freenode/#devuan/ Saturday, 2020-07-25

* kreyren just came to complain with his script https://i.imgur.com/LkfYUH1.png blaming devuan for making lsb_release -cs to return 'n/a' and not providing a docker image02:23
kreyren:C02:23
buZz:)02:24
buZzbuzz@bz-x230:~$ lsb_release -cs02:24
buZzbeowulf02:24
kreyrenthis is on chimaera02:25
buZzi'm sure that'll be fixed once its somewhat targetting users ;)02:25
kreyrenkreyren@dreamon:~$ cat /etc/os-release | grep ^ID\=02:25
kreyrenID=devuan02:25
kreyrenkreyren@dreamon:~$ lsb_release -cs02:25
kreyrenn/a02:25
kreyrenbuZz, ik but that ain't preventing me from complaining! :p02:26
buZzhehe02:27
buZzwell you could improve it ;)02:27
kreyrenand like i can make the dockerimage it's just running that debian thing that generates the userland and adding it as `ADD path/to/archive` >.>02:27
kreyrenbut that won't make it to work as `FROM devuan/chimaera` unless devuan publishes it~02:27
kreyrenOr like can i join devuan team to be able to fix these things02:31
buZzyou totally can02:32
kreyrenhow02:32
buZzthere's #devuan-dev02:32
buZzjoin there and ask02:32
kreyrenk will do tomorrow bcs i can barelly see now from exhaustion~02:32
buZznp :) welcome02:32
* kreyren goes to sleep02:32
buZznn02:33
coniferhi! what is the recommended way of setting up /opt partition? i always had it sitting unused on a tiny root, but it turned out electron apps tend to get installed there02:35
buZzi dont know, i dont use a /opt or electron apps02:36
coniferand each is basically an extended chromium, so they take 200-300MB each and i ended up mounting /opt on /usr02:36
coniferbut it feels like a makeshift solution and i don't know what is the proper way to handle it when partitioning the drive02:40
golinuxYou can't just install in /home?02:40
golinuxI have browers there that are quite happy02:41
conifercan i pass some parameter to make them install where i want them instead of their default location?02:43
coniferok, i read the dpkg man so i learned how to do it with standalone .deb file, but what if i add a repository to sources.list and install with apt?02:53
coniferbtw, is installing in /home better than in /usr?02:54
djphFSVO "better"02:56
buZzimho electron is the makeshift solution02:58
buZz'one day i'll learn to code but today i'll just wrap this website up with a whole browser!'02:58
buZz'LOOK MA, I'M MAKIN APPS!'02:58
coniferyeah, i know02:58
coniferbut i wanted to try out some new stuff, and when their only destkop clients are electron then i have no other choice03:00
coniferanyway, what do people usually do with /opt on desktop systems? leave it on root and not use it? put it on separate partition? put in on /usr?03:25
coniferbefore i started using linux i read some articles about partitioning the drive and if they mentioned opt they claimed it probably won't be used at all, so i never cared about it and had no trouble with it03:27
fsmithredseparate /home and everything else in the root partition is very common03:30
fsmithredseparate /boot if you use encryption03:31
fsmithredsometime separate /var03:32
coniferi usually do separate boot, home, usr, var, tmp, so i was really surprised when all i needed to clutter up root anyway was installing an app...03:42
yetiwith many partitions the free space always is where I dont need it...03:50
roo^y48hrs after updating a new install of Beowulf with it's packages, I move mouse to wake screen from turning it off with xset dpms force off. System appears to have crashed, as screen is black & only showing a underscore '_' I'd quit firefox beforehand, to ease resources while at idle ..maybe I should find out which GPU driver it's using, & try the other one11:22
roo^yKeyboard couldn't even light up Caps lock & Num lock lights again, like it was unplugged ..unless it's a CPU crash11:29
gnarfaceroo^y: that would be a good point to attempt to connect to it over the network by ssh, or at least ping it12:07
roo^yyep, I happen to have a identical spare one, I should learn how to do that!12:25
gnarfaceroo^y: it's actually really easy13:45
gnarfaceroo^y: "apt-get install openssh-server" ahead of time13:46
roo^ysweet :) will do13:46
gnarfaceroo^y: then from the other machine you can connect with "ssh user@hostname" (it will prompt you for the remote user's password by default, you can increase security later)13:47
roo^yi understand13:47
gnarfaceif the user name is the same, you don't have to specify the user@ part13:50
gnarfaceand obviously if you don't have hostnames you can use ip addresses instead13:50
roo^yinstall openssh-server on other machine too? ..or no need, just use terminal?13:50
gnarfacethe client server only needs openssh-client, which will not include openssh-server13:51
gnarfacethat was confusing, sorry, the client machine i mean13:51
roo^ygot it13:51
gnarfaceany machine can have both of course safely, if you know what you're doing13:52
ham5urgIs there any need to control the chain of blocksizes of HD->Partitions->RAID->LVM?14:08
ham5urgHD->Partitions->RAID->LVM->FS14:09
gnarfaceit might matter14:10
ham5urgHow do I show/check all these different blocksizes?14:11
ham5urgAs far as HDs and partitions I guess I can't configure anything as there are no blocks.14:14
ham5urgOnly sectors of 512byte.14:16
ham5urgbut fdisks "I/O size (minimum/optimal):" is sometimes 4096, sometimes 512 (HD, SSD). So I guess this should be the blocksize.14:19
gnarfacecheck with hdparm -I?14:19
ham5urglsblk -o NAME,PHY-SeC14:22
