freenode/#devuan/ Wednesday, 2018-07-25

bjbrunning buildbot tests (of buildbot itself) on a devuan ascii system, the test_buildbot_net_usage_data test fails because it fails to parse /etc/os-release04:37
bjbIt finds "ID" ok, but it fails to find "VERSION_ID"04:41
hiyaanyone here running ryzen 7 2700u/07:58
edbarxCould someone reply whether this statement in debian/rules is supported?11:07
edbarxStatement: dh $@ --with-python2 --parallel11:07
enycwith devuan-ascii and MATE, whatevers' different with dbus/udev and all this here...  The "Places"->"Removable Media"  fills up with MTP devices (e.g. plugging in android widgets) and never clears them out... and eventually fails to mount any removable media properly...13:08
enycany idea what may be at fault / how to debug?  others seen this?13:08
furrymcgeeare vendor-specific patch series used in devuan packages?14:24
gnarfacethey are just the debian packages14:25
gnarfacenone of that stuff was changed14:25
furrymcgeeactually the differences are interesting to me14:41
gnarfacefurrymcgee: you're probably looking for this
gnarfaceeverything else is pretty much the same, except packages that could be made to not require systemd were15:16
gnarfacemost the packages remain unchanged15:16
furrymcgeeif i use a debian repository does it work with ascii installer?15:25
louisdbhello, can someone help me solve a problem I have with my Devuan install please :
NineteenHey, I thought you guys might be interested in this blog by freenode staff member Bryan 'kloeri' Ostergaard
Nineteenor maybe this blog by freenode staff member Matthew 'mst' Trout
NineteenRead what IRC investigative journalists have uncovered on the freenode pedophilia scandal
golinuxfurrymcgee:  Debian repositories are already available from devuan via a redirect.  Do not use Debian repos directly.16:42
* furrywolf pokes furrymcgee to figure out what a mcgeee is16:46
orliesaurus25Hey, I thought you guys might be interested in this blog by freenode staff member Bryan 'kloeri' Ostergaard
myth0d2211Hey, I thought you guys might be interested in this blog by freenode staff member Bryan 'kloeri' Ostergaard
* DocScrutinizer05 hands sigyn a cookie17:21
furrymcgeeThe names Magee and McGee originated in17:36
furrymcgeeUlster Province in Ireland17:36
MobileMattHey, I thought you guys might be interested in this blog by freenode staff member Bryan 'kloeri' Ostergaard
DocScrutinizer05you're aware this is spam, right? Please ignore it18:20
ChickenSoup_Hey, I thought you guys might be interested in this blog by freenode staff member Bryan 'kloeri' Ostergaard
ChickenSoup_or maybe this blog by freenode staff member Matthew 'mst' Trout
golinuxIs there anyway to stop this spam before the fact?19:32
furrywolfI'd recommend a baseball bat.  the hard part is finding where to apply it.19:32
KatolaZmmmhhh.... I guess it's called "premonition" but works only if you believe in a god or deity19:33
KatolaZit's hard to teach a bot to believe in a god, though19:34
furrywolffreenode could improve their detection to recognize repeat spammers better, but that's not something you could do at a channel level.19:35
DocScrutinizer05golinux: ((Is there anyway to stop this spam before the fact)) nope19:36
furrywolfif a client connects and immediately says a line that was part of a recent spam, kill it right then and there, don't even send the spam out.  but, that would likely take ircd and services changes.19:36
DocScrutinizer05furrywolf: any proactive antispam would need filtering on the IRC network, and that's a absolute nogo by policy in freenode19:37
furrywolfthe ircd would need to contain a list of filters to match things that would get the client immediately killed, and the spam bot would need to propogate new filters out every time it kills something.19:37
DocScrutinizer05I discussed it ad nauseum with netops19:37
KatolaZit's like shooting any postmen on sight, to avoid they can deliver any useless advert...19:38 does not work at scale19:38
