freenode/#devuan/ Wednesday, 2019-04-03

Digitgot my firefox held at an older version to keep using the policeman addon (not willing to be forced to ublock or whatever alternative).  faaaar from ideal.  itching to find other again.  got a midori i sometimes use, and wonder/dream about imbuing it with that policeman/ublock alike features.  uzbl also on my radar, but when browsing, often want something lazy-clicky not needing exotic keybinds for everything.04:28
plasma41Digit, I've been eyeing Waterfox as a candidate for my next web browser.04:35
* Digit does an apt-get update and apt-get install waterfox, to be greeted with "E: Unable to locate package waterfox", ending his lazy poke of trying it.04:45
xrogaanthat mike individual is slowly starting to get on my nerves.07:56
Jookiadevuan doesn't have ARM installers, only images?08:06
Wonkaxrogaan: that Lennart individual is still worse :p08:54
cosurgiQuestion: was that a hack or a stupid april fools joke?13:18
debdogneither13:23
hightower2cosurgi, a very inappropriate april fools joke13:25
MinceRs/inappropriate/funny/13:40
hightower3MinceR, while I don't agree at all with overly lengthy discussions about it on the mailing list and everywhere, the inability to reach a general agreement that this "joke" was terrible and should never happen again is genuinely disturbing.14:14
MinceRit disturbes those who believe that it was terrible and should never happen again, though14:15
MinceRthen again, it would be pointless to make the same joke again, so i guess i agree with that part14:15
MinceRs/bes/bs/14:15
xinomilothe inability to reach a general agreement that this "joke" was funny and should happen again is genuinely disturbing.14:17
xinomilowe're all right, let it go and move on with something serious14:18
hightower3by 'never again' I meant to include everything that would be similar as well. One of serious problems with this "joke" was that I was reading about it in the morning/noon hours of Mar 31st (i.e. not April 1). Also, some people tried to explain that if anyone visited devuan.org they could see that there was no actual javascript in the page and that it was a joke. However, I didn't visit devuan.org because I have no business visiting sup14:18
hightower3posedly compromised websites. Also, I came here to check if the incident was genuine, only to see people from the Devuan team acting legitimately concerned. And finally, it caused me great unrest thinking about which systems did I have with "automatic updates" enabled.14:18
MinceRwell, the timing was a bit off14:19
MinceRstill, it became clear to me pretty quickly that it was april fools14:19
MinceRnot only because of the timing but because gopher is something devuan's enemies wouldn't like and the gopherhole had too much content14:20
hightower3I didn't go to visit any of the (supposedly) compromised content. The only clue I had about this being a joke is that last month I visited parazyd's website and there he had a sentence like (paraphrasing) "stop using obsolete protocol http. Switch to gopher".14:21
hightower3a much more appropriate/harmless joke would have been a note about e.g. devuan switching to systemd. Or if that one would have been too obvious, they could have made a joke about e.g. Microsoft striking a deal to employ all key devuan developers, or that Microsoft wants to create a Linux distribution based on Devuan, or something of that nature...14:23
MinceRthose are probably all too obvious and worn out14:24
hightower3well... with all the effort and persistence in the security incident joke, they sure could have figured something else too14:25
MinceRand you would complain about that too14:38
WonkaI thought this was a nice April Fool's Joke.14:40
Wonkawell, no, I still think it was a good joke.14:42
xrogaanIt's not about the joke not being funny, it's about the joke being too serious.15:04
xrogaanAh ah, I get it, a fack pwned page. Great. Can I work now?15:04
xrogaanwork or find information or whatever.15:05
xrogaanswitching to systemd is too obvious for a April 1st. Would have been better to announce that Xorg would be deprecated in favor of devuan's own fork of wayland.15:06
xrogaanAnd claim that it will revolutionize the linux world by bringing much needed changes.15:07
MinceR:)15:08
