4.1.0), dpkg (>= 1.17.17), libc6 is ok, libcrypt1 I had to update/install, but how to update dpkg?14:57
avbox24dpkg is currently 1.20, so it should be enough current for perl-base, right?14:58
gnarfacei think so?15:07
avbox24After fullfilling all requirements that are "shown" in perl-base, during apt-get dist-upgrade I still get a broken perl-base.15:08
gnarfacepaste the whole output at paste.debian.net and show me the link15:08
avbox24Thanks for the offer (can do that), but first let me add that perl itself is on perl 5.32, not 5.36, so it looks that perl itself is not updatable.15:13
gnarfacedid you try removing 5.32 first instead?15:14
gnarfacepaste your /etc/apt/sources.list at paste.debian.net too please15:14
avbox24 /etc/apt/source.list = https://pastebin.com/27MwPtpx15:16
gnarfaceplease use paste.debian.net15:16
avbox24I can install perl 5.36 and perl-base 5.36, but after it perl-base 5.32 is still there. As soon as I uninstall perl-base 5.32 then whole perl-base folder under /usr/lib/x86_64-linux-gnu/perl-base seems to be broken.15:26
gnarfacewhat do you mean?15:27
gnarfacewhat's the error?15:27
avbox24I resent the sources.list to paste.debian.net/131002815:27
gnarfaceremove backports15:28
gnarfaceadd non-free-firmware to the list at the end of each line15:28
gnarfacealso, if you were using chimaera-backports, those are probably the packages that are blocking the upgrade; you'll want to remove or downgrade those first15:29
gnarfacenever leave backports enabled like this15:30
gnarfaceenable it to install just the few things you need then disable it again15:30
avbox24like this ? https://paste.debian.net/131003015:30
gnarfacei also recommend upgrades as "apt-get --no-install-recommends dist-upgrade"15:30
gnarfaceor rather, "apt-get update && apt-get --no-install-recommends dist-upgrade"15:31
gnarfacethen probably "apt-get --purge autoremove"15:31
gnarfaceand yes, that sources.list looks right now15:31
avbox24I don't remember that I did install in chimaera something from backports, but I can do the job again.15:31
gnarfacedpkg -l|grep bpo15:32
gnarfacebackports packages all have "bpo" in the version string15:32
avbox24#devuan  -l|grep chimaera # dpkg -l|grep beowulf => I don't get any results.15:33
gnarfaceof course not, that wouldn't be expected. no packages have their release name in the version string15:34
avbox24So I don't understand dpkg -l|grep bpo => dpkg -l|grep beowulf ? Does this give backport installation i.e. under beowulf?15:43
gnarfaceno, i just said to run "dpkg -l |grep bpo"15:46
gnarfacesome of the packages that will match won't be relevant, make sure you're looking in the version string15:46
gnarfaceit will say something like bpo1215:46
gnarfacehttps://pkginfo.devuan.org/cgi-bin/policy-query.html?c=package&q=linux-image-6.5&x=submit15:47
gnarfacelike these backports kernels15:47
gnarfacesee the bpo12?15:48
gnarfacechimaera and beowulf will probably be bpo11 and bpo10 respectively15:48
avbox24So I think I did understand the output before upgrading to daedalus is under https://paste.debian.net/1310034 - and if I understand you correct I should remove / undo this packages ?15:54
gnarfacei only see this one: xournalpp15:54
gnarfacei'm not sure it's the problem15:55
gnarfacebut it looks like it would be easy to remove then reinstall after the upgrade too15:55
gnarfacehttps://pkginfo.devuan.org/cgi-bin/policy-query.html?c=package&q=%5Exournalpp%24&x=submit15:57
gnarfacewas that one of the blocked packages?15:58
avbox24No, absolutely not.15:59
gnarfaceyou see that the daedalus version is actually newer though, right?15:59
avbox24Yes, but I think I'm coming closer. I upgraded now with 'apt-get --no-install-recommends dist-upgrade', the result is under  https://paste.debian.net/1310036 (it looks like maria does break it, the broken perl-base is fact at line 3 (BEGIN failed--compilation aborted at /usr/lib/x86_64-linux-gnu/perl-base/overload.pm line 5.) Then nothing works16:04
avbox24anymore.16:04
gnarfacewhat did you do to this perl install?16:06
