freenode/#devuan/ Thursday, 2020-02-13

DarwinElfi don't need all that; just building software (as I said earlier) that doesn't use that... only need the OS, not the bind mounts...00:02
gnarfaceoh, well then you can skip them00:03
gnarfacei don't actually know for sure that you don't need them, but you might be right00:04
tuxd3vwhat confuses me is  that they indeed provide a kernel address to load, and they even specify a initrd address too,00:04
tuxd3vbut they forgot about fdt_addr_r00:04
DarwinElfi know for sure; it's ZNC; nothing kernel-based00:04
tuxd3vsorry all, wrong chanel :S00:04
gnu_srs1Hi again: Anybody running a lxc/docker/podman? container? Please, report the output of: cat /proc/1/sched | head -n 100:24
tuxd3vhello, maybe I deleted the package, what is the default calculator that comes in devuan xfce desktop?00:37
gnarfacedunno but i like galculator00:43
specingforget about these, run octave-cli in a drop-down terminal00:43
specingbest calculator ever00:44
gnarfacehmm, noted00:44
tuxd3vgnarface, maybe its gcalculator that comes with xfce preinstalled01:00
tuxd3vI don't really know01:00
tuxd3vbut I don't ind it in i386 image01:00
tuxd3vI am migrating to i386 :)01:00
tuxd3vonly 4 GB Ram ddr201:01
tuxd3vspecing, octave is really nice01:01
tuxd3vbut for terminal one can use just 'bc'01:01
gnarfacewell i see the word "calculator" repeated 80 times in the ceres repo01:01
tuxd3vbc <<<'2+3'01:02
tuxd3vhehehe, I am still in ascii01:02
tuxd3vand I wanted to install the default one :)01:02
tuxd3vbut I don't remember..I have here the old image I will reboot maybe tomorrow and check on it what is the default calculator app :)01:02
gnarfacei dunno what it is.  all i can suggest is run this and see if one looks familiar: apt-cache search calculator01:03
gnarfaceor maybe this will shorten the list without removing the one you're looking for:  apt-cache search scientific.calculator01:03
tuxd3vgnarface, yeah I run that, but I will confirm tomorrow when reboot01:05
tuxd3vand then install it..01:05
specingtuxd3v: once you have Octave, you never go back01:06
specingbc, gcalc, $whatever all suck01:06
tuxd3vspecing, hehe01:06
tuxd3vOctave is in the scientific worl, maybe one of the best tools I have ever used01:07
specingI have a keyboard bind on ~, so my WM renders a terminal on the top half of my screen01:07
tuxd3vits superpowerfull01:07
specingsame terminal on all desktops01:07
specingand it runs octave-cli in tmux with a bunch of other stuff too01:07
tuxd3vI just use tilda01:07
tuxd3vbut tilda goes to 30-40MB of Ram...yeah01:08
tuxd3vdificult to digest..01:08
tuxd3vactually in i386 ascii version comes a qterminal tool01:09
tuxd3vthat permits at some extent to emulate what tilda does, with drop down terminals...01:09
tuxd3vQuake fps like terminal..01:09
tuxd3vvery nice.01:09
tuxd3vI don't know if there are some minimal version Tilda like01:10
tuxd3vconsuming lets imaginate-- 20MB would ve nice :)01:10
tuxd3vve -> be01:10
tuxd3vspecing, I even prefer Octave to Matlab to be honest, has I find some things only possible in Matlab when using certain scales, that you can to in Octave without restrictions, however, with speed penalizations... fft is one of them..01:13
specingnever really used Matlab01:17
specingexcept in school ... to run my Octave scripts ;P01:17
specinghad to dumb them down so MATLAB would understand them, even01:18
specingslowness is a problem, it has no JIT01:18
tuxd3vI had to translate Octave to MatLab code in the University, some years ago, because it was understood has "very rude" by the catedratic personnel, that a student decides to use a opensource tool, to do the Job, better done than the MatLab they were trying to "Sell" you..01:20
tuxd3vSo as a delivery method, I need to deliver in MatLab01:20
tuxd3vbut the work were done first in Octave and tested..01:21
tuxd3vMy Univesity has an agreement with MatLab..01:21
tuxd3vin the same way they had with Microsoft...puff01:21
DarwinElfand where can I download just the deboostrap .deb?01:27
tuxd3vDarwinElf, 'apt-get download deboostrap'01:29
gnarfaceDarwinElf: the repos are http so you can just use a web browser but this is easier^^^01:29
DarwinElfwell it's not on a Devuan system01:29
gnarfacethat should work on a debian system too if you point the sources.list at the devuan repos01:29
DarwinElf(see earlier discussion why I needed it separately on a Debian-based system)01:30
gnarfaceotherwise you're just gonna have to get a web browser up and dig through the repos manually01:30
DarwinElfso I can use Debian's/Kubuntu01:30