g4570n!ping16:20
infobot~pong16:20
ashleykpnog?17:07
msiisma while back i noticed a strange behavior of pmount when using tab auto-completion on the device name, namely that it would hang when you hit the tab key and require you to hit ctrl+c zu "unhang" it in order to type the rest of the device name.17:26
msiismwhen i mentioned this in a discussion about pmount in this channel, no one seemed to have seen the problem and i wasn't able to reproduce it. however, it just happened again. so, there is some problem, obviously.17:27
msiismto be more specific: the device i'm trying to mount is /dev/sdb1, when if type `pmount /de` and hit tab, it will hang. the same goes for hitting tab after `pmount /dev`.17:28
msiisms/if/i17:29
gnarfacemsiism: completely normal.  if the possible completions in their pretty simple algorithm exceed what is in the filesystem cache, it has to go back to read the hardrive to refresh the cache.  if there's a lot of possible completions, you will notice some delay17:30
gnarfaceyou can customize the auto-completion behavior in bash but i've never really messed much with the defaults17:30
gnarfacepeople who want more control over it use zsh instead17:30
msiismi believe this is not what this is about. there's no delay. it simply hangs until you hit ctrl+c, and then fills in what it should have filled in when you hit the tab key.17:33
gnarfaceoh17:33
gnarfacehmm, that is weird17:33
msiismalso, if this was a bash auto-completion issue, it would be easily reproducibale, i guess. this problem however isn't.17:33
ashleykuse another terminal to check resource usage while its hanging17:33
ashleykor figure out how to use strace17:34
gnarfaceyea, if it was a harddrive cache issue, you'd expect the I/O light to blink17:34
msiismas for temrinals: all instances of urxvt on the same user account have the problem now. however, on my other user account the problem is not reproducible (both users were logged in before the device was plugged in and both use urxvt).17:35
gnarfacecould it be some weird whitespace character in a custom prompt that shouldn't be there, or something like that?17:36
msiismthe prompt is the standard one, as far as i can see in ~/.bashrc17:38
msiismalso, pmount is the only command for which i have ever seen that problem.17:38
msiismjust tried xterm. same result.17:39
gnarfacehmm. weird17:39
gnarfacei don't have pmount installed17:39
gnarfacebut i wonder what makes it get treated differently17:40
gnarfacedo you have anything weird listed for it in /etc/bash_completion.d/ ?17:40
msiismfile `pmount` exists there, interesting...17:41
gnarfacecheck it17:41
gnarfacemaybe it will be ... computationally heavy somehow17:42
msiismare you running ASCII?17:42
gnarfaceyes just not on this machine i'm on right now17:42
gnarfacehmm, but i don't have pmount on the nearest ascii box either17:43
msiismwell, this file was last touched on 18 may 2014. i have never modified it.17:43
gnarfaceit must not be a required package17:43
msiismno, it's totally optional17:43
gnarfacewell maybe the contents of /dev changed in some way though that affects it17:43
gnarfacei don't have anything else matching /d* or /de*, for example either...17:43
msiismstill, it shouldn't hang at `/dev`, since the only thing it would have to do there is adding a slash.17:44
gnarfacedo you have anything else in your / that starts with "d" ?17:44
msiismno17:44
gnarfaceif it's hanging at /dev instead of /de, then it would make sense that it has to be the contents of /dev it's not happy with17:44
gnarfaceand a kernel change or just plugging in a bunch of usb devices might change the number of things showing up in there, as well as the amount of nested directory recursion required to cache it all17:45
gnarfacehmm17:45
gnarfacei wonder if there could be a weird character in a filename in there it doesn't like17:45
msiismhanging on `/dev` (without the trailing slash) already is quite strange, though. i mean, there's really just a slash to add.17:46
msiismand this ia also what pmount does on the other user account.17:46
gnarfacedoes it do the same thing if you type out /dev/ all the way then hit tab?17:47
msiism`/de`, `/dev` and `/dev/`all lead to the same problem.17:48
gnarfaceweird17:48
