freenode/#devuan/ Monday, 2019-02-18

furrywolfso, this isn't something devuan caused, but it sure would be nice if we fixed it...05:41
furrywolfmenus are utterly fucking broken in ascii vs previous versions.05:41
furrywolfhaving half the packages use the nice, working, properly organized debian menu system, and half using the new, broken, utterly shittily organized new menu system, means you have to look about six places to find where programs ended up when you installed their packages, if anywhere.05:42
furrywolflike, why the fuck is freecad under "graphics", oregano under "education" (wtf?), and other idiocy with the new menu system (does it not have supmenus?  did something decide more than ten categories would be too confusing?), while other things are only in the old menu system?05:45
furrywolfwindow managers that only use one of the two menu systems end up only showing half your programs05:46
furrywolfcan we please get rid of the worthless new menu system and stick everything back into the debian menu system?  heh05:51
furrywolfand, after finally finding an answer googling...  there's only ten categories because freedesktop declared there should only be ten categories.05:53
furrywolfwhy the bloody fuck do we put up with fucking anything they do?05:53
rrqmmm I'm not a freedesktop fan, but going to their latest spec, I found 13 main categories, 120 or so 'additional categories' and 4 'reserved categories'. https://specifications.freedesktop.org/menu-spec/latest... maybe that's an old spec of course.06:21
furrywolfthere's only ten...  for examle, video and audio are only used if you dont use audio and video, etc...  and debian of course went for the least-descriptive set possible.  debian only uses the topmost ten, absolutely no subcategories or anything else.06:22
furrywolfwith the old debian menu system, cad software might be under Science->Engineering or Science->Electronics (depending on the program's focus)...  while under the new system, they're randomly put into "Graphics" or "Education".06:24
rrqyes, I agree about rather following debuan-menu.. https://www.debian.org/doc/packaging-manuals/menu.html06:24
furrywolfregardless of the technical benefits of the menu system, this new cram-everything-into-dictated-categories total mess is stupid.06:28
Achyllescan devuan run on risc-V?12:43
AchyllesOr is it to early? Has anyone tested this?12:44
va7lnxAchylles: what system use that arch?12:53
r3bootAchylles: Debian does seem to support risc-v, e_noclue as to how much of this Devuan has imported (https://wiki.debian.org/RISC-V)12:59
Achyllesr3boot, I know about debian...13:01
AchyllesBut, I am interested in devuan itself13:02
AchyllesThus my question if anyone has tested devuan in risc-v arch...13:02
r3boot(I dont know if the URL is used, but the cert for packages.devuan.org has expired)13:06
r3bootAchylles: I did a quick check for ISO's / package repo's. It seems that devuan only does i386 and amd64 atm13:07
r3bootSo .. sounds like a nice project which can be picked up :)13:08
Achyllesr3boot, if I had the know-how I would pick that up. Perhaps, someone else...13:13
AchyllesSince devuan is a great distro and on risc-V should attract more users...13:14
r3bootMja, that's part of running a new architecture, making sure that stuff gets ported so over time it can become mainstream13:14
r3bootif no-one does the porting, it simply wont happen13:14
r3boot(multiple good platforms have died that way btw)13:14
r3bootnofi or anything, just a general observation :)13:14
r3bootYou could try to bootstrap devuan on risc-v using debian as a base, while following the LFS methodology of getting it ported13:16
Glatsits possible to avoid ssh agent and import the key every time you open a terminal?17:33
Glatsin bash17:33
djphGlats: what do you mean? like it asks you _every_ time you ssh somewhere?18:10
Glatsdjph: look i found this https://github.com/wwalker/ssh-find-agent18:12
Glatsfor my purpose18:13
Glatsbut i dont wanna import that shell18:13
Glatsi wanna something simple18:13
djphI still don't understand what you're asking18:13
Glatsok lemme exaplain18:14
Glatswhen you ran eval $(ssh-agent -s)18:14
djphI don't use ssh-agent ...18:14