DarwinElf's and change the repository?01:31
gnarfaceyes, but Kubuntu doesn't belong to Debian01:31
DarwinElfit's probably the same package01:31
gnarfaceany Debian derivative with a compatible version of apt should work though01:31
gnarfacefor most the packages it is the same package, but for debootstrap the devuan one has been special historically.  i don't *think* the devuan-specific patches have been upstreamed, but i don't know.01:32
gnarfacewhat i thought i heard them saying was that someone tried to upstream the patches and found them already present in the upstream source, just disabled by commenting out01:32
DarwinElfwhen I saw a Devuan pkginfo website it said a Debian maintainer is obstructing the patches01:32
gnarface(which suggests that they're fully aware of the issue and are holding it in place on purpose)01:33
gnarfaceyea, that isn't the only case of obstruction01:33
gnarfacebut that is why i know the package isn't the same01:33
gnarface...unless that has changed recently01:33
gnarfacebut the devuan version of debootstrap should still work on debian afaik01:34
DarwinElfwhich debootstrap is best then?01:34
gnarfaceobviously the devuan one :)01:35
gnarfacethough afaik they're all basically identical except for that one patch01:35
gnarfaceand the patch might consist of one whole word01:36
gnarfaceor maybe a line01:36
gnarfaceit is likely you could edit it by hand01:36
gnarfacei could be wrong, but i think it's literally just a one-word line that includes "ascii" as a valid release name01:37
DarwinElfthe repository directory names make little sense compared to older POSIX-based OSes... having a lot of trouble finding any .debs...01:40
gnarfacehere, let me get that for you
JackFrostI hear mmdebstrap is cooler and faster, fwiw.01:43
gnarface(they're organized the same way as debian's repos)01:43
DarwinElfi found it01:45
DarwinElfwhat's mmdebootstrap?01:45
JackFrostA new tool for debootstrapping, it's supposed to be quite a lot faster than debootstrap itself, but not as portable (you need apt installed.)01:47
DarwinElfthe first page I found, the people didn't even use debootstrap.  If I was installing from a more powerful Devuan itself (to make package less poweful one can't) that'd be the way I do it.  The OSes I prefer using are so old they don't have a tool, you just do it yourself01:51
DarwinElf'first "example" page'01:51
DarwinElfguess I got it working though...01:53
DarwinElfthe packages don't seem to be named x86_64 though... maybe that's all that exists in this case anyway?01:54
DarwinElfi'm in the chroot but aptitude isn't finding libtls8.6 (or even 8.5)... which was found on my Devuan VPS...01:58
gnarfacedidn't you say you were targeting a i386 system?01:59
DarwinElfLoL, on the VPS, aptitude wasn't found (but that's fixed) but tls8.6 was01:59
DarwinElfnever said that01:59
gnarfaceoh, well either way it's amd64 here not x86_6401:59
gnarfacedon't get confused, that's for intel chips too still01:59
gnarfacethe chroot has it's own /etc/apt/sources.list file, so you'll probably want to copy the host one over it and then re-run "apt-get update" to be able to see the libtls versions you are expecting02:00
gnarface(you might need the bind mounts for that to work)02:01
gnarface(not sure)02:01
DarwinElfi don't even have a 386.  I might've had a '686' with about 128MB RAM but that was in the 1990s... just didn't need much RAM on this amd64 VPS02:02
* gnarface kept his 68602:03
DarwinElfi gave 686 to parents but later kept my 786 (no ISA after that,)  Okay, I copied /etc/apt/sources.list from the VPS to my PC's chroot, did 'apt-get update' but it's still not finding libtls*...02:04
gnarfaceyour sources.list might be wrong02:06
gnarfaceyou should see libtlsh-dev and libtlsh002:06
gnarfacethey're in debian and devuan02:06
gnarfaceif you're looking for some other libtls* it's just not there02:07
DarwinElfi see those, but I don't need those.  I need libtls8.602:07
gnarfaceit doesn't appear to be in Debian, either02:07
gnarfacei remember it, but i don't know what happened to it02:07
gnarfaceseems to be gone from all releases02:07
DarwinElfmaybe I installed that on a different server and this is what I need then...02:08
DarwinElfi'll try it02:08
gnarfacehmm, i'm not sure though02:08
* tuxd3v also keep close to his chest, his 68602:08
DarwinElfoops.  I think it was libtcl8.602:08
gnarfacethe description "fuzzy hashing library" doesn't seem related to libtls but i don't know what really happened to libtls02:09
gnarfaceah, libtcl has even less in common with libtls02:09