gnarfaceit does suggest the contents of /dev/ are what it doesn't like17:48
msiismif i hit tab on `/dev/` in the other account it just reacts normally, saying: "Display all 158 possibilities? (y or n)"17:50
gnarfacehmm17:50
gnarfaceso that's interesting17:50
gnarfacecould it be a permissions issue somehow?17:50
ashleykread this crap: https://www.phoronix.com/forums/forum/phoronix/general-discussion/1083082-systemd-free-debian-devuan-planning-their-first-developer-gathering-this-spring?p=1083165#post108316517:51
msiismgnarface: i don't think so.17:51
gnarfaceit would be a file that has no read access in there for one of the users, or a directory that is missing read and execute, for just that one user.... i think17:51
msiismgnarface: but that should not affect autocompletion in any way.17:52
gnarfacei guess i don't know that for sure17:52
gnarfaceif it's trying to recurse directories in there to tab-complete17:52
ashleykdo it17:53
msiismgnarface: well, i don't think it does and still, if it would, /dev/sdb1 would no need such recursion. i just hope this is a problem related to the autocomplete script, not to pmount.17:55
msiismlet's see if i have zsh installed17:55
gnarfaceso if you type pmount /dev/sd and then hit tab, does it still delay heavily?17:55
gnarfacei wonder if it's just a variation in drive response times to respond with the partition counts17:56
ashleykdoes pmount vs mount make a difference in the auto complete?17:56
msiismgnarface: it's not about delay. it stops completely, like being stuck in an endless loop.17:56
gnarfaceright, right.. hmmm...17:57
ashleykwhy not strace a bash17:57
ashleykand blindly do the bug, and see what it spams endlessly17:57
msiismok, zsh on the account there the problem occurs does not have the problem. going back to bash in the same temrinal gets me back to having the problem. that's a strong hint towards the problem being with the completion script.17:58
msiisms/there/where17:58
ashleykwhy settle for hints when you can find out for sure17:58
msiismashleyk: right. so let's use strace. how is that done?17:59
* msiism reads `man strace`18:00
ashleykwell probably just strace /bin/bash, and then blindly, as i said, recreate the bug, and most likely (if it traces the completion script) it will be spamming something over and over again18:05
ashleykand that will be what it is stuck on18:05
msiismhere we go: https://bpaste.net/show/2546208900c118:05
ashleykhmm, so it doesnt get stuck in a loop then?18:06
ashleykjust prints that once, eh18:06
msiismyes, that's all it gives me after hitting tab.18:07
tuxd3vHello guys18:07
msiism...and then after hitting crtl+c18:08
tuxd3vstill stuck eith Uboot18:08
tuxd3vdoesn any one knows what is the default baudrate for seryal?18:08
tuxd3vsunxi-common.h18:08
tuxd3vhttps://paste2.org/sUnh8ZxU18:08
gnarfacetuxd3v: the max is the default these days18:08
tuxd3vcould I be correct: 150000018:08
ashleykis it 15000018:08
gnarfaceuh no18:08
gnarfacethat's way above the max18:09
ashleyk:D18:09
gnarfacetry it with 11520018:09
tuxd3vIt doesn't show up18:09
gnarfaceoh, hmmm18:09
gnarfacewell on my pine book that's what wokred18:09
gnarfaceworked18:09
tuxd3vwhat I did:18:10
tuxd3vdd if=/dev/zero of=/dev/mmcblk0 bs=1k count=1023 seek=118:10
tuxd3vdd if=/home/rock64/u-boot-sunxi-with-spl.bin of=/dev/mmcblk0 bs=1024 seek=818:10
ashleyki got devuan on my nanopc-t4, so im happy :)18:10
ashleykdidnt try serial18:10
tuxd3vnice!18:10
gnarfacetuxd3v: drop bs, count, and seek from your first dd if you're trying to actually zero that whole sd card18:10
tuxd3vI am trying to zero the first 1MB or so18:11
tuxd3vwere fits the ubbot18:11
tuxd3vuboot18:11
gnarfacebut you skipped over it18:11
gnarfacei think...18:11
gnarfaceor at least the first block18:11
gnarfaceanyway i'm not sure that' what you want to do18:11
gnarfacejust zero the whole thing18:11
ashleykskips the first 1k18:11
gnarfacefor my pinebook the last thing stopping the serial terminal from working was just that i wasn't aware i had to actually add a kernel command-line variable to define it18:12
gnarfaceand i think something to /etc/inittab?18:12
gnarfacei forget now, i gotta stop doing that stuff drunk, or just keep better notes...18:12
ashleyklol18:12
ashleyktaking notes while drunk sounds realistic18:13