furrywolfthis spammer would be exceptionally easy to get rid of this way, since its first line is always the same, with no variations...19:38
furrywolfpostmen also deliver legitimate mail.19:38
DocScrutinizer05you could inplement a 1000ms FIFO buffer in your bouncer, and delete entries in that buffer before getting forwarded to clients, on detecting "(Killed (Sigyn (Spam is off topic on freenode.)))."19:39
furrywolfthis is more like the people who go door-to-door saying they got called to look at your furnace, when they hadn't.19:39
KatolaZand you don't have a furnace...19:39
DocScrutinizer05furrywolf: actually I think such a ZNC plugin would be very useful and not too hard to implement19:40
furrywolfI'd much rather do it at the ircd level.19:40
DocScrutinizer05freenode will refuse19:40
furrywolfthat way it protects all users, not the 0.1% using znc.  heh.19:41
DocScrutinizer05absolute nogo policy19:41
DocScrutinizer05I argued with staff about it ad nauseum19:41
DocScrutinizer05actually they already *do* filtering for colors in channel ;-)19:41
furrywolfeh?  freenode already filters both on content (like how that spammer keeps getting killed) and on ip address (like how I'm required to connect with SASL, and any client not supporting it is banned)...19:42
DocScrutinizer05no, kline is sigyn, an utility bot. Not ircd19:42
furrywolfit's just making the spam filter faster.  if a client connects and says something that was said as part of a previous spam kill, kill it then, not wait for it to trip the rest of the spam threshold.19:42
DocScrutinizer05and yes, they also "filter" on IP for klines etc :-)19:43
DocScrutinizer05don't argue with me, I'm on same page. I just repeat what freenode staffers told me19:43
furrywolfI argued with them for hours that banning non-sasl clients was utterly fucking stupid, and no one listened.19:44
DocScrutinizer05[25.07.18 19:23:12] <mquin> g0: Yes,  one of our utility bots19:44
DocScrutinizer05[25.07.18 19:27:20] <mniip> g0, there's privacy issues with filtering everyone's messages on ircd scale19:44
furrywolfI think the problem is they simply don't listen, no matter which side of the issue they're on.  :P19:44
DocScrutinizer0520 min old19:44
DocScrutinizer05"freenode DOES NOT filter" period. :-S19:45
furrywolfthey randomly ban entire isps, requiring users to switch to a sasl-capable client to connect, AND have already registered their nick from another IP.  if you do not have a registered nick, you are 100% banned, even if you have a sasl-capable client.19:45
furrywolfso...  any arguments they don't filter at the ircd level are not true.19:45
furrywolfyou have to email them and ask them to register a nick for you, or connect through a proxy or web client.19:46
DocScrutinizer05ack, but... it's useless to argue with them19:46
furrywolf(my ISP is one of the ones they do this for)19:46
Leanderhi everyone, I just managed to get online so I didn't have time to really look for it, but did anyone complain about their dhcp client just not working any more?19:54
furrywolfah, nothing like (which is the third google result for sigyn) to remind me why I don't have anything to do with freenode management.19:54
Leanderfor some reason, my laptop can't use dhcp both on eth0 and wlan0, which was working fine right before I start traveling (because... where's the fun otherwise, I guess)19:55
furrywolfyou might have to make sure one interface is down before getting an ip on the other, or you could end up with broken routing.19:56
LeanderI use ifup and ifdown extensively, I don't think it's just a routing problem19:57
KatolaZLeander: how many default gw do you have?19:57
KatolaZdhclient will normally set one for every interface it gets a lease19:58
Leanderwell, right now it's working and I have just one, while it wasn't working I had none19:58
Leanderthe problem was: I never got a lease in the first place19:58
Leanderdhclient keeps sending UDP packets, but I'm not quite sure they ever leave my laptop19:58
LeanderI don't see a single packet in iptables19:59
KatolaZLeander: you can't see anything in iptables....19:59