gnarfacelibtcl is a gui toolkit02:10
gnarfacea old one02:10
DarwinElfyeah, I just confused it with tcltls02:10
gnarfaceand it is definitely present, both 8.5 and 8.6 i'm seeing actually02:10
bsd4mefsmithred: if you're here, I was able to get X running and also got wifi working :)02:14
fsmithredcool. What did you have to do? (in 25 words or less)02:15
* tuxd3v cannot advise, since he always use 25 * 10, unfortunately02:17
DarwinElfcmake works fine on my VPS but in the chroot (despite being installed) is saying it can't find CMAKE_CXX_COMPILER... so I set that ('root@cosmos:~/znc-1.7.4/build# echo $CMAKE_CXX_COMPILER'--'/usr/bin/cmake') and it's still saying the same thing... is this because I ended up with i386 instead of amd64 I needed, somehow?02:17
bsd4meLol, added a conf file to /etc/X11/xorg.d for and chip, then found out that rfkill was network problem, so downloaded that, and unblocked wlan02:17
bsd4meWas that over 25???  :D02:18
fsmithredI'm not counting02:18
bsd4meYep, looks pretty good02:18
fsmithredlooks ok02:18
bsd4meSo now to start adding programs. Thanks!02:18
fsmithredI'm glad it worked out02:19
bsd4meMe too. Bit of frustration, but got it :)02:19
tuxd3vfsmithred, does you know( out of your head),  what is the default calculator for the i386 ascii iso?02:21
tuxd3vI don't find one installed, but I wanted the install the same that is in amd64 iso02:21
fsmithredthe live isos should be the same02:22
tuxd3vI have used the cd nr.102:22
fsmithredI don't know if xfce has a calculator. I just use xcalc02:22
JackFrostIt doesn't, either mate-calc or gnome-calculator are likely candidates.02:22
fsmithredxcalc might already be installed. I think it comes with x11-utils02:23
tuxd3vthanks a lot, found another calculator,02:24
tuxd3vyes indeed is comes installed :)02:24
fsmithredtuxd3v, which one?02:24
tuxd3vit doesn't have decimal/hexadecimal/binary conversions but its very nice :)02:24
tuxd3vits a nice tool02:25
tuxd3vwill createa xcalc.desktop file for it :)02:26
tuxd3vcreatea -> create02:26
tuxd3vfsmithred, thanks!02:30
tuxd3vfsmithred, does you use any preconfigured "theme" for xcalc ?03:17
tuxd3vcolors, size, etc03:17
fsmithredtuxd3v, no themes here.03:45
pencilandpaperI tell you a bummer, I was going to try and check out some other DE's..and can't install them since I ugraded.  I did it to myself though. :)03:46
pencilandpaperIt could be worse, but a bummer indeed. :)03:47
fsmithredupgraded to what?03:47
fsmithredThey are all in beowulf03:47
pencilandpaperI'm on chimera/ceres.03:47
fsmithredoh, good luck03:48
pencilandpaperchimaera *03:48
pencilandpaperI know right. lol03:48
pencilandpaperI run Xfce by default, so its all good there.03:49
pencilandpaperI can't wait for 4.14 to be available.03:49
fsmithredI think all of it except xfce4-session is in ceres03:50
pencilandpaperYeah, thats what I think I saw as well.03:50
fsmithredmy ceres xfce get big black zones at the top of the screen03:51
fsmithredI haven't investigated to figure out the cause. It's in a VM, and I don't use it.03:51
pencilandpaperMine doesn't have that issue..but my wallpaper is black.  One sec.03:52
pencilandpaperYeah, I don't have that issue over this way.03:53
pencilandpaperI run this as my daily OS pretty much, but I do have something else installed just in case..and do make snapshots as well.03:53
pencilandpaperRunning in a VM is sometimes a lot different than running on the host system though fsmithred , I have noticed that.03:55
tuxd3vfsmithred, thanks, the standard there is nice for someone that sees very well, but not otherwise :)04:07
tuxd3vI discovered that is possible to tune it almost in a "infinite way" :904:07
gnarfacepencilandpaper: enlightenment should be working in ceres, though i've only managed to prove it with nvidia binary drivers though so ymmv04:13
gnarfacepencilandpaper: (e23)04:14
pencilandpaperNice gnarface , thanks.  I used to run enlightenment a lot actually.  Just to keep checking it out.04:14
pencilandpaperI haven't used it in a good while though.04:14
gnarfacepencilandpaper: i tried afterstep, blackbox and windowlab recently and they were all functioning too04:15
pencilandpaperI wonder if Openbox is..I may check it out just to see.04:18
onefangIt's my turn to ask for help.  I'm hoping someone here can help with network bridging.  I'm trying to bridge eth0 to br0, in Devuan ASCII, so I can later use that for qemu.  But I get this bit of silliness when I bring up br0 -
furrywolfLOL.  something does not know what comments are.05:13