gnarfacebut for sure the kernel command-line parameter was needed18:14
ashleykgnarface, where did you set that?18:14
gnarfaceum, good question.  it would be /etc/default/grub on a pc.... but for arm hardware...18:14
ashleykdoes uboot pass that, or is it built into the kernel18:14
gnarfacesomewhere in uboot i'd have to guess18:15
ashleyki know how rpi and odroid work, but im not sure about this uboot stuff18:15
ashleykk thx18:15
gnarfaceor somewhere in the /boot partition at least, yea18:15
ashleykheh, i think /boot is blank18:15
ashleykprobably getting more common18:15
gnarfaceah yes18:19
gnarfaceboot.scr18:19
gnarfaceboot.scr, that's where the kernel command line goes on my pinebook, ashleyk, tuxd3v18:19
ashleykwhere is that file?18:19
ashleykon a fat partition or in /boot on a linux partition or in the uboot build dir... heh i dont know the basics18:20
gnarfaceit's one of the files you have to dd to the early sectors of the disk manually, for my pinebook.  though it would be different for other arm devices.  on rpi devices for example, you just add it to a text file in /boot18:20
gnarfacearm stuff doesn't seem to have settled on standard behaviors for this type of stuff.  it's quickly one of the first things you miss about a PC is having a proper BIOS18:21
tuxd3vyes boot.scr is the compiled version of boot.cmd text file with kernel boot args18:22
tuxd3vbut some use Uenv.txt18:22
gnarfacehmm. yea18:22
tuxd3vuEnv.txt18:22
gnarfacei did it with the boot.cmd18:22
tuxd3vothers use boot.cmd18:22
ashleykheh, right on, thanks18:23
tuxd3vthen you need to pass the boot.cmd from text to bynary18:23
tuxd3vwhich will be boot .scr18:23
tuxd3vboot.scr18:23
gnarfacesetenv bootargs console=ttyS0,115200 console=tty0 root=/dev/mmcblk2p2 net.ifnames=0 rootwait panic=1018:24
gnarfaceso here's the kernel command-line i put in there18:25
gnarfacenote "console=" defined twice18:25
gnarfacethe first one being the serial one18:25
gnarfacefor the *pinebook* 115200 was what i was told was the maximum, though i didn't test at higher speeds18:25
gnarfacei thought that was actually the maximum standard value but my google searches tell me that later, faster speeds were added to the standard18:27
gnarfaceyou may still have trouble going faster than 115200 over gator clips to coat hanger wire though....18:28
ashleykheh are you remote viewing tuxd3v18:37
tuxd3vonly black18:56
tuxd3v:S18:56
tuxd3vI added bl32 from arm18:58
tuxd3vfor secure boot18:58
tuxd3vmaybe that its messing with something here..18:59
tuxd3vbl3118:59
gnarfacewell it has to be the right version18:59
gnarfacethere's basically two major branches going18:59
gnarfacethere's the commercial branch based on some ancient 3.x kernel using official firmware, which is what all the commercial vendors still use because of android18:59
gnarfaceand then there's the "mainline" branch going for more modern kernel support19:00
gnarfacebut all the little bits inbetween aren't cross-compatible19:00
tuxd3vyeah19:00
gnarfaceu-boot and all it's dozen or so forks included19:00
tuxd3vI am on mailine kernel plus master branch of uboot19:01
tuxd3vthe standard..19:01
gnarfaceso you have to make sure you're getting atf, bl32, dtb, and whatever else, are for the exact right versions19:01
gnarfacei'm using someone's 4th party patches for a 3rd party fork of u-boot called "das u-boot"19:01
gnarface(and accompanying dtb and kernel patches)19:02
gnarfacewhen i set it up, there was no mainline support for the hardware though19:02
gnarfacei think it's been recently merged or will be merged soon into kernel 5.x but ymmv for your hardware19:02
gnarfaceyou might still need some 3rd party patches19:02
tuxd3vyeah it could be the case here19:03
enychrrm19:10
enycdevuan mirror failing?19:10
enycE: Failed to fetch http://debian.bio.lmu.de/debian/pool/main/l/linux/linux-compiler-gcc-6-x86_4.19.28-2~bpo9+1_amd64.deb  404  Not Found [IP: 2001:4ca0:4300::1:22 80]19:10
enycE: Failed to fetch http://debian.bio.lmu.de/debian/pool/main/l/linux/linux-kbuild-4.19_4.19.28-2~bpo9+1_amd64.deb  404  Not Found [IP: 2001:4ca0:4300::1:22 80]19:10
enycErr:1 http://deb.devuan.org//merged ascii-backports/main amd64 linux-compiler-gcc-6-x86 amd64 4.19.28-2~bpo9+119:11