Glatsoh18:14
Glatsok18:14
Glatswhat do you use?18:14
djphfor the hosts that don't use my main key, have them defined in .ssh/config18:15
djphtype the password every time18:15
Glatsyeah18:15
Glatsi dont wanna do that18:16
fsmithredI see Agent pid ###18:16
fsmithredyou can make a key with no password18:16
Glatslook http://blog.joncairns.com/2013/12/understanding-ssh-agent-and-ssh-add/18:17
Glatsmy idea is to use the same agent across terminals18:17
fsmithredand you want to do that without running ssh-add?18:20
Glatsno18:20
Glatsyou cant18:20
fsmithredGlats, do you have the same problem as the author? I don't.18:20
fsmithredI run ssh-add once, and I can use any terminal until I log out of the desktop.18:21
Glatsi think is not optimized18:22
Glatsyou have to run ssh-agent then run ssh-add18:22
fsmithredoh, ssh-agent starts with the desktop18:22
Glatsoh18:23
Glatsok18:23
fsmithredI don't actually understand the author's problem18:23
Glatshe put in .bashrc18:23
Glatsso every time he open a terminal18:23
fsmithredhe says, "the bottom line is that we need to keep track of our agent's file socket to be able to be able to remember the passphrases for our keys across multiple shell sessions."18:23
fsmithredand I have no idea what he's talking about18:23
Glatsyeah. but if you dont have a DE to handle your startup applications18:24
Glatsyou put ssh-agent into .bashrc18:24
fsmithredoh, ok18:24
Glatsso every time you open a terminal the ssh-agent will be executed18:24
Glatsok18:24
fsmithredI just put -i on the command line in those cases18:25
Glatsso you put the agent into the startup application18:25
Glatsalongside ssh right?18:25
Glatslike18:25
fsmithredyes, ssh -i .ssh/id.whatever user@host18:26
Glatsssh -i keyring user@ip18:26
Glatsyeah18:26
Glatsok18:26
Glatsyeah. thats another way18:26
Glatsfsmithred: but if you use git?18:29
Glatsyou cant pass -i option18:29
Glatsso thats why i need the ssh-agent18:29
Glats(git through ssh)18:29
fsmithredthere must be some way to put that option into git18:30
fsmithredin a config file. But that's a guess.18:30
fsmithredso yeah, I understand the problem now18:30
Glatsno. it doesnt18:30
Glatsactually they tell you to use the agent hahaha18:31
fsmithredI noticed git's also unhappy if I'm connected by ssh to the machine that is communicating with gitlab. It won't let me push.18:31
Leanderwhat about if you use your .ssh/config for the git-specific options?18:32
Glatslook18:32
Glatshttps://unix.stackexchange.com/a/13211718:32
Glatsnow i get it18:33
Glats.bashrc *always* load the environment when you open a new terminal18:33
LeanderI don't have the example at hand, but I have two different github accounts, and in order to choose one or the other, I use machine names like github-account1 and github-account2 (in the .git/config file) which correspond to github-account1 and github-account2 entries in .ssh/config18:38
Glatsok18:38
Glatscould be a nice aproach18:38
Glatshttps://build-me-the-docs-please.readthedocs.io/en/latest/Using_Git/SetUpSSHForGit.html18:40
DonkeyHoteiSSH_AUTH_SOCK= ssh foo@bar18:41
Glatsbut my next aproach is to take all my keys saved it in ~/.ssh/ and add it in the agent18:43
Glatswith a loop or something18:43
Glatsand with ssh-add -l you can get every key loaded and you cant avoid to load twice the samekey18:44
Glatss/samekey/same key/18:44
Glatshttps://gist.github.com/glats/c0d6107218b6af9c7252bf54f939a32218:54
Glatsfinally :P18:54
furrywolfblarg, this whole menu thing is pissing me off.  I spent three hours reading the discussion on it, and it's all the exact same arguments that got us systemd.18:59
furrywolf"only 20% of people still use it, and they should get with the program" is _not_ how open-source decisions should be made.19:00
iovecmeanwhile https://seclists.org/oss-sec/2019/q1/14019:00
furrywolfnor is "another major distro has switched to it, so we should too"19:00
iovecaka you never listened to us when we said PID 1 should be simple19:00
furrywolfnor is "everyone refusing to switch to something newer is obviously a luddite moron stuck in their ways and refusing to accept any kind of change"19:01

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