furrywolfDocScrutinizer51:  you should read that pdf.  :)19:59
KatolaZdhcp happens at level 219:59
* furrywolf kicks bitchx19:59
DocScrutinizer05hmm, why?20:00
furrywolfshows you how freenode staff think.  heh.20:01
furrywolftry arguing with anyone who would ever write something like that.  :)20:01
Leanderdhcp works on udp, ports 67 and 68, so I assume iptables should report something when I make it log them?20:01
Leanderor is it short-circuited in the kernel?20:01
KatolaZLeander: to get an IP, dhcp uses an ad-hoc level-2 broadcast frame20:02
KatolaZdhcp is actually the best example of level-2.5 service :D20:02
LeanderI thought that frame was actually a special UDP packet20:02
LeanderI never looked into the details20:03
KatolaZLeander: how do you send a UDP packet if you don't have an IP?20:03
KatolaZ(and how would you receive one, worse?)20:03
Leanderyou broadcast to and there's your mac address in the level 2 header?20:03
furrywolfbroadcast the request, get it back directed at your mac address20:04
KatolaZyou can get the frame back20:05
furrywolfthe server could also broadcast back the offer, but I think mac-based is more common20:05
KatolaZ(the level-2 frame)20:05
KatolaZthat's why it's a level-2.5 protocol20:05
Leandersorry it's dinner time, I'll let you discuss the specifics of dhcp, I'll take that time to think more calmly about what could be wrong on my side20:05
KatolaZthe UDP datagram is only the format used inside the level-2 frame20:05
* furrywolf hasn't fucked with dhcp in a long time20:05
doomcupOn how to prevent the spam bots: make an IRC channel registered users only. The downside is anybody wanting on a channel would have to register, but this also means you don't have drivebys20:06
doomcupAt least not by unregistered bots20:06
furrywolfthere's plenty of spambots with registered nicks these days20:06
furrywolfand it pisses off normal people, prevents new users from asking for help, etc.20:06
* unmy is happy with 'udhcpc' since isc-dhcp client was making problems and didn't feel that wanna investigate it more...20:06
doomcupI've been on another server where those specific bots are popping up, and they're not in the channels that requre a registered nick20:07
KatolaZwe don't need to restrict this channel to registered users20:07
KatolaZthis is a support channel20:07
doomcupFair, I'm just talking20:07
KatolaZdoomcup: I see your point though20:09
dudlikeIs it ok to be here. Also if I havent  any question now. I am new and just looking around20:09
furrywolfbrb, wolfy food20:09
KatolaZmany channels allow only registered nicks20:09
unixmandudlike, idling in an IRC channel is encouraged behavior. There are over 200 accounts idling in this channel right now. ;)20:17
unixmanIf you want to see epic idling, #bash regularly has over 1000 accounts idling there.20:18
dudlikeShould I go out?20:18
unixmandudlike, no, stay. I am joking around. But idling here to watch what goes on before participating is a good idea.20:19
dudlikeYes, I thing Its proper entertainment for me20:19
KatolaZdudlike: why should you?20:19
KatolaZ(I mean, why should you go out?)20:20
dudlikeIt will sound stupid, but its my first visiting of IRC channel. So I dont know what is normal behavior here. I did for 7 years all that hard rtfm work and now I decided to connect some people :-)20:21
dudlikeI meant contact20:22
DocScrutinizer05furrywolf: what's wrong with this NDA?20:22
nkk71Hey, I thought you guys might be interested in this blog by freenode staff member Bryan 'kloeri' Ostergaard
DocScrutinizer05furrywolf: btw I tried once more a 5 min ago, this time completely avoiding the nasty F* word ("filter") ;-P  >>[25.07.18 20:17:21] <DocScrutinizer05> some sort of "fastpath" for sigyn would be nice - so in ideal case the kline arrives at server before the triggering transaction gets committed (msg deployed) and thus the incomplete transaction could get rolled back<<20:24
dudlikeIs Devuan often used for carrying on servers, or people often use more famous and better supported distributions?20:26