gnarfaceenyc: maybe, or maybe it's just in the middle of an update.  deb.devuan.org is a round-robin though, so i wouldn't panic unless it happens twice in a row19:13
gnarfaceif you just try again, it should pick a different mirror and work19:13
stiltrgnarface: I was pretty sure "das u-boot" == "u-boot"...?19:17
gnarfacestiltr: i thought i had read otherwise, but it's possible nobody is using the original for mainline support anymore19:18
gnarfaceor i could have just read it wrong19:18
stiltrYou could be right. I don't know for sure.19:19
stiltrAccording to wikipedia they're the same...19:22
stiltrhttps://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Das_U-Boot#History19:22
enycgnarface: happened 3 times so fa...19:24
gnarfaceenyc: hmm.  that's disturbing.  your sources.list is deb.devuan.org right?19:25
enycdeb     http://gb.deb.devuan.org/merged/ ascii-backports main contrib non-free19:25
enycdeb-src http://gb.deb.devuan.org/merged/ ascii-backports main contrib non-free19:25
enycand same for -updates -security -main19:25
enyc-proposed is in /devual/ inshead19:26
enyctho when i 'apt-get update'  it only talks about  deb.devuan.org  rather than gb. ...19:26
enycand indeed when you do the 'get' it downloads various -security pfilesa nd he 2 -backpots packages, fail ...19:27
enycit may be backports specific issue, possibly.19:27
gnarfaceyea, the country-specific redirects are not customized yet to countries, i don't think19:28
gnarfacethere's only like 13 mirrors19:28
gnarfacebut you do want to make sure your dns is up to date on them19:29
enycI don't have any local dns overrides or special extra dns caching19:29
enycjust, normal compliant dns resolvers19:29
enycand forwarders19:30
enycdebian mirrors carrying linux-compiler-gcc-6-x86_4.19.28-2~bpo9+1_amd64.deb ok19:30
enycaaah  it seems like the undperpininng  debian morrir is not updating the  backported package hrrm19:31
enychttps://mirror-master.debian.org/status/mirror-status.html19:32
enycdoes not list debian.bio.lmu.de at all ....19:32
enycso either theres' some multi level redirect going on that i don't understand   or   devuan directing to an undelpful debian package mirror19:33
gnarfaceenyc: well, there is redirects.  the devuan servers redirect to debian servers for unchanged packages19:36
gnarface(which is still most of them)19:36
enycgnarface: which debian services and which devuan personnell manage that?19:37
enyci suspect a fault or  somehow got 'stuck' on wrong debian.bio.lmu.de target or so19:37
gnarfacecan i see your sources.list?  can you paste it to paste.debian.net?19:37
enyci already gave you relevant lines above but19:37
gnarfacealso make sure you don't have anything extraneous in sources.list.d/19:37
gnarfacei just wanna see the whole thing to be sure19:38
gnarfaceyou're probably right, it's probably a down mirror19:38
gnarfacebut there should be plenty to go around unless your ISP is blocking the majority of them somehow19:38
gnarfacein fact, you might want to just try it with pkgmaster.devuan.org instead to be sure19:38
enyc^^ as gnarface confirms  looks like devuan issue with redirctor19:49
enyc-> -> devuan-dev channel?19:49
gnarfacemaybe, or just ask KatolaZ or Centurion_Dan if they know about it19:50
msiismenyc: sure, you can try.19:50
gnarfacenot sure if they're around right now19:50
gnarfaceenyc: did you try it against pkgmaster.devuan.org instead of deb.devuan.org ot see if it works differently?19:50
enycgnarface: no ... can try19:51
enycgnarface: successful rertrieve via Get:1 http://pkgmaster.devuan.org/merged ascii-backports/main amd64 linux-compiler-gcc-6-x86 amd64 4.19.28-2~bpo9+1 [241 kB]19:53
gnarfaceenyc: vaguely suggests to me a DNS problem upstream of you.  you're using your ISP DNS servers, right?  they could have implemented abnormally high caching for load reasons19:54
enycgnarface: no, not that sort of isp19:55
ashleykthat phoronix thread about the devuan dev conference is a shitshow20:24
specingsomebody contact green hat hackers about it :)20:28
ashleykah i see a post from tuxd3v :D20:29
ashleykwhere do these people come from20:33
ashleykwatch what i can do20:33
ashleyk"I think at this point it's clear to see that mental illness and anti-systemd behaviour are related. No valid argument against it has ever been presented to this day.20:33
ashleyk"20:33