gnarfaceyou're supposed to set the stripe sizes to some multiple of the physical block sizes and the filesystem block sizes but i don't know the exact math to get an optimal size14:36
gnarfacei'm sure you could look it up somewhere...14:37
gnarfacealso note that some drives have different logical and physical block sizes14:39
gnarfacesometimes it matters14:39
gnarfacesometimes it might be raid controller specific14:56
ham5urgtrying to use mdraid. just ripped off some HP-raid-controller.15:00
ham5urgtoo unflexible and unreliable these controllers. I'll go with a devuan-raid-box15:01
ham5urgdevuan-mdraid-box15:01
ham5urghd->partition->mdraid->logical-volume are all 512 in my case. ext4 via tune2fs shows 4096. I assume that's fair as it is a multiple of 8.15:04
gnarfaceyea maybe15:29
gnarfacei was thinking more like 64k instead of 4k but maybe that would be for hardware raid15:29
gnarfacei really don't know though15:29
ham5urgyou think a ext4 blocksize of 64k instead of 4k will boost the performance (even if some space is lost due to files <64k)?15:46
ham5urgworth a try15:46
gnarfaceham5urg: no, not of the filesystem... of the raid stripes15:48
gnarfaceham5urg: leave the filesystem block size to match the physical block size of the disk15:49
ham5urgso down to 512byte instead of 4k (in my case). Here's a screenshot of a VM where I test things. https://pasteboard.co/Jjici4f.png15:56
gnarfacethat won't do me any good and i'm not clicking on it anyway15:58
gnarfacei know you can get the physical and logical size of the disk itself if you run hdparm -I on it15:59
gnarfacebut that would have to be in the host system15:59
gnarfacein a VM all bets are off15:59
ham5urgI understand15:59
ham5urghdparm -I /dev/nvme0n116:01
ham5urgHDIO_DRIVE_CMD(identify) failed: Inappropriate ioctl for device16:01
ham5urgI have to look why is that16:01
gnarfacetry it just on /dev/nvme016:01
gnarfacealso you have to run it as root16:01
gnarfaceeverything used to be 512 bytes physical and logical16:02
ham5urgthe same problem occurs16:02
gnarfacelately 1k and 4k are becoming more common16:02
ham5urgmakes sense16:02
gnarfacenvme is something new so maybe hdparm doesn't work on it, i guess i was expecting a sata drive16:02
ham5urglsblk -o NAME,PHY-SeC16:03
ham5urglooks good16:03
gnarfacei've seen some drives lately with 4k physical sectors but 512b logical sectors16:03
gnarfacewhich is super annoying because then you have to make a choice between optimal space usage and optimal speed16:04
gnarfaceham5urg: after checking the man page for lsblk, i see that you actually want to look at: "lsblk -o NAME,PHY-SEC,LOG-SEC"16:06
gnarfaceif LOG-SEC is smaller then you can get a bit more space from using that for the filesystem size instead, but there will be some extra overhead16:07
ham5urgI understand16:45
ham5urgnvme0n1         512     51216:46
ham5urgWhy uses mkfs.ext4 4kb blocksize and not the blocksize of the device? E.g. 512b. Maybe not much space-loss but increase of speed.16:50
gnarfacei didn't advise using 4k block sizes with that disk, i don't think that's right, not sure though...16:51
gnarfacebut i was just trying to warn you about stuff like this, look: https://paste.debian.net/1157768/16:53
gnarfacefor the raid stripes though i believe it would be different, something higher, mabye between 8k and 64k16:54
ham5urgUhh, I will avoid such disks if possible.16:54
ham5urgThat's more complex stuff than i knew. Thanks for your infos16:55
ham5urgFound this, now I understand: https://www.linuxpromagazine.com/Issues/2009/108/RAID-Performance17:23
ham5urgWhy so many examples do use a chunk size of 64?17:25
gnarfaceham5urg: i think it's a common default for a lot of popular hardware-accelerated raid controllers17:31
gnarfaceham5urg: mdraid will probably be less picky but i would expect also slower, so i'd guess you'd want smaller stripe sizes but i'm not sure exactly what17:32
gnarfaceham5urg: i'm guessing there's still some tradeoff but it won't be as much of a stair-step graph17:33
gnarfaceham5urg: and you might also want to consider what type of data you'll be storing17:34
WafficusHi there, I'm running Virtualbox in a Windows 10 host, and Devuan as the guest22:00
WafficusI tried enabling Dvice > Insert Guest Additions CD image22:00
Wafficusbut how do I enable the actual resolution options?22:00
WafficusI ask because I'm able to to select multiple resolution options under View > Virtual Screen 1 > "Resize to" etc choices22:01
Wafficusbut when I do so, nothing happens22:01
gnarfaceWafficus: not sure, maybe try restarting the login manager or xorg whichever is running at that moment22:17
gnarfaceWafficus: alternately, try setting it before the guest starts22:18
golinuxI am about to dump VB for qemu22:18
golinuxNot really relevant except that I've had it with VB "quirks"22:18
gnarfacei hear a lot about them22:19
gnarfacethe only problem with qemu as i see it is that it's not as easy to learn22:19
gnarfaceit is very flexible though22:19
Wafficusgot it, had to follow this guide22:22
Wafficushttps://linuxize.com/post/how-to-install-virtualbox-guest-additions-on-debian-10/22:22
WafficusI had to mount the CD and then run the related .run file to install it22:22
Wafficusthen I had to use the Settings > Display > Graphics Controller: 'VMSVGA' option22:23
Wafficusnow I'm able to resize it no probelm22:23
gnarfaceah, cool22:23

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