onefangNote the names of the interfaces it says don't exist.  Spells out what looks like a shell comment.  I have searched my entire operating system, can't find that comment anywhere.05:13
onefangCan't find anything remotely useful on the web.05:13
furrywolfgrep -R "replace with your actual interface" /etc/*05:13
onefangLike I said, can't find that phrase on my operating system to replace it.  ;-P05:14
onefangNot in /etc, not in usr, not in var, not in boot, not in lib, ....05:14
onefangI'm done pulling out hair over this, I only have one left before I start on my beard.05:15
onefangSo in desperation, I'm doing something I very rarely need to do, ask for help05:17
furrywolfso you tried a grep -iR on those locations?05:18
onefangYes, for the third time, I searched everywhere.  lol05:19
furrywolfok, I don't know what you considered searching.  :P05:20
furrywolfwhat did you run that gave that?05:22
onefangI setup the br0 interface in /etc/network/interfaces, disabled the interface it bridges to, then I get that on boot and ifup br0.05:23
* furrywolf can't even figure out what gives the does not exist message in that format05:26
tuxd3vfurrywolf, it should be a for cycle05:27
furrywolfand why is it ifdowning it when you ifup it, anyway?  lol05:27
tuxd3vit his reading one line word by word, and for each one tries to find the network name05:28
onefangI figured that much.05:29
furrywolfI would say it's a shell script doing a bad job parsing another shell script05:29
furrywolfor shell-like config file05:29
onefangI think I just figured it out.  Now to reboot to be sure.  BRB05:30
furrywolfwe may have different software installed, or versions or something...05:32
furrywolfeven though this box is also ascii05:32
furrywolfand now they have no network at all?  :)05:40
furrywolfonefang:  ... and then you had no network at all?  :)05:54
onefangAlmost there, still gotta sort out - "RTNETLINK answers: Invalid argument"  Which argument?05:54
furrywolfso where was that comment and what was trying to parse it?05:55
onefangNah, Internet is on a different interface, I'm experimenting with an internal network, until I get it sorted out.05:55
onefang/etc/network/interfaces doesn't allow end of line comments, only comments on their own line.  I had copied "bridge_ports eth0    # replace eth0 with your actual interface name" from a web site, and didn't think that "# replace with your actual interface name" might have included a real interface name that did exist when I was searching for it, coz "# replace with your actual interface name" sounds like a v05:58
onefangalid English comment to me.05:58
onefangAnd it's bridge-utils that was doing the dead I think.05:59
furrywolfah.  and that explains why the searches I did, which included substrings just in case it was broken up somehow, didn't find it, because I don't have lines copies from that web page.  lol05:59
* onefang glues- his hair back on and gets on with this project.05:59
furrywolfI was even doing multi-line greps in case there was a newline in it or something.  lol06:00
onefangAs is often the case, explaining the tricky problems to someone helps.  B-)06:01
furrywolfI should have considered that you might have entered that comment yourself and didn't remember it.  I did not consider this.  :P06:02
onefangI've had engineers explaining stuff to me that I don't understand for exactly that reason, and half way through they stop and go "Ohh, that's what I did wrong".06:02
furrywolfand then I started running /*bin /usr/*bin through strings and grepping that, in case it had ended up compiled into something...  lol06:04
onefangTime for another reboot or three to track down "RTNETLINK answers: Invalid argument"06:05
furrywolfI'm off to bed myself.06:05
onefang"RTNETLINK answers: Invalid argument" it was the gateway argument, removed it, no more error messages, and it works.  It selected the correct gateway by itself.  B-)07:41
DarwinElfafter I compile a package in a chroot, how do I make the .deb (i.e., it's for a different system that wasn't powerful enough to compile it but is powerful enough to run it)08:21
joshbowyercouldnt get access to the devuan-dev but ive identified an issue in the battery/power system in cinnamon19:05
joshbowyerwith upowerglib19:05
joshbowyernot sure if there are any devs who would like to see my testing19:06
DarwinElfis there a HOWTO/tutorial to use equivs to build package (just for personal usage? I just need to make it for a server not powerful enough to build it, but I think can run it)20:16

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