ashleyk"I think at this point it's clear to see that mental illness and anti-ObamaCare behaviour are related. No valid argument against it has ever been presented to this day."20:34
ashleyklol20:34
ashleyksorry, its a devuan thread, but i guess these people are from california or something because they all sound the same20:36
gnarfacespam bots20:37
gnarfacepaid shills20:37
ashleyksome of them sure seem paid, or otherwise like full on communist sympathizers20:37
ashleykits just annoying when people say stuff like "the science is settled" or whatever20:38
gnarfaceonce you recognize how hard they are trying to squash it and how hard they are trying to make it look "natural" it's easy to see how bad they are at pretending to even be human.  unfortunately, the stupider 70% of the population will latch on to this and go with it due to the perception that it is peer pressure20:38
redrickCalifornia folk snakker det samme?  (California people all sound the same?)20:38
ashleykand no one can question anything they are forcing on everyone20:38
ashleykchange for the sake of destroying what is good20:40
redrickAnyway, trolls gotta troll, and Web reader comment threads are, in general, where souls go to die.20:40
ashleykseems the trend20:40
ashleykits like the monsanto internet defense team got redirected to defend redhat20:41
gnarfacewell in all likelyhood they are in fact hiring the exact same guerilla PR agency20:42
ashleykliterally20:43
ashleykand btw, the centos and rhel irc channels are some of the most elitist authoritarian irc channels on freenode20:43
ashleykibm buys redhat, bayer buys monsanto   all scum20:44
ashleykbayer sold aids infected childrens medication on purpose, and ibm programmed the holocaust machines on purpose20:45
ashleykmonsanto sold glyphosate (carcinogen) on purpose20:45
ashleykredhat created systemd on purpose20:45
ashleykjust the facts20:45
ashleyktbh glyphosate is far worse than a carcinogen, but do your own research on that, they are just losing lawsuits for it being a carcinogen as a smokescreen from its worse effects20:46
gnarfaceashleyk: you're probably not wrong, but you should rant in #debianfork instead of here20:49
ashleykyeap20:49
ashleyki know, but cant delete from irc...and didnt want to leave out anything :p20:50
specingibm is cool, power9 cpus are by far the most open you can get21:07
specingeven foss microcode21:07
msiismashleyk: don't get what this all has to do with communism, though. it might have with your idea of it, ok. but, imho, it's not the most clever thing to throw these things out in public.21:07
MinceRibm ceased to be cool when they bought red hat, if they were cool before that21:07
ashleykmsiism, sorry for ranting, but also keep an eye on what is going on in the rest of the OSS "community"21:08
ashleykand tell me im wrong21:08
msiismashleyk: no thanks.21:08
msiisms/no/no,21:09
ashleykok then be uninformed21:09
ashleyknext they will takeover the kernel, then force code of conduct on everyone (which is very hypocritical), then continue ranting about the meritocracy and patriarchy or w/e, but hey, just defend them :)21:11
gnarfacewell, IBM actually might care more about CPU security than Intel21:11
gnarfaceand that might actually be a reason to side with them for now21:11
msiismashleyk: just let it go, i'm not gonna enter into such a debate. i have better things to do.21:11
gnarface(not on the redhat thing, but at least on the power9 thing)21:12
ashleykmsiism, good one21:12
gnarfacei don't think IBM is actually the driving force behind what RedHat is doing, i think they are just opportunists.  i could be wrong though.21:12
msiismashleyk: if you want to troll, choose another channel.21:13
ashleykliterally derp21:13
* unixman makes popcorn21:14
ashleyktry to control someones speech, then say you dont want to debate it, then call someone a troll, then /quit21:15
ashleykgnarface, well ibm saw the value in redhat only recently i guess...21:15
unixmanWell, TBH, this is not the channel for that debate / discussion, ashleyk. If it is Devaun related, Devuan support question for example, that goes here. Otherwise, not.21:17
ashleykunixman, yeah i know, quit bringing it up unless you want to debate me in PM21:17
ashleykor just /quit if you want to be a troll21:17