KatolaZdudlike: devuan is running on a lot of servers20:27
dudlikeThat's what I could expect :-)20:28
dudlikeIs Devuan also good for desktops and audio stations? Similar as Debian. I use Debian for three years and everything works for me.20:30
dudlikeI will install it as virtual and I ll see20:32
dudlikeCan you recommend me some room, where I could find out something interesting?20:34
dudlikeNext time I'll try something to the point.20:39
KatolaZdudlike: what do you mean?20:40
dudlikeFor example solving some problems, what is planned, how could one participate, although I havent much time anyway.20:43
KatolaZdudlike: is one place to start from20:45
KatolaZor the DNG mailing list20:45
KatolaZdudlike: but please feel free to ask here as well20:47
dudlikeFine :-)20:48
Guest63153Hey, I thought you guys might be interested in this blog by freenode staff member Bryan 'kloeri' Ostergaard
Guest63153or maybe this blog by freenode staff member Matthew 'mst' Trout
Guest63153Read what IRC investigative journalists have uncovered on the freenode pedophilia scandal
fsmithreddudlike, I have a devuan audio (recording) laptop in a radio station. Running rivendell and using audacity for recording. Nobody has complained.21:00
fsmithredum, actually, there are two running devuan now. Server is still running wheezy.21:01
dudlike:-) Thats where I started wheezy and ubuntu 10.421:01
fsmithredone glitch I've noticed is that every release upgrade, there's a different syntax to change the order of the sound cards.21:02
fsmithreddamned hdmi tries to be first. We're using external audio interface.21:02
fsmithredbut that's not specific to devuan.21:02
dudlikeThank you for reply.21:02
dudlikeYes, I ll take care. Where can I start when I am looking for professional sound card for recording?21:04
fsmithredthere are a couple of linux audio websites21:04
fsmithredforum, hardware info21:05
fsmithredwe're using Komplete Audio K621:05
fsmithredthere's a red one that people like, too. Can't remember the name.21:05
fsmithredsome are using old m-audio (?)21:05
fsmithredmackie sound boards work as usb audio, too. Plug and play21:06
fsmithredhigh-end professional stuff works less often with linux21:07
fsmithredyou recording music?21:07
dudlikeI play music, but I want to record it :-)21:07
fsmithreddo some research21:08
fsmithredI have to go carry stuff. back in a bit.21:08
dudlikeyes, thanks21:08
LewsThanThree6Hey, I thought you guys might be interested in this blog by freenode staff member Bryan 'kloeri' Ostergaard
Me450218Hey, I thought you guys might be interested in this blog by freenode staff member Bryan 'kloeri' Ostergaard
Me450218or maybe this blog by freenode staff member Matthew 'mst' Trout
Me450218Read what IRC investigative journalists have uncovered on the freenode pedophilia scandal
drakythe26Hey, I thought you guys might be interested in this blog by freenode staff member Bryan 'kloeri' Ostergaard
drakythe26or maybe this blog by freenode staff member Matthew 'mst' Trout
puff7Hey, I thought you guys might be interested in this blog by freenode staff member Bryan 'kloeri' Ostergaard
yaymuffins16Hey, I thought you guys might be interested in this blog by freenode staff member Bryan 'kloeri' Ostergaard
yaymuffins16or maybe this blog by freenode staff member Matthew 'mst' Trout
fsmithredwtf with all the spam today?23:56
golinuxNo shit23:56
golinuxThat's all that's been happening all sft.23:56
golinuxcome talk to blinkdog on jitsi!23:57
fsmithredI'm gonna take a walk to the supermarket and hardware store. Oh! is it wednesday?23:57
fsmithredI can do audio only, probably for a few minutes23:58
fsmithredneed link23:58
blinkdogno pad
DocScrutinizer05I gonna tweak chanmodes temporarily23:58
fsmithredoh, I have it23:58
fsmithredwe need to shoot them before they get to say anything23:59
DocScrutinizer05^^^ unidentified users are only visible to chanops23:59
DocScrutinizer05fsmithred: not possible23:59
golinuxI suggested that.23:59

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