avbox24The only thing I remember is I had once (years ago) problems with a package. I then did copy the code from an earlier release so it worked. Could this be the problem?16:12
gnarfaceyes16:12
gnarfacemaybe try to apt-get --reinstall install it16:13
gnarfaceapt-get --reinstall install mariadb-server-10.516:13
gnarfaceor actually, no, not that one16:14
gnarfacedebconf16:14
gnarfaceapt-get --reinstall install debconf16:14
gnarface...because those files are in debconf16:15
gnarfacethen if it succeeds, try mariadb-server-10.5 again16:15
avbox24I deinstalled mariadb-server, php/php7.4 and now have errors just afer cron: https://paste.debian.net/1310039/16:21
gnarfacewell, i see the compilation error , i thought you fixed that?16:24
gnarfacebut it looks like it continued anyway16:24
gnarfacei'm not seeing the end of it16:24
gnarfaceoh, wait sorry i see it all nevermind16:25
gnarfacemaybe this is mentioned on bugs.debian.org or in the release notes?16:27
gnarfacewere you saying you literally replaced these .pm files throwing the compilation errors with earlier versions?16:27
avbox24Well it's long time ago, it I could nod reach the maintainer of the package, but an earlier version worked. So I finally just copied the earlier version over it and it worked. I'm not sure or convinced that this is the problem, I think it is a mismatch between 5.32 and 5.36.16:32
gnarfacewhatever the package was, try to reinstall it with apt-get --reinstall install [pacakge]16:33
gnarfaceit should replace them with the right files and then this error should go away16:34
avbox24Well, at some point I will do that. Actually I see that the dist-upgrade goes very far (near end). I just want to try here 2 or 3  runs.16:40
avbox24When I try to install perl 5.36 manually, then it says I need perl-base. So I install it, but then it is complaining about packages not having, at the end I get message perlapi-5.36.0 does not exist. Perlapi was once needed (but seems to be not any longer needed) in par-base, see: https://paste.debian.net/131004416:55
gnarfaceyou can't just use dpkg and apt-get interchangeably when i tell you to use apt-get you have to use apt-get. dpkg isn't network capable.16:57
gnarfacehttps://pkginfo.devuan.org/cgi-bin/policy-query.html?c=package&q=%5Elibscalar-list-utils-perl%24&x=submit16:59
avbox24Well I think there is a dependance in libscalar-list-utils-perl that does not exist, see https://paste.debian.net/1310045, I got this with apt-cache show libscalar-list-utils-perl. I assume this is a bug in the corresponding package, right?17:01
gnarfacethe daedalus version is 1:1.63-1+b1, did you try it with "apt-get --no-install-recommends install "libscalar-list-utils-perl=1:1.63-1+b1" .. ?17:01
gnarfaceapt-get --no-install-recommends install libscalar-list-utils-perl=1:1.63-1+b117:02
gnarfacelike that, i mean17:02
gnarfaceremember that apt-cache shows the package in the repo, not necessarily what you have installed17:03
avbox24Yes, I have the correct deb package. But as you can see in the output of this package, he wants perlapi 5.36, but I don't find such a package. I think this requirement is obsolet at this time (sounds to be very long time ago it was needed).17:05
gnarfaceno, look at: apt-cache show perl-base17:07
gnarfaceparticularly, this line: Provides: libfile-path-perl (= 2.18), libfile-temp-perl (= 0.2311), libio-socket-ip-perl (= 0.41), libscalar-list-utils-perl (= 1:1.62), libsocket-perl (= 2.033), libxsloader-perl (= 0.31), perlapi-5.36.017:07
avbox24The requirement is in libscalar-list-utils-perl, not in perl-base,17:09
avbox24Depends: perl (>= 5.36.0-4), perlapi-5.36.0, libc6 (>= 2.14), see https://paste.debian.net/131004517:09
gnarfaceyes, i looked17:09
gnarfacewhat you need to understand is that the "Provides" field is not the same as "Depends," it is the opposite17:10
gnarfacehere, look at it: http://paste.debian.net/1310046/17:12
gnarfacelook at line 817:12
gnarfacescroll all the way to the end17:12
gnarfacedoes this help? https://translate.google.com/?sl=auto&tl=de&text=Provides%3A%0AReplaces%3A%0AConflicts%3A%0A&op=translate17:13
avbox24So if I understand you right, only the line pre-depends is the stuff that is needed?17:13