unixmanashleyk, Red Hat and IBM for example are not Devuan.21:18
ashleykunixman, pm me if you want to discuss21:19
MinceR03 211254 < gnarface> i don't think IBM is actually the driving force behind what RedHat is doing, i think they are just opportunists.21:20
MinceRneither did they stop it21:20
MinceRthen again, wikipedia says it's "(pending)"21:20
MinceRso maybe i jumped the gun here21:21
unixmanI don't care about the Red Hat, et cetera, "discussion", frankly. Anyway, I'm just driving by to see why the channel is highlighted. BBL21:21
MinceRi want red hat to be wiped from the face of the universe21:21
ashleykunixman, yeah my bad, i was just ranting / drawing correlations between the tactics used by anti-(init)-freedom people in the devuan developer gathering phoronix thread...the tactics are the fingerprint21:22
ashleykNEWS!21:25
ashleykHi there, This is already something that is on our radar. We see this as an opportunity for a non-systemd distro which would be a great alternative to what we currently offer.  We don't have any definite plans yet but hopefully we will soon. When that happens we'll make a public announcement. Regards, AJ de Leon Linode Support Team21:25
ashleykmy linode ticket got a response21:25
MinceRnice21:26
ashleykand i didnt even mention systemd21:27
ashleykapparently they "get it" :)21:28
Digitlol.  the april fools gopherhole got some folks upset?!  XD  and still causing fallout?  XD lol.  less funny was the suggestion: " a much more appropriate/harmless joke would have been a note about e.g. devuan switching to systemd."  noooooo.  gopher was whimsical.  dont want pro-systemd misinformation perchance taking root in the soft minded.22:12
rwpI think it was the statement that the devuan site was p0wned that was most worriesome.22:14
rwpIt Trust is hard to gain but easy to lose.22:14
rwp*Trust is hard to gain but easy to lose.22:14
gnarfaceit goes both ways though22:20
gnarfacepeople still parroting as fact that it was a real breach, months in the future, will expose themselves as enemy agents or pawns of them22:21
furrywolfmy april fools day joke was sending a fake email to all our drivers announcing the truck wouldn't be in until 4:01pm, each person had 401 stops, the forecast was for 4.01 inches of rain, and from now on in addition to a signature, every delivery would need social security number and date of birth.  the last words of it were "april fools".  at least one person believed it.22:21
furrywolfsoft-mindedness is not rare, sadly...22:21
unixmana. One hears that Devuan web site was pwned. b. One wobbles. c. One hears it was an April Fool's joke. d. One recovers. If "d." doesn't happen then One has a personal problem.22:22
furrywolfspeaking of which..  bbl, work.22:22
ashleyksigh, devuan mailinglist is marked as Junk Mail.23:01
tuxd3vNeed to get 2X4GB ddr2 asap..23:07
tuxd3vmy Xeon is killing me with only 4GB23:08
tuxd3v:D23:08
nemotuxd3v: yeah, you definitely need more. memory is dirt cheap these days23:11
nemoHDs are much snappier w/ like 16-32 gigs of commonly accessed stuff in RAM ☺23:11
ashleykmy laptop has 16gb, and its barely enough23:12
tuxd3vyeah It will have another life23:16
tuxd3v(GB its the minimum nowadays, I have in my desktop 32 Gb, and its awesome23:17
tuxd3vbut for compiling code, I like this machine23:17
tuxd3vwith 4GB its almost madness to compile big projects here23:17
tuxd3v*8GB*23:18
tuxd3vBut Ram is also danger...becasue of the cache..23:18
tuxd3vWhen you moove big amounts of data23:18
enycx201-tablet with 8gb ram max bah!23:19
tuxd3vI still prefer a Xeon :)23:19
enyctuxd3v: =)23:25
tuxd3v<ashleyk>, I saw you talking about phoronix thread..23:26
tuxd3vI was too naive, in a lot of aspects..23:26
tuxd3vit was dirty, but I lerned the lesson23:26
tuxd3vlearned23:26
ashleyki didnt read the whole thread yet...just saw your first post in it23:27
tuxd3vrecently gentoo guys suceded in freeing Gnome 3 from systemd last piece also with elogind23:29
ashleyk!23:29
ashleyki havent given gentoo a thought since like 200523:29
MinceRtoo bad elogind stinks23:29
MinceRit at least used to kill processes when you logged out, which was fucked up when systemd did it too23:30

Generated by irclog2html.py 2.17.0 by Marius Gedminas - find it at https://mg.pov.lt/irclog2html/!