gnarfacei guess so17:14
avbox24Ok, hope I know understand it.17:14
gnarfacethe other fields are about what must not be installed17:16
gnarfacethere may be a requirement to remove some things if you have them installed17:16
asbestoHello folks, any help on devuanpi?17:19
asbestoI wonder why service networking restart doesn't work17:19
asbestorun-parts: executing /etc/network/if-up.d/mountnfs17:19
asbestorun-parts: executing /etc/network/if-up.d/resolved17:19
asbestorun-parts: executing /etc/network/if-up.d/wpasupplicant17:19
asbestoifup: configuring interface lo=lo (inet)17:19
asbestorun-parts --exit-on-error --verbose /etc/network/if-pre-up.d17:19
asbestorun-parts: executing /etc/network/if-pre-up.d/wireless-tools17:19
asbestorun-parts: executing /etc/network/if-pre-up.d/wpasupplicant17:19
asbestoip link set dev lo up17:19
asbestoeth017:19
asbesto/bin/sh: 1: eth0: not found17:19
asbestoifup: failed to bring up lo17:19
asbestodone.17:19
gnarfaceasbesto: devuan for the raspberry pi? please use paste.debian.net for long pastes by the way17:19
asbestoroot@devuanpi:~#17:19
asbesto:(17:20
asbestoah ok sorry :)17:20
gnarfaceor use something anyway, but i'll only look at it if it's paste.debian.net17:20
gnarfaceif you're talking about devuan for the raspberry pi, we do also have a ARM channel at #devuan-arm17:21
asbestohttps://paste.debian.net/1310048/17:21
asbestook17:21
asbestohere it is17:21
asbestoah, good17:21
gnarfacewell, i already saw it now, no point in repeating that one17:21
gnarfacewhat does your /etc/network/interfaces file look like?17:22
gnarfaceand which release are you using?17:22
asbestolatest devuan just downloaded. interfaces is as I always used on so many raspberry. Do you need me to  paste.debian  it?17:23
asbestobtw it';s here - https://paste.debian.net/1310049/17:24
asbestosorry let's talk on the other channel :)17:24
rustyaxegnarface: you might know.. Are there any documents for building devuan entirely from source? I'd rather like to strip out all the X related stuff for my project as it's just consuming limited space being linked to things. ya know?17:29
gnarfacerustyaxe: nothing off the top of my head, sorry. i suppose you'd just download the source packages and try to rebuild them but i don't know of a way to automate the whole thing like gentoo does.17:31
gnarfacerustyaxe: you know about "apt-get source [package name]" right?17:32
gnarfacethere's also git.devuan.org which might have some stuff on there that's relevant for the parts of devuan that aren't in packages17:33
gnarfacei'm not sure exactly how much of it you're intending to rebuild here17:34
asbestoit was an error, I suppose. "up" is used to launch a command. So it was launching "eth0" as a command, hence the "not found" error17:35
asbestovery weird17:35
gnarfaceprobably the bug was that it worked17:36
gnarfacethen they fixed it17:36
rustyaxegnarface: pretty much looking like what im going to have to do is grab source debs, edit a little as needed to get rid of X11, then build em all. probably in a chroot/fakeroot sort of environment. Just wasnt sure if there was some tool that sorted it already ;)17:42
gnarfacerustyaxe: i'm not sure that there's not, but nothing i can recall hearing about either17:43
gnarfaceand at least in previous releases, the source packages weren't even actually required to build the same thing that was checked in as the binary package17:45
gnarfacein fact, they weren't even required to actually build17:45
gnarfacei don't know if that's still the case or not17:45
gnarfaceusually the quality stuff builds fine17:46
n4dirit is not that xorg would be oustanding big when installed. Last time i checked.18:07
eyalrozHello Devuaners,18:27
eyalrozDoes anyone know if Debian/Devuan is known to install and work properly on Beelink SER5 mini-computers?18:27
eyalrozLike this one?: https://www.bee-link.net/cdn/shop/files/SER5-5560U__01_800x.jpg?v=169829990518:28
gnarfacenever heard of them18:28
eyalrozIn principle, it's "just" another PC, but some of the components may be kind of bespoke, so there may be driver glitches or kernel-unrecognized components18:28
gnarfacedo you have one you can try booting the live cd?18:30
gnarfacelive image, rather18:30
eyalrozgnarface: I just got one, yes.18:32
eyalrozI suppose I could create a live USB and try it.18:32
eyalrozI wanted to try the pre-installed Windows first, but - alas - it demands that you log in to a Microsoft account as part of OS setup.18:33
eyalrozGentoo supposedly works with it: https://wiki.gentoo.org/wiki/Beelink_SER5_AMD_Ryzen_5_5560U_Mini_PC18:33
* debdog wonders why it has a from the outside reachable CLR CMOS button?18:37
avbox24eyalroz: You can try avmultimedia (normal or avmultimedia6), it is a livecd and you just can check it out.18:38
avbox24eyalroz: We have a lot of mini computer outside by customers, most of them with similar ryzen cpus, you should not get any troubles.18:39
eyalrozavbox24: You mean from here? https://kdrive.infomaniak.com/app/share/1032019/d65bb847-1e76-417c-9195-c612af2128c4/files/2118:42
avbox24Yes18:42
eyalrozI was more worried about the mobo, controllers, etc., but sure, I'll give it a go. Is it based on daedalus? chimera?18:43
avbox24avmultimedia.iso is on beowulf, avmultimedia6.iso is on chimaera, and currently I'm working on daedalus (but the dist-upgrade job sucks, I probably create it from scratch. It is very fast starting up (live and working cd in ram), it is mostly used for multimedia stuff, see here: https://linuxnews.de/avmultimedia-2024-ii-videos-optimieren18:46
avbox24(unfortunately in german, but the is has english, no problem)18:46
eyalrozavbox24: What is "rechenpower" though :-) ?19:02
avbox24For video optimization you should have some cpus (8 or more), that is rechenpower.19:03
avbox24eyalroz:19:03
avbox24eyalroz: But you find this all in the english blog (video with english subitles), see here: https://archivista.ch/cms/en/news/avmultimedia-2024-ii/19:04
CueXXIIIavbox24: computing power19:16
CueXXIIIi mean, you could do video encoding on a cpu from last century, too, it just takes forever19:18
avbox24CueXXIII: Yes, of corse, but by the way, ffmpeg takes on my ryzen3990X only about +/- 16 cpus, is there a way to get all cpus (64/128 threads) of ffmpeg or melt (shotcut et al)?19:21
sfoxsure19:21
sfoxwhat codec are you doing?19:22
sfoxi mainly do my transcoding on freebsd but the principals should be the same19:22
sfoxx265 and the like should allow you to increase multithreading by splitting frames into multiple squares which can be en/decoded in a different thread.19:23
sfoxbe careful doing this as it reduces your compression ratio and keep in mind the amout of cpus on the device you want to play it back on19:23
sfoxayou can also reduce the complexity at the cost of ratio by using the speed paramaters eg. -fast19:24
sfoxinstead of -veryslow19:24
sfoxyou can also cut the video up into slices, run the encoding on different parts of the video a the same time, and restich the video back together19:24
sfoxthat will probably require some scripting but that will allow you to use all cores as long as the video is long enough without multithreading each frame like crazy19:25
sfoxif your encoding multiple videos at the same time keep in mind locality and pin each video to a numa group19:26
sfoxlstopo command can visualize your arch19:27
avbox24sfox: my current solution is to call multiple videos so I can use all cpus. But yes it does not help you if you only have one movie.19:27
avbox24gnarface: I have the solutio for my epic problem.22:11
avbox24gnarface: In the old version I had some small perl files in /etc/perl. There was an old version of wrapper.pm. This dummy file did break the whole thing. I only realized it when I started to put together everything from scratch. As soon as I moved that file to /etc/perl, everything that did work earlier did not work any more. Unfortunatelly I had22:14
avbox24the problem not when switching from Beowulf to Chimaea, but I'm happy that I could find it.22:14
avbox24gnarface and all others, thank you for helping. Without this tips I don't think that I were able to solve my problem.22:36

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